PC reboot after 5 minutes

[Bizman]

If you had a spare hdd lying around, how about cloning the Win7 setup onto it? Especially if you used the Windows7 backup feature, the clone would contain every possible bug you might currently have in your installation. If the clone worked, then the culprit would be your hard disk. I recall that the destination disk doesn't even have to be as big as the original for the backup copy to work, enough space for your data will suffice.

[Blagard]

If you had a spare hdd lying around, how about cloning the Win7 setup onto it? Especially if you used the Windows7 backup feature, the clone would contain every possible bug you might currently have in your installation. If the clone worked, then the culprit would be your hard disk. I recall that the destination disk doesn't even have to be as big as the original for the backup copy to work, enough space for your data will suffice.

I had not considered that. - I do have a a third drive on the PC thats big enough although only IDE and not Sata like my OS discs. The IDE is currently a pure data disc for all things DOSbox that currently takes up just 1 gigabyte of the available 57Gb. I could transfer that to my external data backup drive which is 500Gb with room to spare.

I still think I have done something wrong in the software setup of Windows 7 and in the process have pretty much tested PSU, memory and graphics card. The hard drive has passed all tests thrown at it with just with exception of a small allocation of space error when I ran chkdsk /r, but running that after several dumps it did not surprise me.

I have reached the point where I am considering re-installing windows from scratch and have been gathering together all the drivers I will use. One thing that popped up in that process is that there are two rather different sets of drivers for the Gigabyte Motherboard chipset so I have just got a reply back from Gigabyte to confirm which set I should use considering the other hardware for my PC. - I think one set is for the AMD graphic card users, very confusing when the board is for AMD CPU's and the file is labelled simply AMD chipset drivers! For the time being I have re-installed what I know is the correct set and will check what happens over the next day or two.
 
My retail Windows 7 is pre-SP1 so I think I might try and download an image to burn a post SP1 installation disc. I have got SP1 already burned onto a separate DVD to save downloading, but it may be cleaner to use an image of Windows 7 with it on.

[Bizman]

You know you can slipstream SP1 to your existing media to create the post SP1 installation disk, don't you? If not, google for it, plenty of advice there.

Since you have the spare disk, I'm curious to find out if a clone continued to crash AH. I can't give any 101 about how to use the Win7 full backup feature, I've only done it once on a customer's machine. But if I could do it the first time I tried, anyone can. The basic process goes like this: 1) Make a full backup with the Win7 backup tool on an external hdd (takes much less space than the original!). 2) Remove the original, plug in the new. 3) Boot from the Windows7 install disk, choose repair, choose to use a backup from an external hdd. Takes an hour or so.

As said, some failures don't show in tests. I've been using all major manufacturer tests and I also have bought the PC Check testing suite. None of them can tell if there's a minor electric failure on the system board of a disk.

[Blagard]

A slipstreamed disc can't be used for repairing Windows 7 should you ever need to. Or so I am lead to believe!

I found the image file for the retail version of Windows 7 professional 64 bit with integrated SP1 so will burn that to a DVD. My retail product key should be fine with that.

I would prefer to clone to another harddrive as it is simple and does not take long, I use a boot CD with various tools on it including Acronis True Image.

I am not sure if Windows backup creates a complete image including the hidden partition and while I have used it to back up a laptop, fortunately I have not required to use it to restore.

In the meantime I want to see if re-installing the chipset drivers has any effect.

[Bizman]

A slipstreamed disc can't be used for repairing Windows 7 should you ever need to. Or so I am lead to believe!

Now that was new to me! OTH I have access to almost any Windows version with or without SP's so I can't either confirm or dispute what you said. But I have created and used the Win7 Repair discs for both 32 and 64 bit systems. Can't remember whether they are pre or post SP1, though, or does it even matter for most repair tasks.

I am not sure if Windows backup creates a complete image including the hidden partition and while I have used it to back up a laptop, fortunately I have not required to use it to restore.

My experience with the Win7 backup system occurred when I had to change the hard disk to a Sony Vaio. The problem was that although I could clone the old disk perfectly, the new disk wouldn't let Windows do certain tasks. At least it couldn't update and/or activate. The same would happen with the factory default reinstall. I made a clone on a used disk which worked perfectly well, including being able to install SP1. After much trial and error alongside with both googling and e-mailing Sony support I found out that the Vaio model in question didn't support the Advanced Format hard disks! And that was news even to the support! Luckily I could find a disk without it so I could deliver a working laptop to the customer.

In the meantime I want to see if re-installing the chipset drivers has any effect.

Waiting for results, hoping for the best.

[Blagard]

 Waiting for results, hoping for the best.

Erm... nope, reinstalling drivers didn't solve it either, and I ran Chkdsk again, this time with no errors. While going throught the program list I spotted another one called "browser safeguard" and removed it. I am pretty much convinced that having allowed at least two sneaky progams to be installed that I would never dream of installing on purpose, a clean install with no rubbish is the only way to go.

I have just finished backing up new data since I first installed Win7 and will now do a full re-install. First I will completely clear the drive and do a full format when installing Windows. I hope to be awake when I install this time!
.
The aim is to just get Windows 7 fully installed with AH to see what happens - Watch this space 

[Bizman]

Err... since you're going to wipe the entire disk anyway, would you mind installing and running ComboFix for testing purposes? It has saved my bacon many times in cases where the nasties have put their roots deep in the heart of Windows and altering some settings that leave Windows crippled even after they've been removed. Download link here: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/download/combofix/.

I'm asking for this favour because you believe that it's possible that your computer has been so badly compromised that AH won't run and I'd like to know if such bad situations could possibly be repaired. Running ComboFix usually takes less than half an hour, after which I'd like to know if AH could be run normally.

[Blagard]

Bizman,
I missed your post as I was away doing the deed! - When I wiped the hard drive I used Seagate tools to completely clear the drive and any partitions and files on it. It does 2 passes writing zeros then ones so that was six hours! Now I have done a clean install of Windows 7 with the correct drivers installed and updates to windows done. I heard that Windows security software is not that good so put Nortons on instead as I have run it for years on XP without any hassle. Then put my CH Control Manager on because I know it can affect the ID of the devices. Finally a complete download and install of Aces High. The only file I have copied back from my backup is the settings folder and offline it all looks good to go.

Incidentally the Windows 7 with SP1 image I downloaded and used to burn an installation disk was fine. I will keep it with my original pre SP1 discs if ever needed again! - Interesting when looking for the image is that the OEM and Retail versions are different. The OEM easy to find but the Retail version not so obvious!

About another 8 hours to go then I will be testing it out. - Another note, I don't use CH Control Manager in AH. It was purely because I know it impacts on the gear ID that I would sooner have it on before installing AH

[Bizman]

Let's see how AH will run with the fresh install!

There's been a lot of negative opinions about Norton on this board. Personally I've found especially the 360 using resources when you'd least expect. To be fair, every AV-suite and add-on designed or at least advertised to take care of computer maintenance seem to do their best to ruin your computing experience.

[Skuzzy]

Norton WILL give you problems, when you least expect it!  It is the single worst thing (McAfee is right up there with it, as is anything from Roxio or Intuit) you can do to your computer.

The real problem with Norton/McAfee, is once they are installed, they are almost impossible to remove.  Symantec has a tool which is supposed to undo the damage done by installing Norton, but I cannot speak to the effectiveness of that tool.

[Bizman]

Symantec has a tool which is supposed to undo the damage done by installing Norton, but I cannot speak to the effectiveness of that tool.

Almost every antivirus program I know of has an uninstallation tool. I've been using most of them, including Avast, AVG, Avira, F-secure, McAfee, Norton, Panda... Most of the time they do what they're supposed to, but there have been cases where I've had to manually search for every instance in the Registry and Windows Explorer to get rid of some deep rooted AV program before being able to install another of a different maker. Yet another place than those mentioned to look for uninstalled AV programs is the Device Manager! Making it show nonpresent hidden devices there are often several virtual devices such as firewalls.

[Blagard]

Norton WILL give you problems, when you least expect it!  It is the single worst thing (McAfee is right up there with it, as is anything from Roxio or Intuit) you can do to your computer.

The real problem with Norton/McAfee, is once they are installed, they are almost impossible to remove.  Symantec has a tool which is supposed to undo the damage done by installing Norton, but I cannot speak to the effectiveness of that tool.

Skuzzy, I have always been aware of your views on Norton so had a look around before going with it. The thing is, on XP at least, I never had any problems with AH and always left Norton running. For what it is worth, I have always used their Internet Security package. I posted the information and anticipated some comments but at least it keeps those interested informed. I was looking to not using Norton's but do not have any faith in the Windows Anti-Virus. I 'll start a separate thread to find who is using what!

Edit: see http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,354717.0.html for that thread

[Blagard]

Well all that work and no change whatsoever. I even stripped out CH Control Manager and Nortons and still the same problem. i.e. With just Windows 7 and AH installed.

So what I have done now is to clone my XP back to the drive. If it happens now I know it is the drive, but if it doesn't it seems to me to be software related problem although I can't entirely rule out the drive.

Edit:
Just spent an hour or two in AH using the Drive Windows 7 was on but with XP cloned onto it and no trouble at all.
Pretty much all that is left to do is stick Windows 7 on another drive and see what happens.

[Wiley]

Well all that work and no change whatsoever. I even stripped out CH Control Manager and Nortons and still the same problem. i.e. With just Windows 7 and AH installed.

So what I have done now is to clone my XP back to the drive. If it happens now I know it is the drive, but if it doesn't it seems to me to be software related problem although I can't entirely rule out the drive.

Edit:
Just spent an hour or two in AH using the Drive Windows 7 was on but with XP cloned onto it and no trouble at all.
Pretty much all that is left to do is stick Windows 7 on another drive and see what happens.

One thing that jumped out at me, might be nothing, but I'd try as a test reinstalling AH and not using your old settings folder, unless that's exactly what you meant above in the bolded section.  That would eliminate every single possibility from your old installation being a factor.  Also, in my read of the thread I didn't see it mentioned, but does event viewer show anything just before/at the time of the reboots?

Wiley.

[Blagard]

One thing that jumped out at me, might be nothing, but I'd try as a test reinstalling AH and not using your old settings folder, unless that's exactly what you meant above in the bolded section.  That would eliminate every single possibility from your old installation being a factor.  Also, in my read of the thread I didn't see it mentioned, but does event viewer show anything just before/at the time of the reboots?

Wiley.

You ever attend a mind reading course?

Having used the hard drive for a couple of days using Windows XP with no problems whatsoever, I have again installed Windows 7 (64bit) on the newly re-formatted drive.  Windows download for important updates only.

I will be as you say - installing Aces High completely fresh, no shortcuts. No CH Control Manager, No email etc

The other things I am doing is back to Microsoft Security Essentials (So as not to annoy Skuzzy by using Nortons   ).
I am curious about what drivers I need to install, so initially none!

I have a few minutes ago just saved two links on my Web browser the BB and the Hightechs main page. So now off to download AH again!

I will check the event viewer if anything strange happens, It's something I never used to use but I have recently used it when looking for the results of my last Chkdsk which incidentally was clean.

Edit:
With everything so basic there was still no difference. I had forgotten just how many adjustments you have to do to set the game up! Ah well, it looks like I will only be playing AH in Windows XP

If I find the time, I might try the 32bit version as I have both versions in the retail pack.