Nahverteidigungswaffe

[Butcher]

Basically the Nahverteidigungswaffe is a 92mm mortar on the turret of panthers/tigers which can be used to fire off smoke rounds like the M4. I am curious since we don't have Smoke rounds in the Panther, so why do we not have the smoke/HE mortars?

Obviously the HE rounds might not be much use unless its to stop troops from entering a map room, and really not as important as having smoke.

Info from Wiki:

The Nahverteidigungswaffe was a smoke candle discharger for German panzers which could also be used as a close defense weapon to combat close assaulting infantry. It was a 92mm rotating launcher for smoke candles, mounted in the roof of the turret or superstructure, which also allowed the occupants to fire a flare pistol through it. The flare pistol could fire flares, smoke rounds or small calibre fragmentation grenades.
Other methods of close defense involved attaching electrically fired s-mine launchers at the four corners of the tank, or pistol ports.

[Butcher]

Some Photos:

[Rino]

     Apparently even T-34s had them 

[Tyrannis]

Basically the Nahverteidigungswaffe is a 92mm mortar on the turret of panthers/tigers which can be used to fire off smoke rounds like the M4. I am curious since we don't have Smoke rounds in the Panther, so why do we not have the smoke/HE mortars?

Obviously the HE rounds might not be much use unless its to stop troops from entering a map room, and really not as important as having smoke.

Info from Wiki:

The Nahverteidigungswaffe was a smoke candle discharger for German panzers which could also be used as a close defense weapon to combat close assaulting infantry. It was a 92mm rotating launcher for smoke candles, mounted in the roof of the turret or superstructure, which also allowed the occupants to fire a flare pistol through it. The flare pistol could fire flares, smoke rounds or small calibre fragmentation grenades.
Other methods of close defense involved attaching electrically fired s-mine launchers at the four corners of the tank, or pistol ports.

Theres your answer why we dont have it. we have no infantry that attacks tanks, like what these candles were designed to do. and tanks already come with smoke shots (which arent used very effectively),.

[Butcher]

Theres your answer why we dont have it. we have no infantry that attacks tanks, like what these candles were designed to do. and tanks already come with smoke shots (which arent used very effectively),.

Panther has no smoke rounds in game which is why I ask, also the Nahverteidigungswaffe  is standard issue on german tanks past '43 so why not make it historically correct? <S>

[Butcher]

     Apparently even T-34s had them 

Yes the one photo is a T-34 designed to be a tiger, however even the mock ups have the Nahverteidigungswaffe

[Tyrannis]

Panther has no smoke rounds in game which is why I ask, also the Nahverteidigungswaffe  is standard issue on german tanks past '43 so why not make it historically correct? <S>

because there is nothing in the game to warrent them being used in the historical way they were.

sure, most of the time things arent used in game how they were in real life but there's still that reason in the game to use them historically right.

like we have lanc-stukas. but we also have citys. which warrent the lancs to be the high-altitude heavy bombers they were in the war.


without any assaulting infantry, there is no historical role for these tubes to fill.

[Krupinski]

So that's why we have smoke rounds in most of the tanks? Because they're currently useless in AH?

[Ack-Ack]

Theres your answer why we dont have it. we have no infantry that attacks tanks, like what these candles were designed to do. and tanks already come with smoke shots (which arent used very effectively),.

You didn't read what he read very well, or at least failed to comprehend it. 

Info from Wiki:

The Nahverteidigungswaffe was a smoke candle discharger for German panzers which could also be used as a close defense weapon to combat close assaulting infantry.

I emphasized the part you failed to comprehend in Butcher's original post.  As you can see, it wasn't primarily a close defense system, it could be used as such but it's primary purpose was to fire off smoke candles.

because there is nothing in the game to warrent them being used in the historical way they were.


without any assaulting infantry, there is no historical role for these tubes to fill.

Having them on German tanks would be historically accurate, as well as their use in game.

The Wurfbecher system that was previously used was mounted on the outside of the turret and when struck by small arms fire (or any other fire for that matter I would guess), crews could sometimes become incapacitated from their own smoke candles.  This led to the Nahverteidigungswaffe being developed to help protect the tank crews.

This is what the Wurfbecher system looked like.


The Nahverteidigungswaffe was moved inside of the turret and protected the crews from being incapacitated as was possible with the old Wurfbecher system. 



Since the primary use was to provide a smoke screen to obscure the tank, it is something that should be added to the German tanks that had it (first appeared in 1944).  Even on the German tanks that didn't have it, they should have the old Wurfbecher system to provide them with the ability to obscure themselves with a smoke screen.


ack-ack

[Big Rat]

+1 to this, there are times when a little smoke makes all the difference in getting you out of a bad situation.  There was a case where the close defence mortars were used to destroy an enemy tank.  I believe it was Ernst Barkmann, who destroyed a Sherman that happened to be passing him on a road in the middle of the night that had it's commanders hatch open.  Not that it's applicable in this game, but still interesting trivia.

 
BigRat

[iron650]

+1

[B-17]

Wow... what a mouthful.

[lyric1]

 

[Butcher]

+1 to this, there are times when a little smoke makes all the difference in getting you out of a bad situation.  There was a case where the close defence mortars were used to destroy an enemy tank.  I believe it was Ernst Barkmann, who destroyed a Sherman that happened to be passing him on a road in the middle of the night that had it's commanders hatch open.  Not that it's applicable in this game, but still interesting trivia.

 
BigRat

What puzzles me is the M4 was designed (in game last) and included smoke launchers, perhaps it was overlooked to give the Panther/Tiger smoke rounds also.

I understand there is a totally different setup here also, the Tiger/Panther smoke rounds are a burst of smoke in the air rather then a "Shell" that bursts in the ground and lets out a long drawn smoke as we are used to seeing in the Panzer 4 (or M4 however I am not sure if this is correct as I haven't seen live smoke fired from an M4 before).

Overall, it is something that will most likely be over looked, however keep in mind with Aces High which is ever so expanding, it would be nice to upgrade the tanks as much as some of the other things in the game get upgraded (even if adding proper smoke is on the bottom of the list!)