Author Topic: Whats your guess?  (Read 4284 times)

Offline Nutzoid

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #60 on: July 28, 2011, 12:07:49 PM »
Well actually, I really would like to see the ME410,HE219 and the HE129 to pretty much round out the LW plane set. The HE111 would also be a welcomed addition. If there is an update in store for the JU87, then I would like to see the G2 version, the "Kannon Vogel"  >sp<.

Just my .02.


Nutz

Mistakenly referred to the 129 as HE129 when it should have been the HS129, manufactured by Henschel Flugzeugwerke AG.

Nutz
C co. 1st Bn 7 CAV 1st Cav Div  " Garry Owen"

Offline Krusty

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #61 on: July 28, 2011, 12:19:29 PM »
Meh.. the Hs129 was a 1940 design that, through a quirk in the system surrounding it and the needs of the time, was kept into production almost unchanged until 1944. A very small number were made, even with such a long production run. Most had French-built engines, so the production was no strain on the limited engine production the Germans had.

Further, it was too severely underpowered, even without the one load that would be useful in AH. The big tank busting gun. WITH that gun it could barely fly a few thousand feet off the ground.

The first model carried 2x 20mm, 2x 7mm, and a whopping load of 4x50kg under the center.

A Bf109E-4 could boast the same.

The later models weren't much better. Minor changes with fuel systems, radio masts, etc.

The only real differences were the giant guns strapped under the middle. They started with the Mk101 30mm. This was eventually replaced with the Mk103. The ammo was the same but it fired faster. Then because in 1942 these weren't as effective against Soviet tanks, they started trying larger guns. They tried the big Bk3.7, same as on the Ju-87. It carried more ammo but very few ever received this. Instead they then tried the PAK 40, a 7.5cm gun in a gigantic pod. It was almost suicidal to try flying the aircraft, let alone attacking anything with that weight onboard. However only about 25 were built before production was finally shut down. How many ever saw combat is debatable.

In short, it was a flop of a ride. Even in 1940. The design remained almost unchanged until 1944, with no performance gains. The 30mm guns wouldn't do much damage to half the tanks in AH currently, and the bigger guns almost never saw combat/production so they wouldn't be valid in AH.

No need, no use, no benefit. Why add a Hs129?

Offline Slade

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #62 on: July 28, 2011, 12:25:35 PM »
Quote
No more tanks please. More A/C 

+1
-- Flying as X15 --

Offline TonyJoey

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #63 on: July 28, 2011, 01:10:03 PM »
The B26 or Lanc are my geuss for the next updated.

Offline Nutzoid

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #64 on: July 28, 2011, 01:18:37 PM »
Yeah I think your right Krusty. I should have checked the performance stats a little closer. I thought maybe it would have compared favorably with the IL2, (maybe does, maybe not) and would have given us another ground attack/close air support option. Oh well, I'll still wish for the HE219 and the ME410.


Nutz
C co. 1st Bn 7 CAV 1st Cav Div  " Garry Owen"

Offline JOACH1M

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #65 on: July 28, 2011, 02:49:30 PM »
Yeah I think your right Krusty.
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Offline MarineUS

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #66 on: July 28, 2011, 04:02:21 PM »
C130  :noid
I seen it >.>;
:bolt:
Like, ya know, when that thing that makes you move, it has pistons and things, When your thingamajigy is providing power, you do not hear other peoples thingamajig when they are providing power.

HiTech

Offline Krusty

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #67 on: July 28, 2011, 04:03:32 PM »
Oh well, I'll still wish for the HE219 and the ME410.

Might want to check on the He219 a bit too....  :devil

But I'm all for the Me410!

Offline Nutzoid

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #68 on: July 28, 2011, 04:13:17 PM »
Might want to check on the He219 a bit too....  :devil

But I'm all for the Me410!
Why? The 219 would be a whoot!

Nutz
C co. 1st Bn 7 CAV 1st Cav Div  " Garry Owen"

Offline Krusty

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #69 on: July 28, 2011, 04:21:49 PM »
The 219 was woefully underpowered. The hype persists to this day, but in combat configuration it was slow. Very slow. No better than other planes it was supposed to replace (which were already obsolete). Some claimed in combat it was barely able to do 350mph max. It never reached the 400+ claimed.

Plus it's a dedicated night fighter in a game dedicated to the art of fair weather daytime fighting, so it doesn't really fit.

Offline Rich52

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #70 on: July 28, 2011, 04:26:42 PM »
I can only hope not guess. And I hope its the TU-2, or the Beau, or the A-26, or the Yak-3, or the FireFly.
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Offline Nutzoid

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #71 on: July 28, 2011, 04:28:58 PM »
The 219 was woefully underpowered. The hype persists to this day, but in combat configuration it was slow. Very slow. No better than other planes it was supposed to replace (which were already obsolete). Some claimed in combat it was barely able to do 350mph max. It never reached the 400+ claimed.

Plus it's a dedicated night fighter in a game dedicated to the art of fair weather daytime fighting, so it doesn't really fit.

You sure your talking about the HE219?? Maybe you better recheck your sources. My stats on it says the A-7 has a max speed of 416mph. Engines were the 1,900hp Daimler-Benz DB 603G inverted v12.
IDK, but I wouldn't call this "woefully underpowered".

Nutz
C co. 1st Bn 7 CAV 1st Cav Div  " Garry Owen"

Offline Krusty

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #72 on: July 28, 2011, 04:39:48 PM »
It never made that. Again the hype. Even pilots interviewed at the time noted it never reached anywhere near that speed. Part of the controversy.

I've read the discussions a number of places and seen many resources listed to back this up but it's been a while and I don't remember them all. This is just from google right now

From:
http://www.pilotfriend.com/photo_albums/timeline/ww2/Heinkel%20He%20219%20Uhu.htm

"According to Gebhard Aders (author of Geschichte der deutschen Nachtjägd), the He 219 "never achieved the values given in its manual. With almost full tanks and full armament, the He 219 could not get above 26,247 ft (8000 m). With Lichtenstein and flame dampers, the maximum speed fell to about 311 mph (500 km/h) at this height." "

and:

[Edit: Performance for the A-7] "Performance: (DB 603E engine) Maximum speed 286 mph (460 km/h) at sea level, 363 mph (585 km/h) at 19,685 ft (6000 m); service ceiling 32,150 ft (9800 m); initial climb rate 1,804 ft (550 m) per minute."

You can see that while it's not without merit (it packed a big punch, it was a night fighter with working radar), it was by no means what the urban legend would portray it to be. It's in the same camp as those claiming the Horton bomber would have won the war for Germany -- all hype and the real world performance not living up to it.

EDIT: The production for the 219 started early, but didn't really pick up and pump out numbers until late 1944. At that time it was slower than 1943-era twins already being phased out.



These are both faster than it.

EDIT2: These are closer to the night fighter mossies hunting down and killing the 219s in 1944:



It never really could compete, being slower than the 110G you see on that chart.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 04:45:00 PM by Krusty »

Offline Nutzoid

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #73 on: July 28, 2011, 05:48:52 PM »
C co. 1st Bn 7 CAV 1st Cav Div  " Garry Owen"

Offline Mystery

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Re: Whats your guess?
« Reply #74 on: July 28, 2011, 07:07:38 PM »
P-63C Kingcobra  :)

Oh, oh sorry - thread was what do I think will be done next, not what I want to be done next. My bad.  :o

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