What speed is your actual speed?

[Golfer]

Check your humor detectors.

[Stellaris]

One vital point in this is the wind gradient.  Whatever the wind is doing on the ground, it is doing more of it at altitude.  Because your aircraft has inertia, it does not simply ignore this change in velocity, it responds to it as an acceleration.  Climbing into wind, this acceleration is positive and your aircraft gains energy from the airmass as it climbs, and thus climbs faster.  Climbing downwind the accelleration is negative, you lose energy and you climb slower.  The reverse is true when descending, which is why you'd better carry a little extra on approach, because the wind gradient can leave you short of both airspeed and altitude in a hurry if you don't.

To visualize this, imagine an absolutely sharp wind shear layer of twenty knots.  Below it, you're cruising along straight and level.  Climb two feet, the wings are in the new airmass and they're flying twenty knots faster than they were a second ago.  That extra airspeed immediately turns into extra altitude as your aircraft (still trimmed for S&L twenty knots slower) slows down.

With a sharp enough shear a skilled glider pilot can maintain altitude simply by pulling up and turning into the gradient and then pushing over and turning out of it.  Such shears are rare, but condors use the same effect close to the ocean to soar for hours without flapping a wing.

[earl1937]

One vital point in this is the wind gradient.  Whatever the wind is doing on the ground, it is doing more of it at altitude.  Because your aircraft has inertia, it does not simply ignore this change in velocity, it responds to it as an acceleration.  Climbing into wind, this acceleration is positive and your aircraft gains energy from the airmass as it climbs, and thus climbs faster.  Climbing downwind the accelleration is negative, you lose energy and you climb slower.  The reverse is true when descending, which is why you'd better carry a little extra on approach, because the wind gradient can leave you short of both airspeed and altitude in a hurry if you don't.

To visualize this, imagine an absolutely sharp wind shear layer of twenty knots.  Below it, you're cruising along straight and level.  Climb two feet, the wings are in the new airmass and they're flying twenty knots faster than they were a second ago.  That extra airspeed immediately turns into extra altitude as your aircraft (still trimmed for S&L twenty knots slower) slows down.

With a sharp enough shear a skilled glider pilot can maintain altitude simply by pulling up and turning into the gradient and then pushing over and turning out of it.  Such shears are rare, but condors use the same effect close to the ocean to soar for hours without flapping a wing.

You, sir, air correct!

[FLOOB]

You can test it. Using a pt boat and timing yourself on the ingame clock go 50mph, after a half hour on the clock you will have only traveled 12.5 miles, not 25 miles.

[Mongoose]

Always remember in the main arena settings the time speed multiplier is set to 2.0. So you're actually only going half as fast as your indicators indicate.

  That's not the time speed multiplier, that is the fuel burn multiplier.  You are going just as fast as your indicators indicate, but you are burning fuel twice as fast as you would in real life.

[kvuo75]

Because your aircraft has inertia, it does not simply ignore this change in velocity, it responds to it as an acceleration.  Climbing into wind, this acceleration is positive and your aircraft gains energy from the airmass as it climbs, and thus climbs faster. 

the air is less dense though? does it have the same inertia?

[FLOOB]

  That's not the time speed multiplier, that is the fuel burn multiplier.  You are going just as fast as your indicators indicate, but you are burning fuel twice as fast as you would in real life.

Wrong, the time speed in arena settings is set to 2. Check the clock, check how fast the sun moves.

[hitech]

Wrong, the time speed in arena settings is set to 2. Check the clock, check how fast the sun moves.

That is only game time,I.E. how fast the sun moves. and nothing to do with plane performance.

If you time with your watch the game is completely real time for performance. I.E. if you climb rate is 1000 ft per min, and you are at 5000 feet, looking at your watch (oops I'm old school , I mean your cell phone) you will see in 1 min you are exactly at 6000 ft.

HiTech

[hitech]

One vital point in this is the wind gradient.  Whatever the wind is doing on the ground, it is doing more of it at altitude.  Because your aircraft has inertia, it does not simply ignore this change in velocity, it responds to it as an acceleration.  Climbing into wind, this acceleration is positive and your aircraft gains energy from the airmass as it climbs, and thus climbs faster.  Climbing downwind the accelleration is negative, you lose energy and you climb slower.  The reverse is true when descending, which is why you'd better carry a little extra on approach, because the wind gradient can leave you short of both airspeed and altitude in a hurry if you don't.

To visualize this, imagine an absolutely sharp wind shear layer of twenty knots.  Below it, you're cruising along straight and level.  Climb two feet, the wings are in the new airmass and they're flying twenty knots faster than they were a second ago.  That extra airspeed immediately turns into extra altitude as your aircraft (still trimmed for S&L twenty knots slower) slows down.

With a sharp enough shear a skilled glider pilot can maintain altitude simply by pulling up and turning into the gradient and then pushing over and turning out of it.  Such shears are rare, but condors use the same effect close to the ocean to soar for hours without flapping a wing.

I of course agree, but for every one else, NOTE the key to his statement is the wind is not constant speed, but is continually increasing speed as the altitude is increased.

HiTech

[earl1937]

I of course agree, but for every one else, NOTE the key to his statement is the wind is not constant speed, but is continually increasing speed as the altitude is increased.

HiTech

Hooray! Someone finally got it right! The wind is never constant from sea level to 10,000, feet, changing usually to a more or faster speed as altitude is gained. That does not affect the climb rate like it does when climbing downwing, with the same wind gradient in place. That was my point all along, but no one ever mentioned it, except Hi Tech! When climbing into the wind, as the wind speed increases with altitude, your AOA will change slightly and become a little steeper, in order to maintain the 1,000 foot rate of climb, therefore you will get to 10,000 feet quicker.

[FLOOB]

That is only game time,I.E. how fast the sun moves. and nothing to do with plane performance.

If you time with your watch the game is completely real time for performance. I.E. if you climb rate is 1000 ft per min, and you are at 5000 feet, looking at your watch (oops I'm old school , I mean your cell phone) you will see in 1 min you are exactly at 6000 ft.

HiTech

So the minute hand on the cockpit clock is moving at least 1000 feet per minute, and the minute hand on the cockpit clock in the plane sitting in the hangar is only moving a few centimeters per minute, should Bustr make a gunsight that compensates for time dilation?

[doright]

your aircraft will climb faster in feet per minute into the wind than it will climbing down wind.

Excellent point about wind gradient and inertia of the aircraft.

Only point I would make is if your holding a 1000fpm climb, the wind still wont make a difference. If you're holding a climb speed that approximates 1000fpm then the wind profile will make a difference.

[hitech]

your aircraft will climb faster in feet per minute into the wind than it will climbing down wind.

Excellent point about wind gradient and inertia of the aircraft.

Only point I would make is if your holding a 1000fpm climb, the wind still wont make a difference. If you're holding a climb speed that approximates 1000fpm then the wind profile will make a difference.

Earls statement is 100% incorrect. The basic statement that a head wind increases your climb rate is completely inaccurate. Stating so is completely ignoring the basic definitions of distance , velocity and acceleration and time.

Winds speeds do not always increase as altitude increases,and rarely stay the same direction as altitude changes. Hence if the wind speed is decreasing with altitude  your climb rate would be slower if climbing into the wind.But no matter WHAT the wind is doing , if your climb rate is showing 1000 FPM, it will take exactly 1 min to climb 1000 feet.

In either case it is not the velocity of the wind that is effecting your climb rate, it is the ACCELERATION.
Had Early originally stated that if wind speed is increasing with altitude, climbing into the wind will increase you climb rate he would have been correct, and I don't believe a debate would have followed.

HiTech

[FLS]

Thanks Hitech. You want to clear up adverse yaw now?   

[Mongoose]

   Just to make things more interesting....

  Note that wind speed and direction will affect your ground speed.  The other day (in game) I was headed north, so I climbed to 14K where the wind was blowing to the north.  Although my air speed was the same, my ground speed was higher, and I got to the target quicker.