Thoughts on October's FSO

[dogtag380]

Great looking set of planes for next month's FSO.  In my humble opinion, it looks like the Allied plane set is superior.  The difference maker being the B-29's, they are fast, lethal and very capable of defending themselves.  Also, the majority of the axis planes will be Ki-61's, which will be outmatched by all of the allied fighters and the B-29.  This FSO calls for 50% axis pilots and 50% allied pilots.  Given the strength of the allied buffs and escorts, I believe a small change may help both the axis pilots and allied pilots have a good time in October.   Here are 2 suggestions that for the community and CM to mull over:

Option  1 ) Make the side split slightly favor the axis.  55% axis and 45% allied pilots.  I believe this change would make for more epic fights on BOTH sides.

Or

Option 2 ) We could go with the current set-up, and re-evaluate after frame #1.  The true indicator will be the number of Frame 1 pilots left "in flight" for each side at T+ ~80 minutes.  Hopefully the numbers are close to even, but if one side is heavily winning then we can make a small change.  We could alter the buff cap from 20k to 12k.  This would be in line with real orders handed down by General Lemay.  Towards the end of the war General Curtis "Bombs Away" Lemay, ordered B-29s to fly B29's between 5,000ft and 9,000ft. (source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_LeMay).
 
Just looking to make it so that everyone has a good time, on both sides .  Let me know your thoughts.  I am interested to see if anyone agrees or disagrees. 

 

[Arlo]

Option 2 ) We could go with the current set-up, and re-evaluate after frame #1.  The true indicator will be the number of Frame 1 pilots left "in flight" for each side at T+ ~80 minutes.  Hopefully the numbers are close to even, but if one side is heavily winning then we can make a small change.  We could alter the buff cap from 20k to 12k.  This would be in line with real orders handed down by General Lemay.  Towards the end of the war General Curtis "Bombs Away" Lemay, ordered B-29s to fly B29's between 5,000ft and 9,000ft. (source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_LeMay).
 

It was also night raids.

[Big Rat]

Points wise I think the axis is favored, I think it was 3 points for and axis fighter and 5 for an allied, plus I think the 29's are worth a boatload of points as well.  But I agree, points don't matter to most of us that are flying. Doing your part of the mission well is more important.  Most of us don't want a cakewalk for either side.  Keeping the buffs at a lower alt will help the Japanese side greatly as the allies own the high alt fight if done correctly.  The fight will always move toward where the buffs are, although I think this will, cause the score to go in the axis favor the way it stands now.  As most of the Japanese birds are cannon armed and are almost guaranteed one high speed pass through the 29's.  Losing one bomber I think would negate any damage the formation could have gained with ordnance.  As I said before I'd rather see the fight on more equal terms and the score is secondary.

 
BigRat  

[jolly22]

I have to agree, I don't believe the B29s will get much action before or after dropping the bombs. They're just too fast for KI84s/61s. They'll most likely get one pass on the buffs from the near 12oclock position and that might be about it.

Hopefully I'm proven wrong for both sides sake. I do agree with the 45/55 split. It's been done before and should be in favor to work out in this case.

We will see.

<S>
JollyJR

[LilMak]

In recent months the sides have been fielding about 150 pilots. The Allies are required to launch 30 of their pilots in B29s. That builds in an automatic 20% advantage in fighter aircraft for the Axis. A single well placed pass from a squad of 30k N1Ks against a squad of 20k B-29s could make any given frame a win for the Axis.

I can see increasing the limit of 84s and N1Ks to 50 each but that's about it until we see how the first frame goes.

[Devil 505]

I agree with the issues raised. If the last two Pacific event with the B-29 are any indication, this one will be a very one sided affair as well. The B-29s will probably match the kill total of their escorts. The defenders will get on average one pass per plane. After that it's a tail chase at best for them, or they'll be hounded by the escort fighters that they have no chance of escaping or fighting against at altitude. Also, the nature of this setup mean that for all players this will a single sortie event. This only compounds the problems already mentioned. In general, any planes in flight at T+75 are RTB. The events which feature the B-29 are by far the worst in the FSO lineup - very little fun for the time invested.  

If the CM team wants this event to be fun for all parties, then some fairly drastic measures must be taken into consideration.

1. Alt cap for all ordnance carrying aircraft 15K
2. USAAF limited to only attacking 33-50% of total objectives. (depending on total number of objectives)
3. Ki-84 and N1K-2 maximums raised to 50 planes each.
4. 45/55 side split in favor of the Axis.

[Squire]

Interesting feedback. I will point out that the last time the design was run the kill-losses in air to air combat for both sides was very close with the same setup. The B-29s being limited to 20k makes even the Ki-61 able to catch them with a good 7-10k alt advantage. There are a LOT of defending fighters...even with the limitations in type. The Axis will shoot down a lot of planes. 

[ImADot]

In a previous FSO of this design, I remember whole squads of B29s being wiped out minutes before dropping bombs. Squad comms, area coordination and pilot skill go a long way to make or break a clash of forces.

[tmetal]

The .wingman command should also be considered. It has become much easier to form and defend a tight formation of bombers since this command was included in AH, then you add in the great speed and defensive capabilities of the b29 and you get formations that are not likely to yield kills for the axis defenders. Perhaps consider raising the minimum number of players required to fly b29's AND disabling formations?

and the best any fighter can get over the bombers is 28k right? Its my understanding that the wind setup makes 30k all but impossible. I know there isn't much difference between 28 and 30k I just want to make sure I have a grasp on the setup.

just my $.02

[CAP1]

It was also night raids.

 night raids/fights are fun.

[pops57]

You appear to have stuck a fork in the conversation Metal!

[tmetal]

heh, nah. I think it is just that I commented in the middle of a Sunday.  However October FSO plays out; I'm sure the CM's will/are doing their best to make a fun and historical event for all participants.  I bet it can be a real chore to create a fun and balanced scenario when the B29 is involved, especially when the real life event the scenario is based on wasn't fun or balanced.

[Viper61]

I agree with most of the comments as well.  ImADot, myself and the remainder of the 325th VFG got wiped out to the plane in B-29's last time we flew it.  And I had a pack of AK KI-84's following along behind me and blasted me out of the air in short order.  Im glad the A6M's were removed as we're AXIS this time around.

The big issue is that the CM's have to make course corrections as the frames play out.  As long as adjustments are made the game play should be balanced.

I wish I were ALLIED......