question about ditches

[1stpar3]

Had a great fight this morning on Grinder, right after map change. Fought a yak3 down low on the water between our bases, for several minutes! Was big fun, even though I put the last of my ammo in him in first few loops. YES, I was worried Managed to stay behind him for some time before he stalled into the water. SO question was, after he crashed he didnt give a kill,proxy or nothing? Not a big deal, as the experience of fighting him was worth enough already...just wondering why no kill was awarded? It was over water, not exactly sure how close to his base A80 knight. What decides a ditch or proxy? There were several folk inside proxy range and no one knew who it was. Had to look at film to find out. Just wondering 

[Kingpin]

just wondering why no kill was awarded? It was over water, not exactly sure how close to his base A80 knight. What decides a ditch or proxy?

It is my understanding that the closest base, including Task Groups, will determine if it is a ditch or a capture (for aircraft).  Being closer to a friendly base results in a ditch (no kill awarded).  Being closer to an enemy base results in a capture (which gives a proxy kill).  This is true whether landed (and not on a runway or hanger surface) or safely bailed out (chute opened). 

While it may appear that your base was the closest, it is possible there was an enemy Task Group near by (especially on or near water).  If his TG was closer to him than your base, he would get a ditch and no kill would be awarded.

<S>
Kingpin

[Lusche]

It is my understanding that the closest base, including Task Groups, will determine if it is a ditch or a capture (for aircraft).  Being closer to a friendly base results in a ditch (no kill awarded).  Being closer to an enemy base results in a capture (which gives a proxy kill).  This is true whether landed (and not on a runway or hanger surface) or safely bailed out (chute opened). 

This is absolutely correct sans the bailing part. If the enemy bails, you will get a kill (if you were the one who did most damage to him, or, of no one shot him, are in proxy kill range)

[1stpar3]

Ah,ok thanks. Well I shot him up pretty well So now, I think we were near his base,well closer to his than mine. I was thinking ditch was only if no damage, but understand. What is a MANEUVER KILL! Which was in essence what happened, he stalled and hit the water. Guess since he was only 60 IAS he crashed safely I was out of ammo, but wouldnt have strafed him on the water anyway! Too, giddy about the fight  

[Kingpin]

This is absolutely correct sans the bailing part. If the enemy bails, you will get a kill (if you were the one who did most damage to him, or, of no one shot him, are in proxy kill range)

Yes, if you have hit the enemy (the most) or are in within proxy range when an enemy bails, then you will also get a kill.  I was trying to simplify the statement about base proximity too much, so the part about bailing wound up poorly explained.

Thanks for correcting that, Lusche!

<S>
Kingpin

[1stpar3]

  It was a GREAT fight against a plane I struggle with,Yak-3. Squirrely little buggers I just didnt think they could ditch after taking damage, well on water anyway. So what counts for a MANEUVER KILL? He was real slow when he hit, so didnt "explode" just wondering  

[Kingpin]

It was a GREAT fight against a plane I struggle with,Yak-3. Squirrely little buggers I just didnt think they could ditch after taking damage, well on water anyway. So what counts for a MANEUVER KILL? He was real slow when he hit, so didnt "explode" just wondering

The enemy can get a ditch after taking damage provided he ditches in friendly territory (ditches closer to a friendly base or TF than an enemy one).  In the case of your Yak-3, if he didn't explode upon crashing and you didn't get awarded a kill, he either got a ditch or someone else did more damage to him and they were awarded the kill.

I believe that "maneuver kill" is just another term for what most players call a "proxy" or proximity kill.  This is awarded if you are the closest player to an enemy that crashes, bails or is captured (i.e. ditches in your territory) and no player still in flight has done damage to him that sortie. 

Note: I mention "still in flight that sortie" because there are cases when you can get a proxy kill on a combat-damaged enemy.  For example, if two players head-on or collide and your friendly winds up in tower before the enemy crashes or bails, you can get a proxy.  In this case, the enemy has damage, but it was done by a player who is no longer in flight on that sortie, so the system looks to award the kill to someone in proximity range.

This is just another reason to avoid HO's/collisions, as you can collect the kills from those who don't avoid them! 

Hope this info helps!

<S>
Kingpin

[1stpar3]

Yes helped! Thanks! Hated to even ask, as it was a great fight against a plane I struggle with! Appreciate the explanation,sirs!