Author Topic: Harassment Policy?  (Read 7136 times)

Offline 100Coogn

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #45 on: April 17, 2018, 10:53:41 PM »
now you tell me!!??  :bhead

He's a witch!!  Hang him!!   :rolleyes:

Coogan
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From Wiley: If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
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AHIII: Coogan
RDR2: Coogan_Bear
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Offline Lazerr

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #46 on: April 18, 2018, 01:34:23 AM »
See Rule #4
« Last Edit: April 18, 2018, 05:42:23 AM by Skuzzy »

Offline Gman

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #47 on: April 18, 2018, 01:35:33 AM »
 
Quote
See Rule #4
« Last Edit: April 18, 2018, 05:43:01 AM by Skuzzy »

Offline Vinkman

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #48 on: April 18, 2018, 01:33:15 PM »
It seems that there’s a lot of good examples of what could be used.

It’s my opinion that a TOS is valuable. I don’t think this community would object to adhering to the same rules of behavior they respect at work, in public, etc.

I think the moratorium on political debate in CH200 is a great example of people keeping the game fun for all.

Mutha


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It's not that valuable.  People know what good and bad behavior is. A printed policy created "rules" that people then hide behind or demand action be taken because X said or did Y.  If this were my company, I would reserve the right to act unilaterally and not be restricted by a printed policy.  That's probably why there isn't one.  If you have a complaint, send an e-mail and trust HTC.  If you are looking to quote policy to others or police the game, that's HTC's job.  If you get a warning, heed it.  :salute

Who is John Galt?

Offline FLS

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #49 on: April 18, 2018, 02:20:47 PM »
So remind me why the forum needs posted rules?  :headscratch:

Offline Wiley

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2018, 02:28:53 PM »
So remind me why the forum needs posted rules?  :headscratch:

IMO it doesn't, but that horse was dust long before I showed up here.  HT's made his choices.

Wiley.
If you think you are having a 1v1 in the Main Arena, your SA has failed you.

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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2018, 02:53:48 PM »
For as long as I can remember, I don't recall ever seeing a BBS, message boards or forums ( community, support, Help , etc...) ever not having posting rules...

Only select forums / message boards similar to Flame Warriors and BBS' like that would be type of BBS that didn't have posting rules

Note: it's been so long ago since I visited Flame warriors that I don't even remember if they had rules or not....i just remember that it was relaxed and people could pretty much post anything they desired


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Offline Dundee

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2018, 03:17:16 PM »
The best way to avoid the drama is to de tune 200

Offline 100Coogn

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2018, 03:36:19 PM »
The best way to avoid the drama is to de tune 200

That certainly is a good way to avoid the drama.
I leave 200 turned on for the cross-country communication.  I have faith that when things get too bad that a Mod will take care of it.
Unlike some folks though, I don't have any youngsters watching me as I play, so I don't let too many things bug me.

Coogan
Quote
From Wiley: If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Game Id's:
AHIII: Coogan
RDR2: Coogan_Bear
MSFS-2020: Coogan Bear

Online The Fugitive

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2018, 04:18:42 PM »
It's not that valuable.  People know what good and bad behavior is. A printed policy created "rules" that people then hide behind or demand action be taken because X said or did Y.  If this were my company, I would reserve the right to act unilaterally and not be restricted by a printed policy.  That's probably why there isn't one.  If you have a complaint, send an e-mail and trust HTC.  If you are looking to quote policy to others or police the game, that's HTC's job.  If you get a warning, heed it.  :salute

This is the problem. A lot of players dont "Trust to HTC". I know most of them are the big mouth whiner types but you see all kinds of statements.... I sent in a film about so and so and never heard anything back..... I reported so and so and nothing ever happened and so on and so on. Many people dont trust that any action has been taken and so dont bother reporting issues and instead, get fed up and leave.

A recent thread about bigotry points this out again. Holding aside that there may have or may not have been an incident the point is,
 
1. no one knows if there was a real incident or is someone just blowing smoke to get someone else in trouble.
2. if it was reported and how
3.what really happened (Skuzzy has posted bits of the logs to show "what" happen for real)
4 what action if any was taken against which party for which rule violations.

If players dont see that HTC cares about a "safe and fun" play arena many are going to just get fed up and leave. Sure  the "go to here is "Grow a set!", but should that be a necessary thing to enjoy a game? Over the years I know I have logged a few times due to harassment, sometimes its just not worth it compared to the fun your having. But should others have that power to push others to do that? They do have it because nobody really knows where the "line" is because the lack of rules. 

Offline 100Coogn

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2018, 04:59:07 PM »
This is the problem. A lot of players dont "Trust to HTC". I know most of them are the big mouth whiner types but you see all kinds of statements.... I sent in a film about so and so and never heard anything back..... I reported so and so and nothing ever happened and so on and so on. Many people dont trust that any action has been taken and so dont bother reporting issues and instead, get fed up and leave.

A recent thread about bigotry points this out again. Holding aside that there may have or may not have been an incident the point is,
 
1. no one knows if there was a real incident or is someone just blowing smoke to get someone else in trouble.
2. if it was reported and how
3.what really happened (Skuzzy has posted bits of the logs to show "what" happen for real)
4 what action if any was taken against which party for which rule violations.

If players dont see that HTC cares about a "safe and fun" play arena many are going to just get fed up and leave. Sure  the "go to here is "Grow a set!", but should that be a necessary thing to enjoy a game? Over the years I know I have logged a few times due to harassment, sometimes its just not worth it compared to the fun your having. But should others have that power to push others to do that? They do have it because nobody really knows where the "line" is because the lack of rules.

The so called bigotry complaint should never have been brought to the BBS.
Just as it's wrong to falsely mass report someone in the game, it should be the same here.  Everyone jumped right on banned wagon and took sides, without having any facts.
Shameful.

Coogan
Quote
From Wiley: If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Game Id's:
AHIII: Coogan
RDR2: Coogan_Bear
MSFS-2020: Coogan Bear

Offline bustr

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2018, 05:23:30 PM »
There is no law requiring HTC to post a written code of conduct for the game play space. The forum rules give Skuzzy and Hitech and MODS a quick way to deal with problems which often are started on purpose to be a problem and disruption to the BBS. I suspect what the social justice woke members of this discussion want is something in writing like the following:

Quote
3. Do not harass, bully, threaten, harm or cause discomfort for other persons, including any other members. For example:

    Use of hate speech or racial, ethnic, sexist, homophobic or religious slurs;
    Harassment of a specific person (repeated flaming, personal attacks or posting their private information);
    Trolling or baiting the community in general with inflammatory statements, such as ones designed to elicit a negative response from the community; or
    Posting or otherwise disclosing any personal or private information of another person, or any confidential information pertaining to a business, without consent.

This is a written suicide pact for Hitech and his company when he has already met the standards of social conduct by stating you privately contact HTC about the above kinds of problems after you use the report function in the game to report the bad actor. This gives Skuzzy a starting point for his private research to see what happened based on the logs and saved text chat from every evening.

Something like I posted can be construed as an implied contract to hold HTC hostage legally over every minute perceived violation of the words of that rule. Once you post something like that you are stuck spending all of your time making sure it is enforced to the minutia of the letter to avoid woke social justice cranks with nothing else in their lives but to be offended by everyone else breathing on the same continent.

The HTC policy of report a bad actor then contact HTC in person is all that is required becasue HTC is waiting in good faith to carry out their side of the issue once contacted. It also forces the offended party to make the effort to be involved and not just being an easily offended crank themselves. Otherwise the offended party by not being personally responsible for kicking this off is now having HTC judge a paying customer as guilty until that customer proves their own innocence. Having a written code of conduct becomes a suicide pact becasue it allows a crank to use the letter of the policy to never be satisfied with HTC's efforts until they get whatever it is they really want. Often it's revenge for being offended and HTC will suffice as the sacrifice if the party they perceived to offend them cannot be punished. 

In the end, if it is of real world importance that the offense of another party be addressed by HTC, you will real world contact HTC and work with them as they need to help address your issue.

If Hitech does not choose to post a written rules of conduct for his game that's his business decision but, no law is being violated by it. He does have in place a robust system to report bad actors and will always be responsive to personal contact about said bad actors. It's still ultimately his decision if the situation requires intervention. I've watched the ch200 crowd go to some worse places than what happened recently over 16 years, and everyone walked away with both eyes and all four limbs intact.

It is very sad that we have lost a good player from our community. Now it sounds like people are still wanting some kind of a retribution or what happens after every shooting incident in real life.

"There has got to be a Law to stop anyone else from doing this!!"

Or at the least a line for the just and unjust so the just can demand a blood-tax for infractions of the law. Sort of a social justice woke kinda 21st century thing......
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Wiley

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2018, 05:28:29 PM »
Everyone jumped right on banned wagon and took sides, without having any facts.
Shameful.

Coogan

It's the world we live in now.  The court of public opinion don't need no stinking facts.

As to the OP on this thread, I have my take on what he was saying, it may have been wrong.  In any case, excrement occurs.

Wiley.
If you think you are having a 1v1 in the Main Arena, your SA has failed you.

JG11

Offline Vinkman

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #58 on: April 19, 2018, 02:18:30 PM »
So remind me why the forum needs posted rules?  :headscratch:

because the forum is open to anyone. the Game is a closed community of paying customers?  :salute
Who is John Galt?

Offline Vinkman

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Re: Harassment Policy?
« Reply #59 on: April 19, 2018, 02:21:18 PM »
This is the problem. A lot of players dont "Trust to HTC". I know most of them are the big mouth whiner types but you see all kinds of statements.... I sent in a film about so and so and never heard anything back..... I reported so and so and nothing ever happened and so on and so on. Many people dont trust that any action has been taken and so dont bother reporting issues and instead, get fed up and leave.

A recent thread about bigotry points this out again. Holding aside that there may have or may not have been an incident the point is,
 
1. no one knows if there was a real incident or is someone just blowing smoke to get someone else in trouble.
2. if it was reported and how
3.what really happened (Skuzzy has posted bits of the logs to show "what" happen for real)
4 what action if any was taken against which party for which rule violations.

If players dont see that HTC cares about a "safe and fun" play arena many are going to just get fed up and leave. Sure  the "go to here is "Grow a set!", but should that be a necessary thing to enjoy a game? Over the years I know I have logged a few times due to harassment, sometimes its just not worth it compared to the fun your having. But should others have that power to push others to do that? They do have it because nobody really knows where the "line" is because the lack of rules.

I would agree a certain amount of proof of enforcement is needed so the deterrent affect works
Who is John Galt?