A thought on "balance" for FSO Götterdämmerung - The Fall of Berlin

[oakranger]

 ,  now was that so dam hard to do instead acting like donut insulting me?  Thank you but I do not see anything on the K-4 or 234.

[Devil 505]

,  now was that so dam hard to do instead acting like donut insulting me?  Thank you but I do not see anything on the K-4 or 234.

Nah, forget it. Prove that they weren't there. I'm not your fracking errand boy. Why don't you do some research on your own and learn something.

[oakranger]

Nah, forget it. Prove that they weren't there. I'm not your fracking errand boy. Why don't you do some research on your own and learn something.

I am researching it.  Come up to nothing so far. 

[Dawger]

While I am not specifically opposed to changing the fuel burn, I still think the real issue is one of execution.

The Allies don't have to blast off at T+0 and fly around in circles at full throttle and make it easy for the Axis to come in at T+55.

I ordered my La-7's to sit on the runway a full 10 minutes with engines off and after takeoff used fuel conservation techniques once airborne.

Another method is to reposition to a base behind the front, refuel and wait/head back to the defense area.

But every frame I see a mad rush to get airborne when it doesn't make sense from a fuel conservation standpoint.

I would also love to see some 100 mile tower only radar in FSO so maybe the fight would move away from designated targets a bit. And it gives the dead guys something interesting to do, playing AWACS for his pals.

[Vulcan]

On the timeline of the battle of Berlin, did the Russians face against K-4, Dora's, Th-154 and Ar-234?

In reality yes, but for the LW planes were poorly maintained (some suffered late war manufacturing defects), fuel was tight, a lot of the good LW pilots were gone - and the western front was just as close. Very hard stuff to emulate in a game.

[oakranger]

In reality yes, but for the LW planes were poorly maintained (some suffered late war manufacturing defects), fuel was tight, a lot of the good LW pilots were gone - and the western front was just as close. Very hard stuff to emulate in a game.

That's great but you need to back that up.  All of this, "for the LW planes were poorly maintained (some suffered late war manufacturing defects), fuel was tight, a lot of the good LW pilots were gone - and the western front was just as close."  I knew but what variants of 190 and 109.  As for the 234 I am seeing nothing yet.   Here is my sources so far:
By The last year of the Luftwaffe" by A.Price

[RufusLeaking]

Hmmmmm.  Interesting.  Is that actually true?  Do more people really favor Luftwaffe Iron in our game?  If it is true, why do you think that is so?

My sarcasm detection is uneven.

Is a guy in JG11 questioning that there is a significant number of AH flyers that fly 109s and 190s?

[RufusLeaking]

Over the years I have focused on making most of my setups 50/50 splits and using the plane set and rules/settings as the equalizers. Recreating 10-15% strength and hordes of Allied aircraft just doesn't make for an enjoyable setup no matter how many jets you got.

I don't think more people favor Luftwaffe Iron in FSO, I think that people favor whatever plane set they believe to have an advantage or they believe will be more enjoyable for them on Fridays.

Another intractable issue is the reduced training of replacement Axis pilots in the late war. Even if there was a way to flood one side with noobs, it would not be fun for one side.

My OP was an start of a discussion on how to give a feeling of desperation on the Axis side, as was the case in the fighting around the fall of Berlin.

[RufusLeaking]

...

I'm still a bit mystified by the original poster's thought that the Allied side should delay their attacks til the H+55 timeframe as well?  At that point we would have opposing groups less than 50 miles apart flying circles avoiding combat for an hour in FSO.  Let's advance on that and go for the full 2 hours!

Re-read the OP. It was about creating more suspense as to the outcome by letting Allies have multiple lives.

I grew out of my experience in finding six red guys on my lone plane. It was certainly my fault. I could have landed. (yawn.) It just didn't feel right. In the time frame of the scenario, the Axis should have the feeling of being outnumbered. It is just a discussion. I have had bad ideas before.

[RufusLeaking]

So the Allies get a 40 pilot advantage? Not necessarily a bad thing, I didn't have much to shoot at.

Your overconfidence aside, this is exactly what I was thinking with the multiple lives concept. A wave of fresh Russians appearing on the horizon at T+60 would solve your problem.

[j500ss]

The scenario for FSO Götterdämmerung - The Fall of Berlin is the very late war in Europe. The Axis had jets, etc. The Allies had overwhelming numbers.

In Frame 2, the Axis had more pilots. How to represent the Allied numbers?

How about letting Allies have multiple lives? 

This is not for all scenarios. Just for times that, historically, one side had a severe disadvantage in numbers.

This setup has all of the high end German planes. At one to one odds, with the large pool of those who favor German planes, the Allies need a balancing imbalance.

The scoring system might still work as there would be more opportunities for kills by the Axis, along with more tension in the outcome.

I don't know what the number of those who favor the Axis rides in game is, but I know what the numbers are in FSO of those who basically fly Axis only, with emphasis on German only.

I've heard it makes no difference, I've flat out been told that.  However, unlike most it seems, I don't buy into it at all.   The experience plays into it.....  There is NO argument that can be made.   Those who try to argue it are only kidding themselves in the end.

There is nothing that can be done about it now, it simply is what it is, and it's out of our control.

When your the Allied Cic it is one of the first and foremost issues you must try to plan around is that, your going up against the best the game has to offer in their respective rides on the Axis side. As an Allied Cic you typically do not have that luxury available.   You may have a squad or 2 that can fill that role, but typically you are putting squads in air frames they don't have a lot of experience in, sure some individuals are top notch in some rides.   But when it comes to whole squads, and numerous ones at that, Allies will rarely if ever match up to some of the Axis only squads.

  

[Alpo]

La-7 can not catch a 262 or 234.  Even if they had alt and speed.

From what my squad have witness, k-4, 152 and Dora out ran the La.  and you worried about how they preformed below 15k, try fighting the La above 15k.

   And... from what MY squad witnessed in AR234s, the Russian rides can do quite well against it, check the logs.  Oh, and we were at 20K so don't think we were anywhere near your best performance altitudes.  When bombers have an alt cap the defending fighters will be able to catch them by being above. 

[Nefarious]

  And... from what MY squad witnessed in AR234s, the Russian rides can do quite well against it, check the logs.  Oh, and we were at 20K so don't think we were anywhere near your best performance altitudes.  When bombers have an alt cap the defending fighters will be able to catch them by being above.

We did a pretty good job engaging the 234s at A80 in Frame 2, shot several down and smoked others. Had we scouted the NW of A80, we would have faired even better.

[oakranger]

  And... from what MY squad witnessed in AR234s, the Russian rides can do quite well against it, check the logs.  Oh, and we were at 20K so don't think we were anywhere near your best performance altitudes.  When bombers have an alt cap the defending fighters will be able to catch them by being above.

Did they try evasive move by diving slightly and pulling away or stay level flight?

[Alpo]

Did they try evasive move by diving slightly and pulling away or stay level flight?

Uh... yeah  .  Are you just looking at the flat speed numbers or what?  The La7s and Yaks diving in from above were easily keeping up with us and scoring hits at d200-d600.  In a bomber you can "evasive move" all you want but if the enemy bounces you and can sit behind you with little to fear from manned guns, it's not going to go well.

So to answer your question, I believe everyone twitched, jinked, dove, etc. in order to survive, but once an engine is oiled, a 234 is meat.  I'm just hoping I forced a few Allies to land in order to take on more ammo