Gun Accidents.....how safe are you? really?

[mike8318]

Not to be pedantic, but it does.

...

To be fair to the Glock people: You should always clear a gun before trying to disassemble it. Clearing a gun includes pulling the trigger to uncock the gun after you've visually checked the chamber. He also disregarded the rule that you should never put any body parts (that you want to keep) in front of the muzzle while pulling the trigger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZf4mUM10Vc

If I remember correctly,the Glock is striker fired,no hammer,therefore no need to uncock it.

[nrshida]

Arguing that glock's design is poor is tantamount to saying its fine to point the gun at your face when you disassemble it.

  Crikey Tank-Ace, does this pass for logic in your circles?

The design can not actually be responsible.  Reification

Well it is reification in a way. Realistically there may or may not be a capsule of low explosive present in the mechanism when you depress the firing mechanism to disassemble it. I'm sure the person the OP posted about was convinced the chamber was empty, it's easy for human beings to make procedural mistakes, we are not machines. Pulling the trigger is an action which should be reserved for firing the gun when all of the safety features have been satisfied. The designers failed to do everything they could to minimise ND. Poor design.  

Just for the sake of argument, what if the disassembly process involved moving the slide rearward, pressing a button inside the mouth of the ejection port and then continuing to move the slide backwards off the rails to remove it? Then even with a chambered round there would be no danger. You do not have to press the trigger and any round you failed to clear would just plop out. Whereupon you could slap yourself and review your gun safety, instead of counting how many fingers you have left  

[nrshida]

Oops double post.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

The first time I took my wife shooting, she accidentally discharged the 357 magnum and almost made a hole to my car door. Luckily she didn't point at herself, my then unborn child or anyone else. That was pretty scary 

[cpxxx]

When I joined the army reserve many years if there was one thing the Instructor emphasised it was to make sure the chamber was clear before pulling the trigger and also never putting any part of yours or anyone else's body in the way of the muzzle as you did so. Forget any of this this you got a memorable bollocking. (We used Lee Enfield .303s) To the point that even now after all these years I even treat an airsoft gun like it was real. 

Good training, that's what it's all about. Guns are only as safe or as dangerous as the user. There was a funny story with a Glock in this country. A guy was showing off to his friends, took out the magazine pointed it as his head and pulled the trigger while they videod him with their phones. I believe it was quite messy.

Now you might be thinking I'm a sicko for making fun of this situation. But save it. He was a notorious gangster, drug dealer and killer. Poetic justice because apparently  he was showing his mates how to kill someone. He did a good job of it!

[Maverick]

If I remember correctly,the Glock is striker fired,no hammer,therefore no need to uncock it.

As far as being striker fired is concerned, you are correct. There is no hammer. However the factory instructions as well as all the other source instructions are clear. To break the Glock down you must pull the trigger all the way through first. It has something to do with positioning the transfer parts to a neutral position.

Since I have used a Glock for more than 2 decades (it was one of the 3 authorized semi autos by the Department) I am more than familiar with it's operation. It makes no difference to caliber, or generation, they ALL break down the same way.

It was also hammered into me on this and EVERY other weapon, during handling the FIRST thing you do is insure it is not loaded. The action is opened and cleared. I make myself do this 3 times with the Glock and still insure it's pointed in a safe direction before engaging the booger hook on the trigger.

Complacency and comfort with any type of machine is the first step to having an accident with it. Tools will bite and they have neither conscience nor regrets.

[W7LPNRICK]

I always liked the decocking lever in some modern double action first shot autos like the CZ-75 series...but again, not visualizing the chamber was the main problem simply put. 

[GScholz]

If I remember correctly,the Glock is striker fired,no hammer,therefore no need to uncock it.

The Glock has a hammer of a sort, but it's completely conealed internally, and looks like an elongated firing pin. Perhaps this is what you call a striker?

[GScholz]

Well it is reification in a way. Realistically there may or may not be a capsule of low explosive present in the mechanism when you depress the firing mechanism to disassemble it.

Again, you do not depress the trigger during disassembly. The trigger needs to have been depressed (to de-cock, de-strike, de-whatever the firing mechanism) prior to disassembly. Big difference.

Watch this video carefully.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CN1QJDGinwE

After he cleared the weapon and decocked it by dry-firing it in a safe direction, at no point did he touch the trigger while pulling it apart. The trigger on a Glock stays in its rear position after having been pulled. The trigger only returns to its forward position when the weapon cycles. I had a Glock 17 as my service pistol for two years. I know this.

[W7LPNRICK]

The Glock has a hammer of a sort, but it's completely concealed internally, and looks like an elongated firing pin. Perhaps this is what you call a striker?

uncocking it lowers the sear or other protruding mechanical part allowing the slide to come off the front of the frame. Not sure what you call it, but won't disassemble without it. No external hammer, no decocking lever, necessitating a dry fire before dis-assembly are hazards with the Glock IMO. The 1911 can be decocked w/o dry firing, by easing the hammer down with 2 hands. The grip safety makes this a little awkward but easier with practice. The XD-40 style Springfield has a top mounted extractor which sticks up out of the slide if a round remains chambered...a nice attribute. I had one of these & liked it better than my Glock 19...

[W7LPNRICK]

Again, you do not depress the trigger during disassembly. The trigger needs to have been depressed (to de-cock, de-strike, de-whatever the firing mechanism) prior to disassembly. Big difference.

Watch this video carefully.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CN1QJDGinwE

After he cleared the weapon and decocked it by dry-firing it in a safe direction, at no point did he touch the trigger while pulling it apart. The trigger on a Glock stays in its rear position after having been pulled. The trigger only returns to its forward position when the weapon cycles. I had a Glock 17 as my service pistol for two years. I know this.

Uhhhhh...he pulled the trigger. Whatever semantics you want to use is ok with me, but he pulled the trigger anyway. watch it again.

[GScholz]

If you follow the basic four rules of clearing a firearm you should (step 4) dry-fire the weapon in a safe direct... ALWAYS. If you follow the safety rules of clearing a firearm the Glock pistol is ready for disassembly, having already been dry-fired during clearing.

[GScholz]

He pulled the trigger/dry-fired the pistol in a safe direction (though I wouldn't have touched the slide like that if I were him) BEFORE he started to disassemble the Glock.

[GScholz]

I have three Mausers, all in 7.92mm. My favorite is a 98k manufactured in the BRNO factory ("dot" stamped on the receiver) in 1943. Laminate stock, matching serial numbers. Dark bore, but sharp rifling. Won a bet with it some years ago, when I hit 4 out of 5 golf balls using the original battle sights at 200 yards. My friend, shooting a Springfield M1A with a Leupold 3-9x40mm scope... He hit two... 

Yes, it's a supremely accurate weapon. The Mauser is very popular here as a hunting rifle, especially after the National Guard sold all their M98's for like $100 a piece back in the '70s. Mine is one of those. Produced in 1943, re-chamberd after the war to NATO standard and put into mobilization storage. Never even fired before selling it 30 years later.

[nrshida]

Again, you do not depress the trigger during disassembly.

Yes, I understood that.

The trigger needs to have been depressed (to de-cock, de-strike, de-whatever the firing mechanism) prior to disassembly. Big difference.

Yup, doesn't change the fact the trigger functionality is overloaded. You have to dry fire the weapon to de-cock it, that's unintelligent, from the design point of view.