Alpha Skins - Errors

[Vraciu]

If you didn't paint them onto the skin the "washed out" areas around the rivets would appear to be where the bump map is creating highlights on the skin. I am assuming you have either created a bump map or are using the default one. As HT said without the source files we are just guessing.

The highlight under the rudder may or may not be a bug that is built into the skin but as I haven't skinned a P-51 I'm not that familiar with it. I have noticed something similar on various AH aircraft that have one or two odd-looking highlights in specific places when bump mapping is turned on.

I have BUMP and SPEC maps in use.   In the current AH version these shadows and flares on the rivets and lines are not visible.    Only in the Alpha do they appear--and that is not intended by me.   They look almost pixelated.

Also the way it appears in the new viewer is almost completely washed out with ALL LIGHTING EFFECTS enabled.  I don't know what is causing this.

[Vraciu]

Here are the source files for your review, Hitech.

[Vraciu]

Last file.

[Vraciu]

Here is a comparison in the skin viewers.   This may be hardware driven or it may be driven by the new graphics files/settings.   What is causing the flashing in the new version that isn't there in the old?

I have highlighted some of the problem spots in the second photo.   These don't appear in the current AH game, only in the Alpha.  I can't figure out the cause.

[Vraciu]

Here is a side by side of the wing issue.   In the current game it looks smooth like the viewer (top).  In Alpha 84 it is pixelated in the areas outlined in red (bottom).      Maybe my vid card is garbage...   (Apologies for the poor screen shot.   Was trying to reduce the file size and it degraded the image a bit.)

[Skuzzy]

If you are trying to get an AH2 skin to work in AH3, you are going to have to do some work, as there have been a number of changes to the skins format for AH3.

Start by reading this post: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,375706.msg5005307.html#msg5005307

It details all the specific files a skin should have for AH3.

[Vraciu]

If you are trying to get an AH2 skin to work in AH3, you are going to have to do some work, as there have been a number of changes to the skins format for AH3.

Start by reading this post: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,375706.msg5005307.html#msg5005307

It details all the specific files a skin should have for AH3.

I understand that but what I don't understand is what file I need to fix to correct these anomalies.   When you guys convert them will these things still be there?

I think I will give up skinning once the new version comes out.   I know nobody will care, but I enjoyed it.   Too many changes for me to keep up with, unfortunately. 

[Greebo]

Here is your skin viewed in the Alpha Skin Viewer on my PC. The only change I made to your files was to rename the specular map from P51D_B_a.bmp to P51D_S.bmp. Also the material.txt file you uploaded is not needed. This as I understand it is also what HTC's skin converter is going to do, just rename and/or delete the relevant files from existing skins so they match the new format. So skinners will not need to do anything to their existing skins to work with AH3. Also you can continue to make skins the way you have been doing, apart from renaming the specular file to an _S suffix. The new normal, environment and power files are optional, so if you don't fancy using them you don't have to.

I am not seeing the graphics issues you have described in the viewer. So either its something specific to your PC or it is down to me renaming the spec map.

[Skuzzy]

If you want to view an AH2 skin in AH3, you will have to rename and supply files or the skin is not going to look right.

P51D.bmp stays the same.
P51D_B_A.bmp -> rename <- P51D_S.bmp
P51D_B.bmp -> convert to normal map -< P51D_N.bmp (use the tools Greebo supplied links to)

The _B file is not used in AH3.

I have attached a split screen view of one of your skins in AH2.  The left side shows what the skin would like copied directly over to AH3.  The right side shows the conversion with the _B (bump map) converted to an _N (normal map) and the _B_A file renamed to _S.

None of the *.txt files are used in AH3.  They have all be converted to image files with the channels of the image files containing data.  That is where the _E and _P files come in.

Everything done in AH3 is to allow the skinner more control over the appearance of skins in the game.

Will your AH2 skin look exactly like it does in AH2, when it is converted to AH3?  I don't know yet.  We just did our first batch of skins.  Take a look at the same P51D skin when it is down loaded in AH3 and you tell us.

[Greebo]

OK then that has changed since Waffle first explained the new files to the Skinner Team. As I understood it the game would use a bump map if no normal map had been supplied.

Vraciu I've moved my viewpoint around more in the skin viewer and from some angles I can see the rivet issue you mentioned earlier. Try making your aluminium on the spec map less shiny and/or your rivets not as raised.

[Skuzzy]

I think early on in the Alpha, they were thinking about how to use the bump map file, but it went the way of the dodo.  You can verify it in the skin viewer by checking the "Diffuse Only" light option as that is where you will see the bump/normal mapping if it is present.

Keep in mind, what is true in today's Alpha, may change tomorrow. It is the nature of the beast.

[Vraciu]

Here is your skin viewed in the Alpha Skin Viewer on my PC. The only change I made to your files was to rename the specular map from P51D_B_a.bmp to P51D_S.bmp. Also the material.txt file you uploaded is not needed. This as I understand it is also what HTC's skin converter is going to do, just rename and/or delete the relevant files from existing skins so they match the new format. So skinners will not need to do anything to their existing skins to work with AH3. Also you can continue to make skins the way you have been doing, apart from renaming the specular file to an _S suffix. The new normal, environment and power files are optional, so if you don't fancy using them you don't have to.

I am not seeing the graphics issues you have described in the viewer. So either its something specific to your PC or it is down to me renaming the spec map.

(Image removed from quote.)

HOLY COW!!!!   FRIGGIN' AMAZING!!

I will have to tone down the BUMP effects some for the panel lines but the metal effect is stunning.

[Vraciu]

If you want to view an AH2 skin in AH3, you will have to rename and supply files or the skin is not going to look right.

P51D.bmp stays the same.
P51D_B_A.bmp -> rename <- P51D_S.bmp
P51D_B.bmp -> convert to normal map -< P51D_N.bmp (use the tools Greebo supplied links to)

The _B file is not used in AH3.

I have attached a split screen view of one of your skins in AH2.  The left side shows what the skin would like copied directly over to AH3.  The right side shows the conversion with the _B (bump map) converted to an _N (normal map) and the _B_A file renamed to _S.

None of the *.txt files are used in AH3.  They have all be converted to image files with the channels of the image files containing data.  That is where the _E and _P files come in.

Everything done in AH3 is to allow the skinner more control over the appearance of skins in the game.

Will your AH2 skin look exactly like it does in AH2, when it is converted to AH3?  I don't know yet.  We just did our first batch of skins.  Take a look at the same P51D skin when it is down loaded in AH3 and you tell us.

Thanks guy.   Looks great the way Greebo showed it.   I am stunned actually...   I will try working through this post and get back with questions.   Great summary of what I am dealing with.   You have my gratitude again.

[Vraciu]

OK then that has changed since Waffle first explained the new files to the Skinner Team. As I understood it the game would use a bump map if no normal map had been supplied.

Vraciu I've moved my viewpoint around more in the skin viewer and from some angles I can see the rivet issue you mentioned earlier. Try making your aluminium on the spec map less shiny and/or your rivets not as raised.

I will try it.  What I can't figure out is why they are only present in some areas of the panel lines.   As if I copied and pasted down those panel lines and picked up some sort of noise that was not visible in AH2 but is in AH3.   Very strange.   


Also the rivets are not raised they are dimpled.   I hope that is some clue to solve the riddle.

[Vraciu]

Will your AH2 skin look exactly like it does in AH2, when it is converted to AH3?  I don't know yet.  We just did our first batch of skins.  Take a look at the same P51D skin when it is down loaded in AH3 and you tell us.

All the bare metal Pony skins I looked at, including mine, look really washed out compared to AH2 depending on lighting angle.   Even painted areas on some (like Red Tail 7, P-51D) look bright white in some spots, and definitely overexposed.   I will post a screenshot tomorrow for reference.