HTC Overmodeled the Brewster!

[BaDkaRmA158Th]

Shoot, gimmie a high alt turbo charger for my p39 or 20mph to the top speed of my A20G and ill be one happy camper.


BUT, ill live without it, and  i wont lean on any other a/c being "easy" to justify my amount of suck at any time.

If you die to a brewster your..
A: Going under 300mph.
B: Trying to turn fight with it.
C: Somehow got jumped because of poor situational awareness.



Now, what one was it that always gets you killed to the point of coming here and trying to attack the a/c as being over modeled/easy mode?

[Karnak]

I think Krusty was looking at is as going from 338mph to 357mph as being only a 5.6% boost in speed for the Mossie.  The thing is, when running or chasing an enemy fighter the speed range on the deck that counts, really, is 264mph (Hurricane Mk I) to 386mph (Tempest Mk V), only a 122mph range and 19mph being 15.6% of that is a much more significant gain than it appears at first glance.

[bozon]

Yup.  Speed matters.  I remember Krusty telling Scherf and I that an extra 20mph wouldn't be very useful for the Mossie when we were pushing HTC to remodel the Mossie with ejector stacks.  Look at the Mossie's K/D ratio before and after that 19mph gain.  It went from about 0.65 to 1 to about 1.05 to 1.  There were other changes too, but by far the biggest was the boost in speed.

The speed boost is only one part of it. The handling was improved as well, which really helps in a dogfight. The mossie FM had 2 revisions in AH2 - the first time was to fix the center of mass which was off, but left the elevator controls very weak, ruining the mossie as a dogfighter. Then there was the complete remodeling that also removed the exhaust stacks and the engines were modeled as Merlin 25s. If I am not mistaken, the old mossies were a little faster on MIL (but much slower on WEP). The WEP climb rate also got a very noticeable boost in the latest FM. I am not sure about the roll rate, but I think the old FM was slightly quicker in the roll.

I think Krusty was looking at is as going from 338mph to 357mph as being only a 5.6% boost in speed for the Mossie.  The thing is, when running or chasing an enemy fighter the speed range on the deck that counts, really, is 264mph (Hurricane Mk I) to 386mph (Tempest Mk V), only a 122mph range and 19mph being 15.6% of that is a much more significant gain than it appears at first glance.

Correct. In speeds what matters is the speed difference, not the ratio.

[Karnak]

Thread hijack:

The Mossie always had Merlin 25s, they were just hamstrung by the flame dampers before.  Now it has the daylight configuration with ejector stacks.  As far as MIL speed goes I only really tested the MIL speed of the old Mossie on the deck and if I recall it was 1 or 2mph faster than the new one..  I think I have an old version of AH floating around on my hard drive some place so it might be interesting to do some MIL checks.  Roll rate seems to me to be effectively the same.

Changes related to the Mossie VI that I recall:

1) Mosquito Mk VI was added
2) Mosquito Mk VI was moved from Bomber Hangar and Bomber score to Fighter Hangar and Fighter score
3) 500lb bombs were enabled in the bomb bay
4) Damage model revised, no longer burst into flames from harsh language
5) CoG corrected
6) Completely redone flight model with ejector stacks, graphics updated to AH2 standards
7) Climb rate was slightly increased

[tuton25]

Speaking of the mossie I've had brewsters catch me when I am doing 400+ MpH.....Any reason that is happening???

[Karnak]

Speaking of the mossie I've had brewsters catch me when I am doing 400+ MpH.....Any reason that is happening???

They had a lot of altitude to blow in a dive on you is the only way it should happen.  In the deceleration tests I did of the B-239 vs the Fw190D-9 the B-239 did not exhibit any unexpected ability to retain energy.  It slowed very much faster than the Fw190D-9 did in both power on and power off tests.

[Saxman]

They had a lot of altitude to blow in a dive on you is the only way it should happen.  In the deceleration tests I did of the B-239 vs the Fw190D-9 the B-239 did not exhibit any unexpected ability to retain energy.  It slowed very much faster than the Fw190D-9 did in both power on and power off tests.

Yeah, since I've been back I've had Brewsters dive on me a couple times. Even if they're in a max power dive with a good altitude advantage I've yet to see one pull closer than 600 yards before my 1A starts to pull away again. Most times I usually don't even need to nose down. They can pick up a good bit of smash going downhill, but not nearly enough to overcome their power deficiency in an extended chase.

If you' were caught by a Brewster at that speed, I'd guess you were really napping at the controls.

[Slade]

If you die to a brewster your..
A: Going under 300mph.
B: Trying to turn fight with it.
C: Somehow got jumped because of poor situational awareness.

+1

Last weekend I was the one doing the jumping and that sounds very accurate.

[JunkyII]

Oh yes I always like to HO blast jugs out of the sky with my mighty 4x.50 NOT! Hurri has hizookas.

If I did HO I would rather have 4 50s then 1 30mm....easier to hit at longer range.

[RotBaron]

Well, one followed me up from 1K+ below (6K my alt at tally)  after he recently took off from his base, I dropped my ord on town maintaing dive and then leveling out around 2K.  The Brew gained on me  during the dive and gained on me for a significant amount of time during flattening out. I figured no way a Brew is going to catch a D-Hog from 2K out and in a dive at approaching speeds of 400mph, but sure enough he got within 1K of me and sprayed bullets everywhere getting pings until finally a friendly distracted him away. I don't know how things would have ended otherwise. But, is the Brew over-modeled, no doubt in my mind it is, I've seen so much out of it that doesn't make sense. If it were as capable a dog fighter in WW2, then they'd be using it 'til the days of surrender. If Brews can hunt down Corsairs and the like then something is not right. I don't mean hunt down for 30 seconds or so, this went on upwards of 1.5mins+.  

I gonna go fly the Brew around and see for myself how I can hunt down (anything)...I know it can almost out turn anything.

[Saxman]

Got film?

[Wmaker]

If I did HO I would rather have 4 50s then 1 30mm....easier to hit at longer range.

What does 30mm has to do with the point Ripley was making?

[Karnak]

RotBaron,

Sounds like he cut your corners.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

RotBaron,

Sounds like he cut your corners.

One thing about the brewster is that it's an incredibly stable gun platform and it has great visibility over the nose which makes deflection shots much easyer than many other planes. This reflects to real life where BW pilots nicknamed it the 'pearl of the sky'.

[Babalonian]

If I did HO I would rather have 4 50s then 1 30mm....easier to hit at longer range.

Convergence, convergence - if the plane has 50s or 20mm and long range convergences, they can end you further out and earlier in a HO than someoen with a 30mm (and has the 30mm set/adjusted to use effectively - ala closer distances)