Author Topic: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"  (Read 444 times)

Offline tunnelrat

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Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« on: April 09, 2012, 10:52:42 AM »
Since "Troops" would be well armed, well trained units capable of defending themselves quite well (let alone dispatching an individual armed with a .45 containing an ungainly 32 round banana clip), it is at the very least a misnomer.

What we have right now are singly-purposed suicide bombers.  They rush headlong towards their target and detonate when they arrive.

All kidding aside, "strafe the map room" has now gone from "bomb the map room" to "send a wirb to camp the map room". 

This is not what AH is about.  As it stands, that storch bailer or otherwise purpose-bailed pilot hiding out to snipe "troops" with his .45 caliber mortar is a griefer plain and simple.  15-20 people, operating in concert to take a base... fight through the enemies real defenses...  satisfy the requirements set forth... shut down the town, the AI death-ack, close the base... that saint who has been waiting patiently for their chance at glory in their M3 or even worse - goon... he lets his troops go... and... and... they look like they all went in... no cap... what happened guys!?

Did you strafe the map room? Yes.

Did you bomb the flag area?  No, we had troops running... but wait, carpet bombing won't kill our own troops... or our own GVs... but it might ferret out that essentially invisible Quake 0.5 player that is hiding around there!!!


The novelty of the ability to bail out and still be armed IS classic AH... and should never go away....  however, the following are no brainers:


1.  For downed pilots: 7 round magazine, maybe a separate mag with reload time.  No more explosive .45 rounds, rapid fire with a 32 round mag.  Give a single round a 50/50 chance to kill a troop.

2.  Either hide Troop icons, or show bailed pilot icons.  This is absurd.   If the game wants to be an FPS, then give us Infantry load outs and we'll deal with these "pilots" ourselves.  If not, give them the same chance as the "troops".

3.  Ground bail-out = auto landing.  It's insane the number of proxy kills you get when taking a base (especially a vbase) from people who are spawning and bailing.  There is no legitimate reason to spawn valuable military hardware and then lose it to the enemy (plane explodes, kill is awarded) simply to try to play Quake in order to compensate for shoddy defense.  You can't fire bomber guns on the ground... and you haven't been able to for how long?  And why?  Because people gamed the hell out of it, and would continue to do so to this day.

4.  Award kills for downed pilots.  At this time, a downed pilot is still armed and capable of affecting the war.  At the bare minimum "You killed so and so" needs to be displayed.  As long as an enemy unit is armed, they need to award a kill when defeated.


This game is a lot of fun, and I very much enjoy it... mainly because of the awesome squad I am a part of.  We don't mind coming up with a legitimate bust on a base take... we assess what went wrong, give credit to the defenders when due, and then we regroup and try again (or drink more and bust again).  We will, like anyone else, get torqued off when we get killed... but when storch bailing shenanigans botch otherwise perfectly executed missions, that more than anything else elicits more than a couple "Alright guys, that's it for me for the night"'s.

When you have a group of guys having a great time like that, and something other than a skilled and determined opponent operating within the intended parameters of the game discourages the entire party... it's time for something to change.

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Offline Raphael

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2012, 11:51:48 AM »
strafe the maproom again.
if the problem continues, bail out too and have an fps fight. Hunt him down  :rock
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Offline tunnelrat

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2012, 12:37:56 PM »
strafe the maproom again.
if the problem continues, bail out too and have an fps fight. Hunt him down  :rock

In-Game: 80hd
The Spartans do not enquire how many the enemy are but where they are.

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2012, 12:55:27 PM »
Since "Troops" would be well armed, well trained units capable of defending themselves quite well (let alone dispatching an individual armed with a .45 containing an ungainly 32 round banana clip), it is at the very least a misnomer.

What we have right now are singly-purposed suicide bombers.  They rush headlong towards their target and detonate when they arrive.

All kidding aside, "strafe the map room" has now gone from "bomb the map room" to "send a wirb to camp the map room". 

This is not what AH is about.  As it stands, that storch bailer or otherwise purpose-bailed pilot hiding out to snipe "troops" with his .45 caliber mortar is a griefer plain and simple.  15-20 people, operating in concert to take a base... fight through the enemies real defenses...  satisfy the requirements set forth... shut down the town, the AI death-ack, close the base... that saint who has been waiting patiently for their chance at glory in their M3 or even worse - goon... he lets his troops go... and... and... they look like they all went in... no cap... what happened guys!?

Did you strafe the map room? Yes.

Did you bomb the flag area?  No, we had troops running... but wait, carpet bombing won't kill our own troops... or our own GVs... but it might ferret out that essentially invisible Quake 0.5 player that is hiding around there!!!


The novelty of the ability to bail out and still be armed IS classic AH... and should never go away....  however, the following are no brainers:


1.  For downed pilots: 7 round magazine, maybe a separate mag with reload time.  No more explosive .45 rounds, rapid fire with a 32 round mag.  Give a single round a 50/50 chance to kill a troop.

2.  Either hide Troop icons, or show bailed pilot icons.  This is absurd.   If the game wants to be an FPS, then give us Infantry load outs and we'll deal with these "pilots" ourselves.  If not, give them the same chance as the "troops".

3.  Ground bail-out = auto landing.  It's insane the number of proxy kills you get when taking a base (especially a vbase) from people who are spawning and bailing.  There is no legitimate reason to spawn valuable military hardware and then lose it to the enemy (plane explodes, kill is awarded) simply to try to play Quake in order to compensate for shoddy defense.  You can't fire bomber guns on the ground... and you haven't been able to for how long?  And why?  Because people gamed the hell out of it, and would continue to do so to this day.

4.  Award kills for downed pilots.  At this time, a downed pilot is still armed and capable of affecting the war.  At the bare minimum "You killed so and so" needs to be displayed.  As long as an enemy unit is armed, they need to award a kill when defeated.


This game is a lot of fun, and I very much enjoy it... mainly because of the awesome squad I am a part of.  We don't mind coming up with a legitimate bust on a base take... we assess what went wrong, give credit to the defenders when due, and then we regroup and try again (or drink more and bust again).  We will, like anyone else, get torqued off when we get killed... but when storch bailing shenanigans botch otherwise perfectly executed missions, that more than anything else elicits more than a couple "Alright guys, that's it for me for the night"'s.

When you have a group of guys having a great time like that, and something other than a skilled and determined opponent operating within the intended parameters of the game discourages the entire party... it's time for something to change.



Just so you know... more US pilots in WWII were armed with the S&W Mod 10 revolver in .38 Special than the 1911A1 in .45 ACP. 

Ultimately, I believe you are asking for a whole boatload of coding to be put in to AH that will have minimal impact, if any, on game play experience. Just sayin'.     
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline Spikes

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2012, 01:44:10 PM »
It has gotten a little pathetic. Not that I am a win the war type of guy, but something should be done regarding the Storch. It is a great tool for uses such as scouting etc but 50% of the time people bail out at a Vbase and run to the maproom.
How about you can't bail out of an aircraft unless you are in the air?
Like tunnelrat said, less rounds in a .45, less ability to kill troops, possibly allow troops to shoot back at other downed pilots? Right now they are worthless Conscripts. With a .45, make it so troops need to be hit twice. Hit once, their speed is reduced by half, hit twice, they die. I'm no coder, but I can't imagine that is much different than the "Hit a plane's part X amount of times for X amount of damage before it falls off".
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Offline tunnelrat

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2012, 03:13:01 PM »
Just so you know... more US pilots in WWII were armed with the S&W Mod 10 revolver in .38 Special than the 1911A1 in .45 ACP. 

Ultimately, I believe you are asking for a whole boatload of coding to be put in to AH that will have minimal impact, if any, on game play experience. Just sayin'.     

That's good to know about the revolver, I did not know that and learning more era information is one of the big draws to AH for me (and why I stay on ch 200, just in case)  :aok

As far as coding goes, most of my suggestions do not require anything major.  This is based on a wild assumption that AH's proprietary code uses some standards, but reducing ammunition capacity for a weapon should be incredibly simple, not to mention requiring no playtesting other than bug check.

Icons can be turned off and on in various theatres, and I believe chutes used to have them anyway.

Preventing ground bailouts.... they already prevent firing from bomber guns while landed, so there has to be an existing check for plane state.

Awarding kills and/or at least displaying "You killed steve the magical storchicorn" might require something more heavy, I don't know.

As far as gameplay goes, it has (as I mentioned above) a huge impact for base takers/defenders, which is the goal of the main arenas.
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The Spartans do not enquire how many the enemy are but where they are.

Offline dirtdart

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2012, 12:55:41 PM »
Sapper lemmings..... Lol more like what they are, mindless grunts. Sappers are better looking and more intelligent than grunts.

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When I was just a young lad of only 15 years
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Drink up drink up drink up drink up an come along with us
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Who don't give a damn about us...hey!
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Offline Getback

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Re: Rename "Troops" to "Sapper Lemmings"
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2012, 11:43:15 PM »
Yeah, but they can dance!

I always wanted to have he ability to name the troops.

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