M-26 Pershing

[Squire]

crawling through meter deep mud.

...and a minefield and prepared anti-tank defences. It also did have issues of reliability that is true.

[guncrasher]

it doesnt matter how whichever tank did in ww2.  we arent in ww2.




semp

[Chalenge]

I think that's been stated before also.

[save]

Not only do I have a number of books and magazines written both in english and german about the subject, there are a number of museum's here in Europe I have visited that have a Panther, and yes during my National Service as a tank platoon commander, we had retired tank commanders speakers both from USA , Israel  and Germany  and England giving thoughts about tanks in general and specifics tanks.

I even used to have the keys for one tank museum for a while ( we mostly had swedish stuff, but also a swiss hetzer).

Yes tank break down, so did our tanks - how many depended on various conditions, how hong they where put out of action depended more on supply routes and logistics than anything else. Most repairs can be done in very short time if you have the spare parts.

Your sad devotion to this ancient myth is noted. If I am wrong then it is because I have been led to that conclusion by reading dozens of books about the tanks in service, a comparison of the M4 and Panther (specifically) by Zaloga, and been to museums in America and across Europe where I have spoken with the men that maintain these tanks today.

Several of those sources stated just what I have word-for-word, which is why I repeated those same statements here.

[alpini13]

no, not enough saw action.....however, yes to the JS2 soviet tank

[Chalenge]

Most repairs can be done in very short time if you have the spare parts.

Not in the middle of combat. If you have all these books than you know what Zaloga said in comparing the two (specifically).

The number one reason it sucked is that it was hard to manufacture, and so Germany was never able to produce enough to make a difference, and they broke down too quickly to affect a difference in combat.

[save]

you have to take account of the situation Germany was in, and compare with other German tanks. If you dont have an important spare part the Tank could be useless  (or used as a static antitank gun if gun system was ok.

Percentage Operational At The Front:

                          EASTERN FRONT          WESTERN FRONT

       %       Pz IV     Panther      Tiger     Pz IV     Panther      Tiger

31 May44     84          77          79            88          82             87

15 Sep44     65          72           70           80           74             98

30 Sep44     65          60           81           50           57             67

31 Oct44     52          53            54           74            85             88

15 Nov44     72          66           61           78            71              81

30 Nov44     78          67           72           76            71              45

15 Dec44     79          69           79           78            71              64

30 Dec44     72          61           80           63             53             50

15 Jan45     71          60            73           56             45             58

15 Mar45     54          49            53           44             32             36

Overall         68          62            70           71             65             65

[Chalenge]

No, I don't consider that to be part of the problem. The problem is the tank was too complex to repair in the field and they broke down a lot. The problem of complexity prevented Germany from producing enough of them to be effective at all. Sherman tanks didn't have that problem.

[save]

If you claim the Panther was too unreliable because of breakdowns, you at the same time claim all 1943-  german tanks where too unreliable, look how close the figures  are between designs mid-44 onwards.

They all fall into the same category of mechanical realibility mid-44 onwards, the Panther did not stand out compared.
I would like to know the realibility of the Pershing, compared with the German designs.

[ONTOS]

As far as how much action the Pershing saw, I can't say. I don't think the 163 saw that much action, could be wrong yet we have it. The fact of the matter, the Pershing saw action.

[captain1ma]

In the AVA we use the panther as a substitute for the M26 pershing. while not perfect, it does the job for us.

[lyric1]

WWII film.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675075904_United-States-soldiers_M-4-tank_M-26-tank_hold-rifles

[49Dallas]

you have to take account of the situation Germany was in, and compare with other German tanks. If you dont have an important spare part the Tank could be useless  (or used as a static antitank gun if gun system was ok.

Percentage Operational At The Front:

                          EASTERN FRONT          WESTERN FRONT

       %       Pz IV     Panther      Tiger     Pz IV     Panther      Tiger

31 May44     84          77          79            88          82             87

15 Sep44     65          72           70           80           74             98

30 Sep44     65          60           81           50           57             67

31 Oct44     52          53            54           74            85             88

15 Nov44     72          66           61           78            71              81

30 Nov44     78          67           72           76            71              45

15 Dec44     79          69           79           78            71              64

30 Dec44     72          61           80           63             53             50

15 Jan45     71          60            73           56             45             58

15 Mar45     54          49            53           44             32             36

Overall         68          62            70           71             65             65

Nice chart! Do you have any figures on how many tanks they had on a similar chart?

[save]

Achtung panzer gives strenght figures for panzer at the bottomg of this page.

I do not know how reliable these figures are or the source.

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/divis.htm#ger

[Chalenge]

I'm afraid that without some sort of reference that figures like that cannot be relied upon.