P-47d40 vs. P-47d25

[Lusche]

the only reason i made that claim is because I've done it before. I've also turned with spits that had their flaps out as well. look at charts all you want but I've actually done it before.

And I have outturned Ki's and Spits in a Ta 152H...

but that doesn't mean the Ta outturns Spit's. It's a pilot that outturned another one not being able to utilize his plane's vast advantage. But you can not compare planes that way.  You have to keep the pilot out of the picture in performance analysis, else you will come to this kind of very skewed results.

 

[Citabria]

there are only two typs of planes i think.  those like the p47 that can be successful if flown with no mistakes that can capitalize on mistakes made of opponents.

and then there are the planes like the La7 and spit16 that can kill planes like the p47 even if the spit/la makes plenty of mistakes.

[Slade]

...then there are the planes like the La7 and spit16 that can kill planes like the p47 even if the spit/la makes plenty of mistakes.

Very good point Citabria!

[titanic3]

there are only two typs of planes i think.  those like the p47 that can be successful if flown with no mistakes that can capitalize on mistakes made of opponents.

and then there are the planes like the La7 and spit16 that can kill planes like the p47 even if the spit/la makes plenty of mistakes.

And when the P47 can't capitalize on its opponent's mistake because he has made none, then you are screwed. 

[Butcher]

there are only two typs of planes i think.  those like the p47 that can be successful if flown with no mistakes that can capitalize on mistakes made of opponents.

and then there are the planes like the La7 and spit16 that can kill planes like the p47 even if the spit/la makes plenty of mistakes.

This sums up most engagements, the lower the ENY the more mistakes can be made - higher the eny the more perfected flying is needed.

One reason I sit in 20+ eny planes because I expect to lose, but still try to win a fight.

[JUGgler]

Someone say JUG? 

It's in the name 




JUGgler

[LilMak]

The D-40 is slightly better of the two with WEP. D-25 flat turns a little better than the the D-40. D-40 also has spoilers that you can pop out to help slow ya down. Overall the D-40 it the most well rounded of all the jugs.

And it will turn with any MA plane at over 250 while going down hill. Stability at really low speeds is excelent.

[Slade]

Been working with the D25 and finding I like it a lot.  Feels solid and turns well for a Jug.  Surprisingly I am finding the turn radius is not that huge between the D11 and D25.

LilMak and other hardcore 47 guys, where and why do you like setting your convergence in the D25?

Thanks again,

Slade  

[WWhiskey]

out turning a noob, means nothing.

that's the only way you accomplished that....

I out flew a zero on the deck in a 152....does that mean a 152 can out turn a zero


listen Ill tell ya what I fly the KI84, the spit is a better fighter then the KI  so by your reasoning you should be able to out turn my KI....wanna try it?   


I know first hand that the jug stands NO chance trying to turn fight the KI......

the best of the best in the JUG lasted all of 2 turns against my KI....

what you are talking about is nonsense...plain and simple.

True but why would any decent jug pilot want to try and turn with a KI in the first place?
The KI has a specific place it needs to be to fight and a specific way to fight it to its highest potential,
The jug has its best fight in a different place!   Two equal pilots, flying there planes "in their envolope" jug v KI FLAWLESSLY   Which plane wins?   I'd vote jug!

[LilMak]

My convergence is set 325 inner four guns 300 outer four guns. Semi shotgun effect @ convergence ranges and you get another crossing stream closer for the knife fights. I set the M a little further out because the higher speed fights Tend to take place @ longer ranges 375/350.

Jug vs KI-84 even fight with two equal pilots ends one of 2 ways...
Jug goes down in flames or is able to get lucky and get the KI Before the fight gets into the weeds. Once a jug runs out of alt against a good KI pilot, it just becomes a matter of time. The KI can stay in the vert and engage at will.  Fighting downhill a jug has a chance against anything, one at the bottom of the hill your best shot is to get a lucky snap on an overshoot.

[Debrody]

True but why would any decent jug pilot want to try and turn with a KI in the first place?

Why would a decent 109 pilot turn with a spit? Same.
Couse they think they good enough to win a turnfight despite the differences between the planes?
Couse beating a better turning plane in a brickyer makes them smile?
Couse they arent score whures and enjoying some turny action?

A couple days ago i tryed the D25 jug. Finished a niki on the deck when got jumped by a lala. Poor dude ended up running and leaking oil after 3 scissoring turns.
The Jug isnt nearly as bad when it has no more than 40-45% fuel. Actually quite potent. Stalls steadily, has a good roll rate, predictable torque, can fly slow if needed.

[Slade]

Thanks LilMak, Debrody.

>> predictable torque

From the pilots point of view, which way does the prop turn in a Jug?

Thanks.

[WWhiskey]

I can't recall seeing a KI @ 26 k

[titanic3]

I can't recall seeing a KI @ 26 k

I can't recall the last time I fought a TnBing Jug in the MA. HO, dive, run. Maybe a ram somewhere in there.

I have to resort to flying speed demons (La-7, Temp) to catch them and force a fight. Even the K4 can't catch them due to the craptastic diving ability.

[WWhiskey]

I can't recall the last time I fought a TnBing Jug in the MA. HO, dive, run. Maybe a ram somewhere in there.

I have to resort to flying speed demons (La-7, Temp) to catch them and force a fight. Even the K4 can't catch them due to the craptastic diving ability.

That was my point ,, kinda,,, bring a KI  the the jugs arena and see what  happens,,
Why does the jug have to fight the KI's fight?