AH III skin tutorial

[Greebo]

Dear god, can they make it any more complex.. 

If you have an AH II template with bump and spec maps its not too much trouble to convert it to AH III spec, its just some renaming, downloading the normal software, changing colour bit-depths and copying the spec map twice to make the power and environment maps.

If you don't have bump and spec maps on your template it is more work to create these but they don't have to be as complex as the ones I do. As an extreme example for a GV skin you could quickly create plain dark grey 1024 bmps for the power, environment and specular maps. These would be darker for the environment and lighter for the specular and this would give the equivalent result of the old AH II text lighting effects file. I'd suggest at least defining any shiny metal cables or tools as lighter areas though. If you don't want to make a normal map either I could supply a plain Jane (i.e. no bumps) normal map that would allow the skin viewer to display your skin properly.

[Skuzzy]

One could always use the default normal map to start with.  Most of the planes have a default normal map.

[Devil 505]

One could always use the default normal map to start with.  Most of the planes have a default normal map.

And they look terrible if the bitmap details do not match the normal map.

[Skuzzy]

And they look terrible if the bitmap details do not match the normal map.

Yes, there is that.

[Vraciu]

And they look terrible if the bitmap details do not match the normal map.

Definitely a problem.

I still think the default Normal maps should be disabled if one is not submitted.

[Skuzzy]

Definitely a problem.

I still think the default Normal maps should be disabled if one is not submitted.

That is never going to happen.  It makes the skin look flat as a pancake.

[Vraciu]

That is never going to happen.  It makes the skin look flat as a pancake.

That's better than having rivets in all the wrong places and panel lines that don't line up with the skin map.  That looks FAR worse. 

Panel lines on most planes are subtle any way.   Less is more. 

 

[Skuzzy]

If you chose to move the rivets and panel lines from the default location, then you also assume the responsibility for creating a normal map to match it.

In AH2, if you did not submit a bump map, we used the default bump map.  Never heard anyone complain about it.

Regardless, we require a normal map.  No skin will ever be approved without a normal map.  Skins with no normal map have no place in the game.  They look bad without one.

All the AH2 converted skins have a normal map.  We converted the supplied bump map to a normal map.  If a skinner did not supply a bump map, then the skin is using the default one.  If the material.txt file was there we used it to create a specular map, if not, then we used the default one.

[Vraciu]

If you chose to move the rivets and panel lines from the default location, then you also assume the responsibility for creating a normal map to match it.

In AH2, if you did not submit a bump map, we used the default bump map.  Never heard anyone complain about it.

Regardless, we require a normal map.  No skin will ever be approved without a normal map.  Skins with no normal map have no place in the game.  They look bad without one.

All the AH2 converted skins have a normal map.  We converted the supplied bump map to a normal map.  If a skinner did not supply a bump map, then the skin is using the default one.  If the material.txt file was there we used it to create a specular map, if not, then we used the default one.

I'm not trying to debate you (and I mean no disrespect) but I am telling you they look horrible with the default normal map imposed upon them.   I've flown all the Pony skins offline to get ideas for mine.   The default normal map makes many of them look terrible.   

The converted bump maps also don't look right.  You're using a sledgehammer to drive a nail. 

Devil 505 has also noted this so I know it isn't just me.

Nobody complained in AH2 because, like me, they said NO WAY to the default bump map.   The converted skins/skinners weren't given the choice in AH3. 

Say what you will, but the default normal map on the D looks bad when forced on skins that don't use the same rivet/panel lines.   The Dora also has problems. 

I've found numerous mistakes on every skin in terms of where things should go (including my own).   It's a judgement call what to move where.    But imposing a blanket map on skins isn't the solution. 

I know I won't win this fight, but you're wrong on this one, boss.  Skins without a normal map look better than they do with a poorly fitted default normal map forced onto them.   


Edit in: Is there a way for some of us to be given the opportunity to update the normal maps for you on orphaned skins?  I would be interested in trying.   

[Devil 505]

The other issue with many converted skins is how skins that did not have a specular map in AH2 are displayed in a high gloss. It makes the default bump maps look even worse.

Here is the default 109G-2: The normal map here looks fair.


Now here is 7.Jg77 by Fencer - an older skin with neither a spec or bump map in AH2


none of this normal map detail is subtle and it stands out terribly because of the shine. Just look at the dented panel inside the rivet lines. It looks like a big coin from Mario Bros is laying on the wing. Not to mention that the shine alone looks very fake.

A change in the default specularity on these older skins can help make them look acceptable until they can be properly updated.

[Vraciu]

^^^^^ The half-orange-belly 190 Dora has the same problem as do many of the D Mustangs.  So the specularity is perhaps the bigger issue. 

All of my D Mustang skins suffered with those tiny squares of specularity after the conversion and they each had bump and spec maps in AH2.   

[oboe]

I think it might be a problem with both the Specularity and Environment maps.  I would say it affects the majority of custom skins for me, even though they are flat green or camo-painted, they have the mirrored chrome look given by high-value environment and specularity values.   It could be most players disable bump mapping off - I've noticed that makes the problem seem less apparent. 

[Skuzzy]

I'll try again.

The converted AH2 skins, mostly look like crap due to the fact the original skin only came with the diffuse texture.  Using the default normal, specular, power, and environment maps was the only option for AH3.  Eventually, we will get around to dropping skins which could not be properly converted.

WE ARE NEVER GOING BACK TO USING ONLY A DIFFUSE TEXTURE FOR A SKIN!!!!!

If you do not like the look of your skins in AH3, then fix them!

All the skins were converted from AH2, using the data the skinner had submitted.  If the skinner never submitted bump maps, or specular information and relied on the default, then that is what the skin got in AH3, the default.  Our other choice was not to convert any of he AH2 skins which did not have bump or specular information. 

Even if a bump map was available, there had to be a set of choices on the creation of the normal map.  We used an average.  It may not be the best, but the skinner can fix it if it is not.

We were not, and will not, sit and hand convert skins.  The skins are there, like them or not, and are available to the skinner to update.

[Vraciu]

That's not true, Skuzzy.  ALL OF MY SKINS HAD BUMP AND SPEC MAPS and still got slammed by the default.    Either that or the conversion screwed them up somehow.  I've updated them so they're fine now but many skins out there are orphans.

I don't think we are advocating "going back" to a single-file skin system.  It's a moot point I guess as what we need to do is determine where we go from here. 

As stated, I have updated mine so they look okay now and will be improved as I master the new system.   WHAT CAN WE DO TO HELP YOU FIX THE ORPHANED SKINS so they look better?

Can we volunteer to update some of them?

I am willing to take on the P-51D to start then the B.   I can tweak them to look a little better so these skins don't take a hammering from the default spec and normal maps. 

[Skuzzy]

I apologize.  I just looked at the sources and found several of your skins with bump and spec, but they did not convert.  There was a header issue with the files.  Sometimes some paint programs do some funny things with headers which the converter was not prepared to handle.

The orphan adoption program is on the list to be completed.  It will be part of the skin admin utility.  Coming up with all the rules for it has been a challenge.

Right now I need to finish the skins download page.