Once Again!

[Fish42]

when you touch your rudder, when u switch to a gun position, it will return to straight and level!

I just tested it offline again to make sure and they hold the pitch as you rudder turn. Works in the TU-2 Lanc and all the others I tested

[MachFly]

That is correct, you would hold the "turn" knob until bank which you desired was reached, then turn knob back to neutral. Then to stop the turn, you had to reverse the knob in the other direction. It did not care if you were in a  climb or descent!

Okay, so I'm just trying to figure out how it would work with AH. I assume HTC would make it so it would work with just buttons because not everyone has "twisty stuff" on their controls. Let's say you get in the cockpit, press shift-x to engage pitch hold, then you press and hold A for 5 seconds, which makes the aircraft roll 30 degrees. After all that you get in your guns and start shooting at someone.
I see two problems with this, both of which could potentially be fixed. First by the time you press all those buttons you would have lost one of your drones. The second problem is with this is that it is very easy to stall the aircraft. Realistically such features would be used with 15 or less degrees of bank (just approximating), and you still had a pilot up there monitoring the situation. I doubt 15 degrees would do much good for you, you would need something along the lines of 50. That would make things significantly more risky, imagine having to worry about getting your B-24 out of a stall when there is a 190 shooting at you...


I'm not saying this is a bad idea or that it can't be done, I just think that it would be easier to convince HTC that we need this feature and it's not too hard to add it, if you lay everything out.

[earl1937]

Okay, so I'm just trying to figure out how it would work with AH. I assume HTC would make it so it would work with just buttons because not everyone has "twisty stuff" on their controls. Let's say you get in the cockpit, press shift-x to engage pitch hold, then you press and hold A for 5 seconds, which makes the aircraft roll 30 degrees. After all that you get in your guns and start shooting at someone.
I see two problems with this, both of which could potentially be fixed. First by the time you press all those buttons you would have lost one of your drones. The second problem is with this is that it is very easy to stall the aircraft. Realistically such features would be used with 15 or less degrees of bank (just approximating), and you still had a pilot up there monitoring the situation. I doubt 15 degrees would do much good for you, you would need something along the lines of 50. That would make things significantly more risky, imagine having to worry about getting your B-24 out of a stall when there is a 190 shooting at you...


I'm not saying this is a bad idea or that it can't be done, I just think that it would be easier to convince HTC that we need this feature and it's not too hard to add it, if you lay everything out.

I am not advocating making it an automatic function, just one in which you could press Shft + A after positioning the aircraft in the attitude you wanted. For example, coming off of a bomb run and being attacked by fighters, starting a full power climbing turn, then press shft +A and you would be able to man your gun positions without the aircraft returning to straight and level flight!

[guncrasher]

earl are you asking for it because it is needed or because you think having a slight turn climb/descend will help you avoid fighters?  I think it's more to help you survive against fighters.

but if this is added, wont it also help fighters who are a bit faster to just put a slight climb turn without losing speed to avoid those chasing him/her?


semp

[Golfer]

I am not advocating making it an automatic function, just one in which you could press Shft + A after positioning the aircraft in the attitude you wanted. For example, coming off of a bomb run and being attacked by fighters, starting a full power climbing turn, then press shft +A and you would be able to man your gun positions without the aircraft returning to straight and level flight!

We already have these functions you're asking for

Shift + X (Pitch hold) and Alt + X (Airspeed Hold, adjusted from default using .speed xxx dot command) already do this.

You have full X and Y axis control of your guns using your joystick.  You can also control the airplanes heading using the rudder twist function, rudder pedals and keyboard rudder controls if necessary and have the airplane return to wings level and holding whichever vertical mode you've selected without returning to the cockpit to reset any controls.  

It's useful for setting up a descent while manning your guns solo whether it's pitch or speed.  I often prefer using Alt + X and speed mode because I can pull the throttle back all the way to idle if necessary and the airplane will descend without worry of overspeeding.  If I need to change trajectory slightly or add in another direction of movement to throw off an attacking airplane I simply throttle up and the airplane levels off or starts climbing based on the selected speed/power/weight of the airplane.

[FLOOB]

Hire a gunner - problem solved

[wpeters]

That is correct, you would hold the "turn" knob until bank which you desired was reached, then turn knob back to neutral. Then to stop the turn, you had to reverse the knob in the other direction. It did not care if you were in a  climb or descent!

+1

[earl1937]

We already have these functions you're asking for

Shift + X (Pitch hold) and Alt + X (Airspeed Hold, adjusted from default using .speed xxx dot command) already do this.

You have full X and Y axis control of your guns using your joystick.  You can also control the airplanes heading using the rudder twist function, rudder pedals and keyboard rudder controls if necessary and have the airplane return to wings level and holding whichever vertical mode you've selected without returning to the cockpit to reset any controls.  

It's useful for setting up a descent while manning your guns solo whether it's pitch or speed.  I often prefer using Alt + X and speed mode because I can pull the throttle back all the way to idle if necessary and the airplane will descend without worry of overspeeding.  If I need to change trajectory slightly or add in another direction of movement to throw off an attacking airplane I simply throttle up and the airplane levels off or starts climbing based on the selected speed/power/weight of the airplane.

No, we do not have the shft + A for attitude that I am requesting! What I am asking for is this: If you move to a gun position, after engaging shft + A, the aircraft would not automatically return to straight and level flight, as they do now. As it is now, if you are in a turn, level, climbing or descending turn, in manual flight control, when you move to a gun position, the aircraft automatically returns to straight and level flight! If I am in a 40 second turn, standard rate, back to target, and I get jumped by fighters, when I go into a gun position, it returns to straight and level while I am fighting off the fighters, then have to recomputed a different amount of turn to approach target on correct line for hangar or hangars or what have you. After first pass over target, I proceed on a procedure turn, so as to approach back on the line which I want. This calls for a turn to a certain heading away from target, then I may have to make a 120 degree or 270 degree turn, depending on the targets I have selected for my second pass. If you have to stop your turn to fight the bad guys, now you have to recomputed the whole procedure to arrive back over the target on a certain line-up.
Not sure why everyone is making such a big deal out of this, its just a simple request to add an auto-pilot function to the aircraft. Of course, by now, I am getting used to getting slammed anytime I "wish" for something, because most of the "slammers" haven't a clue what I am talking about! LOL

[Arlo]

I understand and respect your frustration (and the nature of your wish). However, I'm not sure this is something that can be practically coded. I'll be glad to be your gunner anytime I'm not flying with my squad, Earl. If you see me on roster without other VF-17 Jolly Rogers, gimme a shout. 

[Golfer]

No, we do not have the shft + A for attitude that I am requesting! What I am asking for is this: If you move to a gun position, after engaging shft + A, the aircraft would not automatically return to straight and level flight, as they do now. As it is now, if you are in a turn, level, climbing or descending turn, in manual flight control, when you move to a gun position, the aircraft automatically returns to straight and level flight! If I am in a 40 second turn, standard rate, back to target, and I get jumped by fighters, when I go into a gun position, it returns to straight and level while I am fighting off the fighters, then have to recomputed a different amount of turn to approach target on correct line for hangar or hangars or what have you. After first pass over target, I proceed on a procedure turn, so as to approach back on the line which I want. This calls for a turn to a certain heading away from target, then I may have to make a 120 degree or 270 degree turn, depending on the targets I have selected for my second pass. If you have to stop your turn to fight the bad guys, now you have to recomputed the whole procedure to arrive back over the target on a certain line-up.
Not sure why everyone is making such a big deal out of this, its just a simple request to add an auto-pilot function to the aircraft. Of course, by now, I am getting used to getting slammed anytime I "wish" for something, because most of the "slammers" haven't a clue what I am talking about! LOL

We do have it Earl.

When you're jumping from manual control to a gun position the airplane does simply go back to straight and level flight.  I agree on this.

If you engage the Shift + X (X.  As in X ray.  eX wife.  aXe murderer.  X) you will enter a pitch hold autopilot mode.  You have to engage Shift+X or Alt+X (speed hold) before you leave the cockpit and the aircraft will hold the selected attitude.  I promise.

Here's your checklist for the B-17:

-Flying in the cockpit (F1) set the aircraft pitch to your normal climb attitude.
-Upon reaching desired attitude press Shift+X.
-Select a gunner position.  For tail gunner, press 4.
Your B17 will remain in the selected pitch, you will have roll control using the rudder control in your joystick, pedals or keyboard controls.

This is NOT a rudder control only, but rather using the Z axis from the gunner position will result in a coordinated banked turn commanded through the autopilot which allows you to change heading as desired from the gunner position.

Limitations:
You must engage the autopilot mode before leaving the cockpit.  They cannot be engaged from the gunner position.

Give the Shift + X a try.  Or, if you have the time lets set up a call and I'll talk you through it.  If I ever got down your way I'd come show you in person.  I promise you that what you're looking for exists in-game and I'd love to help you use the tools at your disposal.

[Arlo]

Very good post, Golf.

[Golfer]

Thanks.

I personally fly the B17 in Alt+X speed mode until I get to my final altitude from which I'll be bombing.  When it comes time to descend I'll do the same and use throttle to control the descent in speed mode.  If you set your indicated airspeed at cruise at max power, any less throttle will result in a descent.  You can also leave the throttles at full and set your speed higher than your level cruise speed and a descent will be the result as well.

Generally I descend around 275 (it's been a while since I've played sadly) and keep my best forward speed using throttle to control the descent.  Less throttle = more down and vise versa.

It works and you can maintain heading control throughout using the rudder pedals which, again, is a coordinated turn using roll, pitch and yaw controls using one input.

[Arlo]

I play infrequently, myself. Been trying to fly more but I fall into the category that some don't (more important things require my time and hobbies are indeed luxuries). Hope we both can play more in the future. 

[earl1937]

We do have it Earl.

When you're jumping from manual control to a gun position the airplane does simply go back to straight and level flight.  I agree on this.

If you engage the Shift + X (X.  As in X ray.  eX wife.  aXe murderer.  X) you will enter a pitch hold autopilot mode.  You have to engage Shift+X or Alt+X (speed hold) before you leave the cockpit and the aircraft will hold the selected attitude.  I promise.

Here's your checklist for the B-17:

-Flying in the cockpit (F1) set the aircraft pitch to your normal climb attitude.
-Upon reaching desired attitude press Shift+X.
-Select a gunner position.  For tail gunner, press 4.
Your B17 will remain in the selected pitch, you will have roll control using the rudder control in your joystick, pedals or keyboard controls.

This is NOT a rudder control only, but rather using the Z axis from the gunner position will result in a coordinated banked turn commanded through the autopilot which allows you to change heading as desired from the gunner position.

Limitations:
You must engage the autopilot mode before leaving the cockpit.  They cannot be engaged from the gunner position.

Give the Shift + X a try.  Or, if you have the time lets set up a call and I'll talk you through it.  If I ever got down your way I'd come show you in person.  I promise you that what you're looking for exists in-game and I'd love to help you use the tools at your disposal.

OK, will give that a try! thanks