Getting Clubbed

[Big Rat]

SlidingHorn,

When you are online stop by the TA, especially if there are good numbers in there.  Some of us trainers normaly are in there, especially in the evenings.  Catch one of us open and we'll be happy to help.  If nothing else there's normally a lot of helpfull folks in there that can spar with ya, and some are even fairly good trainers in their own right.

 
BigRat

[Redd]

I posted this in another thread but I think it really applies to someone starting out like yourself . Choosing 1 plane and sticking to it /learning it's strengths and weaknesses is really important imo. Find out where it sits in the plane set , who you can angle fight , who you can e-fight. You have chosen a pretty good all-rounder , it has some quirks , but it's nicely in the middle , it can angle fight and it can e-fight, thats a good start.

Be prepared to die a lot , and don't look at your score or stats or anything like that for the first few months - just ignore the fact they exist

Hit the TA and get a trainer to give you a head start.

The short path to moderate success would be to choose a fast cannon plane and zip around at high speed firing at everything that appears in front of you , try to resist that temptation 

Read this

http://trainers.hitechcreations.com/acm-merge/acm-merge.htm


Some things I would do/learn if I was starting out and wanted to learn how to kill other planes



Lead Turn    (the most important thing you can learn and master)

Scissors

Yoyo

Choose one plane and learn it backwards - know its strengths and weaknesses against every other plane

Master the merge    (lot of fights are won or lost at the first merge)

Learn to angles fight , then to E-fight.       (E-fighting is not BnZ)

Fight a buddy that's either the same as you or better than you and practice with him  (preferably he's better)

Never take a shot on the merge   (if you do you just lost the angles)

Start thinking about where your enemy is going to be , not where he is now

Learn one really good defensive reversal or move against an enemy with more E and practice it over and over , you'll need it (there is always someone with more E)

Learn to love your throttle (you can have too little speed , and too much speed)

If in doubt go up   (use the vertical )


I guess I'm thinking that BFM is way more important than ACM if the the job is to kill other planes. A lot of those fancy ACM moves are for sight-seeing

[Yankee67]

I remember getting killed every time I upped a plane.  Learning how to dog fight can be a vicious trial by fire. I'm NOT saying I totally know what I'm doing, and I paint myself as farm-fresh, green newbie.  But, I actually enjoy dog fighting now.  Here are a couple of words that helped me the most:

Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.  Win the merge.

Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do. Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.  Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do.

Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others. Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.  Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others. Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.

I think in a couple of years I'll get the hang of it.

[mthrockmor]

Pervert gave the best opening advice of preparing to die many thousands of times, which I have. The next best advice came from Greebo: You are working for an overshoot.

The overshoot gets a bit tricky though the single biggest factor (other than SA) is the throttle. Most sticks hit WEP and keep it on for the whole fight. Be prepared to chop your throttle, some even kill their engine, then stomp on your rudder, hit flaps even drop landing gear to get just a bit slower than the other guy to force an overshoot. Once you get the overshoot you clean up (turn engine back on, pull up gear, flaps and let lose the rudder) to finish the guy off.

This is why the best sticks end up on the deck stall fighting in the vertical. They have killed all of their "e" and are going vertical with throttle, flaps, etc working for overshoots. Stall fights are a blast, and when you get the kill **very rewarding!**

boo

[deadstikmac]

You will have thousands of failures before one single success. Don't give up!

[BaldEagl]

Be prepared to chop your throttle, some even kill their engine, then stomp on your rudder, hit flaps even drop landing gear to get just a bit slower than the other guy to force an overshoot. Once you get the overshoot you clean up (turn engine back on, pull up gear, flaps and let lose the rudder) to finish the guy off.

Turning your engine off does nothing to help and in fact hurts you as you have to wait for it to restart.

[Yankee67]

Kicking the rudder is, imho, a great way to kill speed in dog fight.  I have a Thrustmaster with a twist rudder, and I have it scaled so that the first 40% of the application of twist only builds up to 10% of actual rudder movement, then from 41%-100%, it travels the remaining 90%.  So if I'm diving in on someone and I want to control speed, I'll drop throttle and initially make my move to a point past his line of travel, then use rudder to line me up the rest of the way in.  So I can crank rudder with a big twist, then line myself up with finer range at the lower end.  It also kills speed, which in a dive that you're trying to control, is very helpful.

[bozon]

Win the merge. 

Study your film.  Learn what NOT to do. 

Learn the exact advantages and disadvantages your plane has against others.

I think in a couple of years I'll get the hang of it.

The main arena is not a classic dueling environment. You dont need or often even can't win the merge because fights will rarely start on even terms. On top of that, you have to consider multiple enemies. Situational awareness and tactical positioning is much more important than mastering a one-trick reversal move.

To study your films is a very good idea. In the clipboard options one can select automatic filming of the sorties. Once you are back in the tower, you will be prompt to give a name for the file, or cancel in case you do not want to save it. Watching the films will give a new player the answer to the "WTF that P-47 out turned my spit!". You can see and learn how the other player did it and how the fight evolved in 3D (turn on trails and watch from external view).

There is no need to learn the exact performance numbers of each plane - it will only distract you! The relative performances change drastically with altitude and loadout. You only need to know broad classifications. Players often exaggerate the importance of plane performance. How you use that performance is x10 times more important. Not every turn is a max-rate turn and most of the time you are not flying at your top speed. A spit can catch a P-51 and a P-51 can turn with a spit - given the right situation. Learn how to use speed, learn how to use a turn - that is more important.

It will take less then a few years to become a good dogfighter. If you have never played an online dogfighting game it may take a while to get into the right state of mind, but most total noobs are close to the peak of their ability within a year. Within a few months a total noob should be able to be an effective team player. It only takes a couple of weeks to be able to enjoy some success without getting blasted out of the virtual skies within 5 seconds of an enemy contact.

We have all been through this. It took me my entire two weeks trial to get my first air-to-air kill in a fighter.

[Sunka]

The main arena is not a classic dueling environment. You dont need or often even can't win the merge because fights will rarely start on even terms. On top of that, you have to consider multiple enemies. Situational awareness and tactical positioning is much more important than mastering a one-trick reversal move.

First thing i learned from MtnMan (and he said was most important) was the merge, i win 90% of my fights in MA with it.

[bozon]

First thing i learned from MtnMan (and he said was most important) was the merge, i win 90% of my fights in MA with it.

Each to his own. However, I find that in 90% of my cases I  either initiating the attack, or being attacked by someone with an advantage and there is no merge.

[Sunka]

Each to his own. However, I find that in 90% of my cases I  either initiating the attack, or being attacked by someone with an advantage and there is no merge.

A "co" alt merge is not the only merge.Most times you and your  opponent  are heading at each other, and as long as both of you are trying to take the advantage their IS  going to be a merge.

The La is faster and above me ..but this whole fight is nothing but a series of merges till one of us won.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmR4WSJTxI8

[Bruv119]

what a refreshing attitude from a new player.   

Just remember that it is the journey that IS the most fun part, every milestone passed every battle fought and won.   

[Delirium]

Sorry I missed this post but I am on leave right now until probably early January. I'd be happy to work with you at that time! 

[FA_Refugee]

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmR4WSJTxI8
[/quote]

That's awesome Sunka.  Great music too!!  Thanks for sharing.

 

[PFactorDave]

Hi All,

New member, here...I DLed the game a couple years back on a crap PC with an even worse internet connection.  I decided to practice a bunch offline, watch some tutorials & YT vids (Many thanks to Vudu15, btw...I'm open to suggestions of other channels, too), and peruse the forum & help/training dox before logging on.  After a while, I felt like I was confident enough to hop into the fray....

Wow, was I wrong.

Having a lot of fun, but I'm getting blown out of the sky constantly, and got one lucky kill through about 24 hours in the Main Arena (late war).  I'm sure most of it will boil down to "need to practice more," but I'd like to get some time w/ a trainer, too. 

Pretty sure I'll primarily be flying a P38-L (love the range-of-view on the 38s) if that factors in.  I obviously haven't been playing enough to have a "regular" time in the TA, so I'd be glad to block out some time.

Arena Name:  MusicMan
Time Zone:  Eastern (US)
Availability:  Evenings & Weekends

Thanks ahead of time, and go easy on the "Baby Seal" 

My advice to you is to learn the different pursuit modes.  Lead, lag, and pure...  Learn what each is used for and what it does for you. 

A big mistake that many pilots make (probably all), is trying to fly lead pursuit all the time.  Always trying for the shot.  When a slightly more measured approach will present a higher percentage shot a few seconds later.

I'm not a trainer by any stretch of the imagination, actually I've just returned to AH after a long break.  But if you ever see me in game, give a shout, I'm more than happy to go to the TA and play target drone for you for awhile.  Just say the word.