Superior Roll Rate?

[Apache]

I have seen this phrase used in numerous posts over the years, but what exactly do you mean? Under what circumstance would you use your superior roll rate versus another manuver? What is advantageous about a superior roll rate?
Now, I am not talking about the mechanics of roll. I know a little about roll axis, inertia, transitory adverse yaw, differential induced drag, yada, yada, yada. Nor am I speaking of which A/C has the best roll.
I simply want to know when & why you use it?

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Apache
I/JG2 ~Richthofen~
"Abandon All Hope"

[Daff]

With superior rollrate you can keep your liftvector on the bandit without relying too heavily on the elevator.
Instead of using mainly elevator to pull the nose on the bandit, use a combination of rudder, aileron and elevator to either roll around or inside the bandit. (ie either lag or lead).
Once you get the hang of it, you'll understand why the 190's were considered "more" maneuverable than the Spitfire.

Daff

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CO, 56th Fighter Group

[popeye]

Since you have to roll to change direction (forgetting about rudder turns), the plane with the superior roll rate will change directions quicker than the other guy.

In combat, being able to change directions quicker than the other guy is good.  

popeye

[Jochen]

 

Once you get the hang of it, you'll understand why the 190's were considered "more" maneuverable than the Spitfire.

Yep. It takes bit time to figure out how to use it but it can be very effective. In AH 190 has very good roll rate compared to WB.

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jochen

Geschwaderkommodore (on leave) Jagdgeschwader 2 'Richthofen' (Warbirds)

JG 2 'Richthofen' (Aces High)

I want to believe! Fw 190F-8 / G-8 / D-9 to Aces High!

Thanks for the Fw 190A-5 HTC!

Ladysmith wants you forthwith to come to her relief
Burn your briefs you leave for France tonight
Carefully cut the straps of the booby-traps and set the captives free
But don't shoot 'til you see her big blue eyes

[funked]

Roll rate is really important for defense.  The Fw 190, F4U, P-38 can do some really neat tricks at high speed when other planes can't roll well.
We'll go to the training arena sometime if you want a demo.  

[Duckwing6]

Think of the vertical .. a guy is doing a HIGH G flat turn below you and you are diving on him .. you can outclass his best turn in your 190 or F4U. (SPit drives seem to think a break turn can save them always)

it's also a great tool for defence..

A plane barrles down on your 6.. as soon as he's about to open fire you perform a quick barrel roll .. impossible to follow for the fast mover (unless he has an even better roll rate)

[Apache]

<punt>

[Udie]

 This i think is probobly the reason I love the 190 so much.  It rolls good at most any speed, especialy at high speeds.  Get a spit closing on your 6 at high speed, start a right hand barrel roll, as the spit closes on you reverse to a left hand barrel roll and watch him fly right into your gunsight   at high speed the spit can't roll with you.

 In the vertical the roll is good too.  This will let you come out of a vertical climb in just about any direction you want to. I also think it makes the rope-a-dope manuver a bit more easy.

 avoiding ack    with the old style ack I could make 4 passes in my 190 before I was too slow and the ack would start getting hits.  Any other plane I can make only 2 or maybe 3 if I'm lucky.  Full aileron with just a smidge of back elevator and you barrel very nicely through the ack, making a tough target.  The 190 seems to hold it's E a little better in a low G roll.

 In short, the 190's roll rate has saved my skinny butt many times, and lead to some pretty glorious fights w/ multiple apponents.


 Which is why I NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED the a5  

udie

[humble]

hehe...udie I'll testify to that  ...absolutely amazing stuff. By the way, 190 is the 1 ride I'm really weak on, if you get a chance i'd love a few 190 1 on 1's in the TA with you. Seems best way for me to learn is get waxed, ask questions..repeat as neccessary

[Udie]

 Sure Humble.  If you want you can ride as an observer in the MA too, although you won't see when I'm shooting    But you can see some good ways to haul this bird around. Catch me in the arena some time and I'll be glad to help you out some.

 One thing I'd like to add.  Although the 190 is a MUCH better turn fighter than most people know/think. Most of my kills in her are at 450 mph or faster after a power dive.  I only resort to turn fighting to help out a squadie or when I mess up. Which is most every flight  

[This message has been edited by Udie (edited 05-02-2000).]