Artillery

[Ack-Ack]

We already have somewhat of a mobile artillery platform, the LVT4 with its 75mm pack howitzer that is perfect for both direct and indirect fire.

ack-ack

[Butcher]

We already have somewhat of a mobile artillery platform, the LVT4 with its 75mm pack howitzer that is perfect for both direct and indirect fire.

ack-ack

Yes but they are strictly used for direct fire, how would say for example an m7 Priest use indirect fire? you would need someone to direct the artillery rounds incomming to shoot over a hill, even then how would one gauge where the shells land?
If so I agree with it, most mobile artillery pieces were open top - one aircraft could easily disable or destroy them (lack of armor also).

[Tank-Ace]

Not even sure how you can dial indirect fire in either, I can see direct.

Perhaps make it sort of like the land-gunner mode on CV guns. You click on a map and it gives you a range and bearing from your current estimated location, and the current estimated location of the target.

You have to manually bring your gun to bear on the target, and the gun will shift due to recoil, just like in real life, so you have to manually re-aim.


The longer you stay in one location (say, within 100yds, to let you move so you're not hitting a building or a tree or something when you fire), the more accurate the estimate of your possition, and your target, thus letting you be more precise in your gunnery.

After, say, 15 minutes, I could see someone being able to drop shells on a hanger, or a cluster of buildings with reasonable reliability.


Maybe give us the Wespe, and the M7 priest?

[Chalenge]

I think the best artie in the game right now is the M4A3(75) when firing from a point of elevation advatage and from the commanders position. Even from level ground it is quite possible to hit objects at 15k or better. Even if the 88s were made into towable objects it would take more time and be less effective than the M4 already is.

[Tank-Ace]

I think the best artie in the game right now is the M4A3(75) when firing from a point of elevation advatage and from the commanders position. Even from level ground it is quite possible to hit objects at 15k or better. Even if the 88s were made into towable objects it would take more time and be less effective than the M4 already is.

I find it a bit questionable that you could hit even an individual town building from 15k, much less something like an ord bunker or anything smaller.

Hell, even trying to SEE an individual town building from 15k (better than 8 1/2 miles) would be a challenge in and of itself on some computers. Seeing the shell hit, and adjusting at that range is another thing entirely.

[Butcher]

I think the best artie in the game right now is the M4A3(75) when firing from a point of elevation advatage and from the commanders position. Even from level ground it is quite possible to hit objects at 15k or better. Even if the 88s were made into towable objects it would take more time and be less effective than the M4 already is.

This is what I am thinking, instead add the M4(105) or Stuh 42 - it would require direct attacks on the town, however the damage radius would be quite increased, it could still be indirect - however unless someone actively watches where the rounds land it would be useless otherwise.
This being said, for example stuh 42 would not be issued hallow shaped ammo, for the time being it would be classified as strictly artillery.

As far as indirect artillery, I don't think gameplay has expanded enough to furfill these roles yet.

[Chalenge]

I can do it easily with that tank. Sorry you havent figured out how yet. 

[TDeacon]

I can do it easily with that tank. Sorry you havent figured out how yet.  

You'd have to be on a mountain, and be using the highest game resolution to do this, I think.  If you would be so kind as to elaborate, what game resolution do you use?  :-)  MH

[Butcher]

I can do it easily with that tank. Sorry you havent figured out how yet.  

Interesting because I train tankers, i'd like for you to show me how you Direct fire on a town behind two hills and hit buildings without a LOS.
Film please.

[JunkyII]

People are mistaking indirect fire with Plunging fire......used very often with weapons like the M2.

 

[bustr]

I thought you guys were attempting to design artillery as a programatical function module within the current game framework? Most of you appere to have impressive real life resumes that generate some fascinating whizzing matches in the middle of these game fuction design discussions.

Artillery as fixed batteries, mobile batteries, or single mobile unit will work in this game if HTC wants to program in the functions and create the 3D modeling. The static 88's and 17lb prove this. But, will it add anything to the overall game flow process?

So far the 88's nor the 17lb are installed in the logical strategic positions for long range feild defence from tank assults. Very often your line of fire is into trees while the tanks are able to gain superior LoS to your fixed position and kill you first. The 88's are still being learned by players as air defence guns which they seem to be used for more often. So far the longest kill shot I've acheived with an 88 AP round was 8k on a wirbel. If I had instead been in control of a battery. I could have used single ranging shots then selected battery fire and dropped multiple HE on that wirbel instead of pot shot ranging it with a lucky kill shot.

[Chalenge]

The way I learned indirect fire was by going to V88 on ozkansas and firing on V103. I can sit on the concrete of V88 with an M4A3(75) and kill all of the guns and hangars. It wasnt that long ago that I sat there and kept 103 dead for more than two hours. Sorry you missed that. I was told 200 was full of "C" words.

You can do the same thing from maximum range in the M4 and drop towns although someone has to be in the air to tell you which building you have hit. After that it is simply a matter of slight aim point corrections.

When I sit on a 9.5k mountain and use plunging fire on a vbase (which I have done numerous times) the enemy will not even see the base flashing. With resupply I can kill all of the guns the hangars and make any vehicle on the field miserable from all the hits they hear. A 9.5k elevation with a horizontal offset of 6k gives a firing distance of about 11.25k while shooting at objects on the far side of the field will be shots of about 12.5k.

While 15k shots are exceptional they are also rarely needed but nonetheless possible.

Film wont help you.

[JVboob]

First I don't know how you will move your artillery group around or if it will be fixed. You guys can wish for that.

When you spawn or take control of your artillery position you have two postions like in a GV.

1. - Gun adjuster and fire.
2. - Forward Spotter and fire.

The adjuster\spotter has a quarter pie grid that follows the muzzle of the cannons. The radius is the max range of the cannon(s), with a movable spotter's jump spawn arrow. He places the arrow where he wants to jump to and becomes the same as a parachuted pilot walking around. Instead of calling coordinates and fire, he uses his grid to estimate direction, distance and elevation. Presses a fire button and watches the effect. If the effect is off he hops back to the guns and adjusts. He can kill himself with his own fire and the enemy can kill him if spotted. Give him an icon with a "SP" on it.

a. - To keep him from being a free ranging grifer or hiding in maprooms, he isn't equipped with a firearm. Running fast and position change is his defence. He can augment the Storch as a spotter or work with a Storch spotting for him. He can flip the finger to enemy spotters and goons.
b. - He should have more than one spotter life (3 - 5) but, his life is ultimatly tied to the gun(s) destruction.
c. - Include mannable\auto antiair defences with the gun group(???)
d. - If multiple guns in this scenario, a fixed pattern is fired, or the adjuster has a "short" menu of patterns. All guns slaved to a primary used for all adjustments.

Down sides:
1. - Boring and lots of work.
2. - Over used to local spot\spy hidden tanks versus artillery spotting.
3. - Used to spot\spy suspected mission spawning feilds to call in 262 if this battery can spawn like a GV and has no perk cost. Spawn in, spawn spotter to the maximum gun range towards the airfield. Spot planes until jabo kills guns. Repeat or bring back freinds.
4. - Might become a spawn camping nightmare if cannon size HE round is seriously destructive to tanks. Or to CV groups and assult craft too close to shore.
5. - Vulnerable once spotted due to fixed nature.
6. - A really clunky cludgy gamey process if this battery can move as a mobile unit setting up and tearing down. Spotter spying abuses would be mostly tied to a mobile battery being GV spawnable into locations.

+1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999 for me well explained and have each manned position consist of 3-5 guns and shoot like buffs drop bombs either a "semi-auto" or a salvo 5 delay .25... make sence i would actually be on the ground instead of a bomb****

[Tank-Ace]

The way I learned indirect fire was by going to V88 on ozkansas and firing on V103. I can sit on the concrete of V88 with an M4A3(75) and kill all of the guns and hangars. It wasnt that long ago that I sat there and kept 103 dead for more than two hours. Sorry you missed that. I was told 200 was full of "C" words.

You can do the same thing from maximum range in the M4 and drop towns although someone has to be in the air to tell you which building you have hit. After that it is simply a matter of slight aim point corrections.

When I sit on a 9.5k mountain and use plunging fire on a vbase (which I have done numerous times) the enemy will not even see the base flashing. With resupply I can kill all of the guns the hangars and make any vehicle on the field miserable from all the hits they hear. A 9.5k elevation with a horizontal offset of 6k gives a firing distance of about 11.25k while shooting at objects on the far side of the field will be shots of about 12.5k.

While 15k shots are exceptional they are also rarely needed but nonetheless possible.

Film wont help you.

Dude, you'd have to have an aircraft loitering for one HELL of a long time. First off, he'd have to locate where your shells are landing, and then see if you're even anywhere near the town/base (at 8.52 miles, its not a given), then he'd have to guide your fire onto the town/base itself. Then he'd have to guide you onto an individual target.

All in all, I'd guess you'd go through at least half your rounds just dialing in the range and bearing for a target, say, a hanger. And thats assuming the gun doesn't shift at all from recoil (and it does). Considering that a shift of a few degrees can significanly change your aim point at extended ranges for direct fire (by as much as maybe 100yds at only 3-4k), it would be safe to assume that the recoil would pose a significant challenge for putting continuous fire onto anything smaller than a town or base as a whole.



My conclusion? The range estimate of 15k is either an outright lie, or heavily exagerated.

[titanic3]

Never underestimate. 

If it can be done, it will be done.