Author Topic: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half  (Read 2397 times)

Offline Krusty

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2017, 07:26:57 AM »
I would clarify I'm not asking for this to be permanent. I'm not saying it's the best ultimate solution ever of all time. I'm saying it would improve the game dynamics a bit and, as Bustr put it, energize the playerbase online.

Yes, I understand and recognize that a small team can still take bases, IF everything goes perfectly. But I also rarely see things to perfectly and that's where you get the quagmire.

I'm not saying it's the best solution, but I think it might be worth a shot to make base taking easier. It would lead to a more rapidly changing map situation, which would lead to more enthusiasm to take fields, which will encourage more action because it's more plausible and realistic to take bases without organizing half the team to join you.

Is it perfect? No. But hey say HTC does this, and reduces requirements by half. Okay, what's the loss? What's the down side? It's nothing that can't be easily changed later if the situation changes 6 months from now.

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2017, 09:58:44 AM »
so instead of it taking 4 M3's to resupply the town you want it to to be 2 or less?

Yup, that will help.

Offline Lusche

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2017, 10:33:04 AM »
so instead of it taking 4 M3's to resupply the town you want it to to be 2 or less?

Yup, that will help.

Lowering the % of buildings destroyed for WF has no direct influence on resupply requirements, which are strictly time based.

(That's why I'm wondering about players constantly calling out the number of objects resupplied by their drop instead of calling out "45 minutes left on town" or so )
« Last Edit: October 20, 2017, 10:35:10 AM by Lusche »
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Offline bustr

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2017, 01:55:38 PM »
Please will someone explain how the function specific to player resupply of the town works versus the rebuild timer for the town. What is being accomplished then by the player resupply?
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Offline 1ijac

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2017, 02:50:35 PM »
The way I see it, base capture depends on many factors the way things are set up now.  How many vehicle spawns into the base, both friendly and enemy?  Has the defending country's City and AAA strats been hit?  Are there willing defenders that will up a resupply goon at another base and fly a resupply box to a base that has no vehicle spawn?  Are there defenders that will up when there are many enemy circling over the base? 

There are strategic moves that enhance base captures and they aren't done quickly:

1.  First and foremost, you beat the heck out of the defending country's AAA.  Once done, base and town auto guns will stay down longer, but restore to immediate active status once your country takes the base.  If your country went around deacking towns, bases, etc. once the AAA has been hit, it creates more opportunities, because the defending countries have to watch more deacked bases.

2.  You hit the defending country's City strat.  This makes the town buildings stay destroyed longer.  This can be a double edged sword though.  If the defending country's City is hit too hard, then when your country takes the base, the town buildings are not immediately restored and still carry the downtimes from the prior country.  It allows the other country to deack the town and the town is still white flag.  I think when the City strat is down less than 15-20%, it gives the capturing country enough time to capture without having to resupply it with multiple loads of supplies after the capture to get rid of the white flag status.

3.  Someone needs to kill the barracks or the vehicle hangers of the bases that spawn into the base you want to capture.  This kills the resupply unless they fly a resupply goon into the town or base.  Hitting the Troop Facility strat has the same double edged sword as hitting the defending country's City strat.  The barracks will retain the downtimes from the defending country's troop strat status.  Sometimes that can be a bad thing.

4.  You can close the base by killing all the hangers.  This may take more people depending on what you may use to kill the hangers.

I believe hitting the enemy's AAA strat is the most effective way to prepare for capturing bases.  If you get that AAA strat to 0% active, the downtimes for auto ack will be close to 3 hours.  You deack the targeted town (8 auto guns), You white flag the town in one pass with bombers. You have a goon or troop carrying vehicle nearby and there you go.  The more the AAA and City strats of a defending country is destroyed, the less players it takes to capture the base.  Many bases are captured by one player when the circumstances are right.  I have started by killing town ack, then upped lancasters to white flag the town in one pass, then upped troops to take the base with no help from anyone else.

Base captures can be accomplished with just 1 or 2 players if you prepare by hitting the strats.  Again, there are many factors that come into play during base captures.  Sometimes you hit a brick wall of defenders or one defender is in a parachute near the map room under a tree.  He shoots some of the troops with his .45 handgun.  Things would get boring if you were successful in every attempt.

With the above thoughts, lowering the % of buildings for white flag would enhance base captures even more and enable one bomber formation to definitely white flag a town in one pass.  The real question I have is what promotes the most combat?  Bases are just chess pieces taken from one another.  I would tend to not support lowering the % of buildings needed for white flag with the other parameters the way they are in the game.  If say town building hardness was increased, then decreasing the % of buildings may make perfect sense.  Just my thoughts.

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Offline 1ijac

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2017, 02:59:15 PM »
Please will someone explain how the function specific to player resupply of the town works versus the rebuild timer for the town. What is being accomplished then by the player resupply?

A load of field supply removes 10 minutes off the downtime of the rebuild timer.  Say the rebuild timer is 30 minutes downtime on town buildings.  The buildings are hit and the rebuild timer starts the countdown.  3 resupply loads could be brought in immediately and the buildings are up again in the time it took to get the supplies to the town.  The rebuild timer keeps ticking, but you shorten the downtime by 10 minutes each time the resupply box is dropped. 

If the country's City strat is hit, then the town buildings will stay down longer (rebuild time is increased)

one-eye
« Last Edit: October 20, 2017, 03:05:05 PM by 1ijac »
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Offline bustr

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2017, 03:18:48 PM »
I would tend to not support lowering the % of buildings needed for white flag with the other parameters the way they are in the game.  If say town building hardness was increased, then decreasing the % of buildings may make perfect sense.

This keeps the status quo that currently impacts base captures and causes players to get bored, not charged up, and self motivated to keep attacking things. They don't feel like winners, that majority of the community who show up to go piu, piu, piu for a few hours. We don't have the numbers right now to over come the settings that were imposed over years of growing numbers and how NOE hoard missions killed game play in each country by the hoards avoiding each other. The current settings used to not exist with small numbers of players creating activity all over the maps, then the growing number of missions happened because if a few can have fun and win easily, a group can rule the arena for a night and feel like winners.

Human nature dosen't change from generation to generation, just the different cosmetics they drag along calling that the new era, convinced they are completely different from the previous generations. Everyone wants to win with the least amount of risk to themselves, while a small number of elitists cry foul and that they are the doom of the game. I've watched this for 15 years now in this game.

Right now time\distance is the primary limiter in all functions and they are tuned to an earlier era of giant hoards avoiding combat. That is why small groups like we have today bog down and everyone gets bored. There was a time in our game the numbers we have now were normal long ago, and the time\distance was lower in sync with the numbers. Bad graphics and all. :O
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This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline lunatic1

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2017, 03:34:41 PM »
 
One stinking formation of lancs or 24’s will WF a town.  Make it harder if anything. 

In fact...The hardiness of town buildings should correspond with the city Strat.  Harden it.
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Offline bustr

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2017, 03:38:27 PM »
And Hitech is testing M3's because of things like this....
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline lunatic1

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2017, 03:48:10 PM »
jeez now people want to make it easier to take a base which= rolling bases= 1 country winning all or most of the maps.

why don't HTC just shut the game down, then you can go play the easy games.

I think it should be harder to take a base. divide the base into 2 tasks in order to win the base have you gotta wf town and wf the base as well.
but put a 2k gv barrier around the base so you have to take it with planes and goons
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Offline Zener

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Re: Wish: Reduce white flag requirements by half
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2017, 11:06:29 PM »
Hope I'm not hijacking the thread, but...

I often wondered how game play might be affected if the town and base were linked but separately captured things.  Losing the town associated with a base might, for example, automatically limit all loadouts to half.  Half ammo in planes, half bomb loadouts, half fuel selected.  That would be the incentive to defend the town.  If you lose it, you still have a base but limited capability, making it easier for an enemy to take the field than if the town wasn't taken first.  If an enemy captures the field first, they have the half-loadouts until they take the town.  And the town-capturing troops would have to come from a different base.

M3/Goon/Skudzifutzer resupply might then have to be divided between town and base, depending on which one looks to fall first, making quick resupps not such a seemingly automatic thing.

Thoughts? 
« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 11:09:42 PM by Zener »