HOLY $#@!$....another small plane crash!

[CAP1]

ya know? when landing on 09 at south jersey regional, we cross the road, and wires. i always tend to fly final a bit high there because of those.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

You can always get a new system with all that money you got...

Well I'll leave it to you to figure the rest out.

Linux is totally free to install, doesn't require money to be able to watch any video from any domain you wish without worries

[JOACH1M]

Linux is totally free to install, doesn't require money to be able to watch any video from any domain you wish without worries

Well, I don't even think his 'game' even took off.


 

[Midway]

A nearly daily event somewhere in the US.  http://www.faa.gov/data_research/accident_incident/preliminary_data/

[deSelys]

About #3, lots of comments already on skydivers forums.


Looks like the Beech 18 looks really cool but isn't best suited for skydiving: relatively low powered, low tail (risk of a jumper hitting the tail), elevator in the burble when skydivers are hanging at the door, CG out-of-limits if too much skydivers at the door during jumprun.

Apparently, jumpers wanted to make a big way (group) exit (12 jumpers) and discussed with the pilot who said it was ok but he would have to fly the jumprun faster to avoid stalling (old time jumpers are saying that they never jumped groups bigger than 9 back in the day when Beech 18 was regularly used as jump plane, and in those case the remaining jumpers were cramming themselves as far forward as possible to keep the CG manageable).

Pilot took off downwind (12-14mph wind) with full fuel load and full jumper load, barely clearing the trees. This did not contribute to the accident but maybe points to some lack of judgement on the pilot's part.

Did the pilot forget about the pre-takeoff briefing? Anyway, he slowed down a lot for the jumprun with the flaps up. Stall while jumpers were positioning themselves at the dorr, violent wing drop, plane got inverted and dove straight to the ground. All jumpers managed to escape, last one above 6,000 ft. Videos from the Go-Pros that some jumpers were wearing are said to be chilling, though (probably seized as evidence).

Pilot wasn't able to recover obviously and couldn't bail out. Blue Skies to him and condolences to the family.

[B4Buster]

snip

What alt were they jumping from? I have flown some jump runs in a Twin Otter. 90% of our turns were at 14K - with an occasional turn at 7K if the jumper didn't want to pay to be carried to 14. Flying through the jump is a non-event (atleast in the Otter which is undoubtedly a much better jump platform than the Beech) as long as you are constantly trimming the aircraft. You can tell when a fatty vacates the plane, though!

I feel as though the pilot should have had plenty of time to recover from an unusual attitude, but I will mention again I have never flown a Twin Beech.

[Shuffler]

About #3, lots of comments already on skydivers forums.


Looks like the Beech 18 looks really cool but isn't best suited for skydiving: relatively low powered, low tail (risk of a jumper hitting the tail), elevator in the burble when skydivers are hanging at the door, CG out-of-limits if too much skydivers at the door during jumprun.

Apparently, jumpers wanted to make a big way (group) exit (12 jumpers) and discussed with the pilot who said it was ok but he would have to fly the jumprun faster to avoid stalling (old time jumpers are saying that they never jumped groups bigger than 9 back in the day when Beech 18 was regularly used as jump plane, and in those case the remaining jumpers were cramming themselves as far forward as possible to keep the CG manageable).

Pilot took off downwind (12-14mph wind) with full fuel load and full jumper load, barely clearing the trees. This did not contribute to the accident but maybe points to some lack of judgement on the pilot's part.

Did the pilot forget about the pre-takeoff briefing? Anyway, he slowed down a lot for the jumprun with the flaps up. Stall while jumpers were positioning themselves at the dorr, violent wing drop, plane got inverted and dove straight to the ground. All jumpers managed to escape, last one above 6,000 ft. Videos from the Go-Pros that some jumpers were wearing are said to be chilling, though (probably seized as evidence).

Pilot wasn't able to recover obviously and couldn't bail out. Blue Skies to him and condolences to the family.

Just wow.

[deSelys]

B4Buster, there is no mention about the jump alt so I guess that it was a regular 13,5K-14K ft.

Nobody knows why the plane dove straight to the ground without any clearly visible recovery attempt by the pilot.

Some jump pilots who have flown the 18 said that it isn't an easy plane in the skydiving environment.

One pilot stated:

To pilot an aircraft like the Beech 18, AT-6 Texan, Stearman, and most aircraft of that vintage requires a VERY different stall recovery, and spin recover technique than is being taught today. And they are NOT forgiving at all. There is a reason I teach my students precision spins, deep stalls, turn stalls etc, BEFORE they do their first solo. If they cannot perform these maneuvers with precision, they don't solo. It is also why I teach in a 1946 Champ taildragger. Modern airplanes are idiot proofed.

[Fud]

About #3, lots of comments already on skydivers forums.


Looks like the Beech 18 looks really cool but isn't best suited for skydiving: relatively low powered, low tail (risk of a jumper hitting the tail), elevator in the burble when skydivers are hanging at the door, CG out-of-limits if too much skydivers at the door during jumprun.

Apparently, jumpers wanted to make a big way (group) exit (12 jumpers) and discussed with the pilot who said it was ok but he would have to fly the jumprun faster to avoid stalling (old time jumpers are saying that they never jumped groups bigger than 9 back in the day when Beech 18 was regularly used as jump plane, and in those case the remaining jumpers were cramming themselves as far forward as possible to keep the CG manageable).

Pilot took off downwind (12-14mph wind) with full fuel load and full jumper load, barely clearing the trees. This did not contribute to the accident but maybe points to some lack of judgement on the pilot's part.

Did the pilot forget about the pre-takeoff briefing? Anyway, he slowed down a lot for the jumprun with the flaps up. Stall while jumpers were positioning themselves at the dorr, violent wing drop, plane got inverted and dove straight to the ground. All jumpers managed to escape, last one above 6,000 ft. Videos from the Go-Pros that some jumpers were wearing are said to be chilling, though (probably seized as evidence).

Pilot wasn't able to recover obviously and couldn't bail out. Blue Skies to him and condolences to the family.

This goes back to 99 or 2000 at the WFFC. We were last to load up in a Casa and I was the last in that line. I looked up and saw a jumper trying to do an accuracy land on the starboard prop. He almost made it, missed it by about 20 feet. He was close enough to have his chute waft over the windscreen.

[Dago]

A nearly daily event somewhere in the US.  http://www.faa.gov/data_research/accident_incident/preliminary_data/

Kinda along the lines of what I was going to say, there is on average almost one small plane crash every day somewhere in the USA.  Doesn't come in threes, comes in almost daily.

[B4Buster]

Some jump pilots who have flown the 18 said that it isn't an easy plane in the skydiving environment.

Yeah, I don't imagine that's a terribly easy aircraft to operate, especially with constant C.G. changes.

[W7LPNRICK]

Kinda along the lines of what I was going to say, there is on average almost one small plane crash every day somewhere in the USA.  Doesn't come in threes, comes in almost daily.

We see this imaginary numerology injected into lots of different areas of society...It was intended sarcastically....in the nursing home when one dies all the nurses/caregivers, say"I wonder who the next two will be?"....

[pembquist]

Car crashes can be really nasty but they get cleaned up so fast that most people never see the aftermath. When a light plane goes down it is always news.  The thing that is nice about light planes is that excepting mid airs (which give me the heebie Jeeves) your fate is in your own hands to a much larger degree than when you are driving.

[LilMak]

Car crashes can be really nasty but they get cleaned up so fast that most people never see the aftermath. When a light plane goes down it is always news.  The thing that is nice about light planes is that excepting mid airs (which give me the heebie Jeeves) your fate is in your own hands to a much larger degree than when you are driving.

Yea. When you're driving you life is more often in the other guys hands. I'm more worried about accidents driving to the airport than I am once I pull the plane out of the hangar.

[Wolfala]

About #3, lots of comments already on skydivers forums.


Looks like the Beech 18 looks really cool but isn't best suited for skydiving: relatively low powered, low tail (risk of a jumper hitting the tail), elevator in the burble when skydivers are hanging at the door, CG out-of-limits if too much skydivers at the door during jumprun.

Apparently, jumpers wanted to make a big way (group) exit (12 jumpers) and discussed with the pilot who said it was ok but he would have to fly the jumprun faster to avoid stalling (old time jumpers are saying that they never jumped groups bigger than 9 back in the day when Beech 18 was regularly used as jump plane, and in those case the remaining jumpers were cramming themselves as far forward as possible to keep the CG manageable).

Pilot took off downwind (12-14mph wind) with full fuel load and full jumper load, barely clearing the trees. This did not contribute to the accident but maybe points to some lack of judgement on the pilot's part.

Did the pilot forget about the pre-takeoff briefing? Anyway, he slowed down a lot for the jumprun with the flaps up. Stall while jumpers were positioning themselves at the dorr, violent wing drop, plane got inverted and dove straight to the ground. All jumpers managed to escape, last one above 6,000 ft. Videos from the Go-Pros that some jumpers were wearing are said to be chilling, though (probably seized as evidence).

Pilot wasn't able to recover obviously and couldn't bail out. Blue Skies to him and condolences to the family.

The twin-Beech had any number of qualities to make pilots hate it. Not only was it a disagreeable handful in the air with one engine failed at gross weight, but it also enjoyed a well-deserved reputation for its take-your-eyes-off-me-and-I'll-make-you-pay-for-it ground handling. Pilot comforts were minimal; the twin-Beech was hot in the summer and cold in the winter. I've never heard anyone say anything really nice about the twin-Beech, unless “they sure built a lot of the whoopee things” qualifi es as a compliment.