Dallas, 1 p.m.

[DREDIOCK]

What really happened. His wife was chatterboxing a mile a minute over the mundane until finally his head exploded

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Peters, as a rule of thumb no. Physics says there is absolutely no chance of it though strange things happen with objects moving at high speeds.

Having been around a number of kill shots etc etc etc I have never, ever seen a body move the opposite direction of the bullet upon impact. Ever! The simple transference of energy means the energy goes the same direction. I remember watching a documentary on Kennedy and I think it was a young Dan Rather who made the same spurious claim. They had to make this claim in order for Oswald to be even remotely involved.

Simple physics. In order for energy to move 180 degrees it would require a greater amount of energy pushing back. Many long held laws of physics kicks in.

Looking at Kennedy from directly above and his nose was pointing 12 o'clock, he was hit at roughly the 1 O'clock with his head moving violently backwards to a 7 O'clock position. Oswald and the book repository were roughly 5 O'clock. Had Oswald hit him his head would have moved violently to roughly an 11 O'clock position.

Anyone else seen a target moved 180 degrees opposite the direction of the round?

Boo

Just watched the film again. He is lurched forward and his head moves forward on the impact, then his whole body swings back probably by reflex caused by his brain exploding. A bullet wouldn't push his whole upper body straight.

[Randy1]

Lyndon Baines Johnson

[morfiend]

What really happened. His wife was chatterboxing a mile a minute over the mundane until finally his head exploded

       I know that feeling,case is solved!





   

[mthrockmor]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSqNx-BXQVs

This is the famous Zapruder film. As Kennedy becomes visible again after passing behind the street sign he can bee seen clutching his throat. His head then clearly takes a hit, throwing it to the rear, left. His body then slumps forward. I'm not sure what you are describing Ripley.

Kill shot is roughly 17 sec mark. His wife briefly climbs onto the trunk of the car to retrieve part of his skull that landed there. He was clearly hit from a frontal, quartering shot.

boo

[mthrockmor]

If this link comes through...

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/changed.gif&imgrefurl=http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/route.htm&h=366&w=596&sz=8&tbnid=-yuqEbTkT5irRM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=147&zoom=1&usg=__JkkZgqTae4sLwvxW9AsB8r0BEhs=&docid=1Tao3iDFj9HT_M&sa=X&ei=erOCUqv_AumwiQLB0YCYDw&ved=0CDUQ9QEwAw

The path of the car is traveling from the right to the left. Kennedy's car is driving towards the "grassy knoll." Oswald is in the book depository, which is located behind the President's car, and to his right. A direct line to the President's car would clearly be somewhere around the 5pm, not the front shot the Zapruder film shows.

Oswald couldn't have fired the shot that killed Kennedy.

Boo

[Rino]

     If this was a conspiracy, it is the greatest one ever.  All this time and NO one can prove it, no one
talked..stretches the bounds of credulity a tad, huh?

[SIK1]

     If this was a conspiracy, it is the greatest one ever.  All this time and NO one can prove it, no one
talked..stretches the bounds of credulity a tad, huh?

Unless all the conspirators are dead. The only way for three people to keep a secret is if two of them are dead.

[RotBaron]

I haven't revisited any info on it in years. Back in high school I was rather interested, but it occurred to me it might be wise to let it go. You know, before wiki anything was ever heard of. 

The last thing I saw/heard that gave a good a theory was from the underpass iirc. The trajectory and spatial alignment was plausible, but then of course they came up with a counter theory...

[RotBaron]

Lyndon Baines Johnson

If I had to lay money, it would be there.

The last really interesting thing I heard, tangential however it may be, was about the personal physician of JFK.  Apparently amphetamine is a great way to combat Chron's disease...? Might be interesting to find the book, this was mentioned on the George Noory show 

[mtnman]

Anyone else seen a target moved 180 degrees opposite the direction of the round?

I have, last weekend.

I placed an empty metal cylindrical container (4" diameter x 7" tall or so) on sandy soil, backed off 100 yards, and fired at it.  I could only see the top 1/3 of the target, so that's what I aimed at (and hit).

The rifle was a .22-250 with a 55gr HP.  The target was at 100 yards, on nearly flat ground, with a 15' berm about 25 yards behind the target.

The bullet entered the container, hit the internal valve, and split in two.  There was one entry hole, and two large exit holes.

The container somersaulted back at me!  And not just slightly, it tumbled and rolled roughly 20yards closer to me than where it was when I hit it!

Odd, to say the least.  And, I had witnesses who also thought it was quite odd.

[Gman]

Anyone who has seen somebody shot in the head with a rifle caliber bullet will probably agree that the front right quarter of JFK's head bursting is an obvious exit wound.  Rifle rounds, unless they are tumbling, create a nice small hole when entering, almost like it was done with a drill.  I've seen it many, many times, and the entry is nearly always the same.  The exit on the other hand, varies depending on the ammunition used.  If, for example, JFK was indeed struck by a negligent discharge from a 5.56 rifle round, as the latest TV show claims, it would indeed look pretty similar to the video.

I'm sure a few of the US Army vets here who were in Afghanistan can comment as well on head shots, and what they look like.  I'm fairly certain they'll agree having the same frame of reference.

So, unless the round that hit JFK was tumbling, or an explode on impact type of round - pretty unlikely in the early 1960's, yet possible I suppose, there is little change that he was struck in the front right of the head, and a very good chance that he was struck from ground level, not the elevated position in the book depository, as the exit wound's burst pattern and position also strongly supports this.

You can't shoot a watermelon with your rifle and expect the same results as a human skull - a melon will usually just come apart from a rifle round, but the human head is much different - as I said, small entry hole like a drill in, somewhat unpredictable mess going out.

If in fact a Secret Service agent did have an AD/ND, it would explain a lot about Oswald.  His shooting feat isn't nearly as improbably since he only would have got ONE hit, not two in the time frame that's been used throughout history to try and replicate his shooting with that crappy Carcano rifle.  In fact, the first round he fired was likely a miss then, and his second struck JFK in the throat/upper chest.  Or whoever was shooting from an elevated position at least, Oswald or not.  But it does certainly make it more likely he could have possibly been the shooter, and alone, if the head shot on JFK was an accident from an agent who made the mistake of finger on the trigger, and was startled by shot number 2 and squeezed. 

[Scherf]

Here's an interview with the ballistics gent whose research forms the basis of "Mortal Error."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZ_MmJ6KfpE

I believe the argument hinges at least in part on the location of the wound on the back of the skull having been incorrectly reported in the Warren Report.

[mthrockmor]

Gman, good point.

What appears to be an exit round is likely associated with the limited photography of the time. Some blood spray makes it appear a larger debris field. The link below shows a diagram of Kennedy's head with three clear wounds. The biggest of which is located on the rear of his head. A front shot would also be consistent with Mrs Kennedy picking up part of his skull on the rear of the car.

https://www.google.com/search?q=kennedy+head+shots+drawing&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=QA2DUrqMEOHhyQHDkYGADw&ved=0CDUQsAQ&biw=1518&bih=748#facrc=_&imgdii=0xU30lyWvcsEmM%3A%3BwVWi7cVjLaaKfM%3B0xU30lyWvcsEmM%3A&imgrc=0xU30lyWvcsEmM%3A%3Beni_5YJhNpBwbM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fupload.wikimedia.org%252Fwikipedia%252Fcommons%252Fthumb%252F4%252F43%252FJfkautopsy.jpg%252F400px-Jfkautopsy.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fen.wikipedia.org%252Fwiki%252FJohn_F._Kennedy_autopsy%3B400%3B315

[MrRiplEy[H]]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSqNx-BXQVs

This is the famous Zapruder film. As Kennedy becomes visible again after passing behind the street sign he can bee seen clutching his throat. His head then clearly takes a hit, throwing it to the rear, left. His body then slumps forward. I'm not sure what you are describing Ripley.

Kill shot is roughly 17 sec mark. His wife briefly climbs onto the trunk of the car to retrieve part of his skull that landed there. He was clearly hit from a frontal, quartering shot.

boo

If you watch the digitally enhanced version which is slow motion and enlarged you'll see that the actual bullet impact jolts the head forward, then his whole body twitches backwards. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1q91RZko5Gw 4:34 mark.

A high velocity bullet to the head does not have enough kinetic force to push the whole body around unlike what's seen in movies.