Author Topic: The Wirble  (Read 9177 times)

Offline Lusche

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 23864
      • Last.FM Profile
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #90 on: August 27, 2013, 11:40:41 PM »
 :lol  :aok
Steam: DrKalv
E:D Snailman

Offline lyric1

  • Skinner Team
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10574
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #91 on: August 27, 2013, 11:51:30 PM »
WirbleWinds give me THE worst time. I think they should at least have a clip size so that they cannot lay down a continuous stream of bullets.

The Wirble could always lay down a continuous stream of shells.
It could fire all four guns at the same time for the first 80 rounds that were in play then of course the reload in this example. Then the gunner could alternate two guns at a time as the reload took place on the non firing guns. I do understand what people are asking for in that right now we can blast away on all four guns when in reality that would only be good for the first 80 shells. Then the staggered firing should take place from that point on if the gunner/player wanted to do so.

Just to show you some things I have noticed & what I have found online in regards to the quad 20MM platform.

Here is a video of a single 20MM having the clip changed out. Pretty fast even though it is not in a real firing combat situation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugZhqz4AQUk&list=TLsKX2mZ4cpNE

If you look at old WWII photos of the crews firing these guns they always have their hands on the clip that is about to be changed. I think they would have them changed out faster than the guy above only because they were most likely better trained to do so.







The best answer is to get rid of the telescopic sight & put on the correct sight as it had no zoom ability. This will make the gunners job a bit more realistic & a bit harder.

This is the actual sight that should be on the Wirbel. You will notice there are two one for ground targets & one for air targets.







« Last Edit: August 27, 2013, 11:53:30 PM by lyric1 »

Offline RotBaron

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3432
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #92 on: August 28, 2013, 12:14:21 AM »
This whole thing is too funny.

I get killed by wirbs a lot, and I do my fair share dishing it back. Realistic or not, it's getting the job done that it exists in the game for. Is it too effective? Maps keep rolling along...Bases keep getting captured...

They are easily turreted, and they die to bombs even easier. What's the real reason with the discontent? What would perking it do? How much of a perk?

It functions just fine, ain't broke don't fix it - jus cause someone ran to one to have their 6 cleared and now the cleared is angry with the clearee.


Many things aren't realistic, is there any example of a ftr flying through his own base's hangar to out maneuver his enemy. I doubt it, should we not be able to fly through hangars...?

It's a game and it's more than a game, but there must be certain aspects of it to keep it balanced and have the ability to find a fair fight. Is the Star Wars like ack that bursts at you in quad groups at 8.5k realistic? It has its function of keeping you vulturing ppl though doesn't it?

I still love the thread, who is wirblegawd anyway?
They're casting their bait over there, see?

Offline Zoney

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6503
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #93 on: August 28, 2013, 01:08:04 AM »
"My degree wasn't in English, even though my literary agent is appreciative of what I can churn out. She and I are making good money off of my books."

What books ?
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 01:11:27 AM by Zoney »
Wag more, bark less.

Offline SirNuke

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1297
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #94 on: August 28, 2013, 03:25:19 AM »
loading supplies on a gv should have a massive delay, just like rearming

Offline danny76

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2583
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #95 on: August 28, 2013, 05:40:55 AM »
3 1/2? Lot more than that were made.

Yes.........I know........I was being ironic  :huh
"You kill 'em all, I'll eat the BATCO!"
The GFC

"Not within a thousand years will man ever fly" - Wilbur Wright

Offline Tank-Ace

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5298
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #96 on: August 28, 2013, 11:00:03 AM »
loading supplies on a gv should have a massive delay, just like rearming

You mean 30 seconds?
You started this thread and it was obviously about your want and desire in spite of your use of 'we' and Google.

"Once more unto the breach"

Offline SirNuke

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1297
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #97 on: August 28, 2013, 04:24:04 PM »

Offline bustr

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12436
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #98 on: August 28, 2013, 05:54:33 PM »
From this video, the effective range of our 20mm is five and a half thousand feet. 1833yds opposed to our 1700yds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEItGE0SqCE

There is also a view through a optical projector sight for the flak that I can barely make out the reticle. Looks 150 to 200Mil in diameter. Resembles the HTC optical sight in our Wirbel. It is a Flakvisier but, I'm not sure the version.

In this film the optical projected sight reticle for the 3.7 is a cross to 100Mil with a 20Mil opening at the center.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcI0kuARYSk

This film shows a hybrid solution to aiming the single barrel 20MM flak. Glass plate with a painted on reticle with a sliding metal grid in front of it to line up on. Linealvisier 21.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFSgAtuNq4E

As you look at some of these films it is apparent the rate of fire is so slow with these flack that the reloader can make it look like the guns have unlimited ammo until he runs out of reloads.

So the image of the reticle for the 3.7 film is the Flakvisier 35 which was used on 20mm and 3,7. I need to find the reticle for the Flakvisier 38/40.

Lone Sentry has an excellent manual on German AA. I still think Hitech is being nice to us.

http://www.lonesentry.com/manuals/german_aa/index.html

Lone sentry explanation of how to use to 30\38 pivoting ring pendulum sight.

http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/ttt09/german-aa-sight-30-38.html

From a gunner on a 4 gun 2cm. the reticle is the same as the 3,7mm films cross hair. The elevation and traverse are controlled by a range officer being fed speed and range info. Still need to hunt down the large ring reticle from the 2cm film.

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.aspx?from=&to=en&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pust-norden.de%2FFriJa.htm

Anyone interested, this scribd US Army manual explains the gunsights you see in the films.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/112423072/1943-TM-E9-228-2-cm-Flakvierling-38-German-20-mm-Antiaicraft-Gun-Four-Barreled-Mount
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 06:55:29 PM by bustr »
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Butcher

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5323
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #99 on: August 28, 2013, 09:35:17 PM »
We really need to modify the Wirb and at least make it realistic. Granted we don't have any realism in aces like gun jams or other things, but the Wirb had limitations just like everything else a fair compromise would be nice like a magazine of only 80 rounds then it requires a few seconds to reload.
JG 52

Offline lyric1

  • Skinner Team
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10574
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #100 on: August 28, 2013, 11:27:08 PM »
From this video, the effective range of our 20mm is five and a half thousand feet. 1833yds opposed to our 1700yds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEItGE0SqCE

There is also a view through a optical projector sight for the flak that I can barely make out the reticle. Looks 150 to 200Mil in diameter. Resembles the HTC optical sight in our Wirbel. It is a Flakvisier but, I'm not sure the version.

In this film the optical projected sight reticle for the 3.7 is a cross to 100Mil with a 20Mil opening at the center.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcI0kuARYSk

This film shows a hybrid solution to aiming the single barrel 20MM flak. Glass plate with a painted on reticle with a sliding metal grid in front of it to line up on. Linealvisier 21.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFSgAtuNq4E

As you look at some of these films it is apparent the rate of fire is so slow with these flack that the reloader can make it look like the guns have unlimited ammo until he runs out of reloads.

So the image of the reticle for the 3.7 film is the Flakvisier 35 which was used on 20mm and 3,7. I need to find the reticle for the Flakvisier 38/40.

Lone Sentry has an excellent manual on German AA. I still think Hitech is being nice to us.

http://www.lonesentry.com/manuals/german_aa/index.html

Lone sentry explanation of how to use to 30\38 pivoting ring pendulum sight.

http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/ttt09/german-aa-sight-30-38.html

From a gunner on a 4 gun 2cm. the reticle is the same as the 3,7mm films cross hair. The elevation and traverse are controlled by a range officer being fed speed and range info. Still need to hunt down the large ring reticle from the 2cm film.

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.aspx?from=&to=en&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pust-norden.de%2FFriJa.htm

Anyone interested, this scribd US Army manual explains the gunsights you see in the films.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/112423072/1943-TM-E9-228-2-cm-Flakvierling-38-German-20-mm-Antiaicraft-Gun-Four-Barreled-Mount

I would say your right as far as HTC being nice to us. No Wirbel I have found pictures of has the 38/40 site none. There is a reason for that they were found to be unreliable & they moved away from them to the simple wire framed sites.

The 38/40 sites & all other electronic type sites were fazed off of conventional flack batteries & only a few early flack Panzers had them & due to vibration & unreliability the wire frame was the best way to go. The prototype Wirbel had the wire frame & every one after it.

Look at all the photos of Wirbelwinds that sights can be seen on they are all the same this type.









The Ostwind is a little different the one we have in game is the prototype that was put in to battle. The pictures of it show some kind of scope to date I have not found out what type it is. After the prototype they changed the turret & the wire frame sight was put on this also. No known photos exist to the best of my knowledge showing any of the production Ostwinds showing the wire frame site. This is the one that is believed to be on them.















Prototype Ostwind.






Offline VonMessa

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11922
Re: The Wirble
« Reply #101 on: August 29, 2013, 08:02:01 AM »
Lusche getting Rule #4 violations?

Un-possible!!!  

Fess up, who pulled the string to stop the train?


Nice info, Lyric!!   :aok
Braümeister und Schmutziger Hund von JG11


We are all here because we are not all there.