Radar Testing

[flippz]

Doesn't this impress you as being very realistic?  It does me.

Not that you'll have a lot of ATC volunteers, but it seems like a great idea.

- oldman

Maybe we found something for the tower flowers to do

[Devil 505]

Maybe we found something for the tower flowers to do

 

Well played.

[haggerty]

	Aug 1-8		-----	July 1-31
	Kills	k/d		Kills	k/d
T34/85	3236	1.33		10458	1.79
Wirble	1489	1.20		5685	1.51
B-17	321	0.40		986	0.35
A-20	285	1.39		980	1.15
262	380	6.67		778	5.64
Tiger 2	379	6.77		516	3.79
234	23	0.77		29	0.40

So it would appear that all-dar was hurting main battle tank of Aces High, reducing the T-34 to a 1.33 k/d, but activity increased, well on pace to outscore the total of July. 

The Wirble has also taken a hit, with planes likely looking at the ground from a higher altitude, less likely to sneakily take a plan down that is hugging the trees to look for tanks. 

The B-17 is probably the most common bomber taken for people that want to survive their run so I've included it here.  Even with the server hoarding to kill bombers, they've seen an increase in k/d.  I guess more players that wouldnt typically intercept bombers were trying their hand this week and were failing. 

I expected a bigger total from the A-20, I saw so many using it against the now obvious tank attacks, obvious improvement in k/d but kill total not as high as you'd expect. 

I've noticed an increase in 262 usage, with all-dar people are seeing clumps of bombers, or hoards of enemies much easier and thinking that they need a 262 to clear it.  Well on pace to outscore July and k/d increase so far as well. 

With 5 or 6 days of vehicles being completely visible the Tiger II usage is no surprise, people are easily able to tell which direction the enemy is and with a virtually impenetrable front armor, the Tiger II has seen vast improvements in usage, not too far from July's totals in just 8 days, and over 50% boost in k/d. 

Since I used a 234 this week, im assuming others are doing it as well.  If you are going to be seen on radar, might as well take a survivable bomber, no one was able to intercept me and others are probably having good results too.  About the same amount of kills in 8 days as all of July, and about double the k/d. 

And thats all for my useless stats and analysis.

[rvflyer]

As I have said over and over, flight school are what is needed and not just a training area. I am sure you have been to other flight sims and seen how their flight schools are set up with an AI instructor

Nobody was complaining about it. This change has nothing to do with us players that have been here a long time. It is more aimed at new players. If a new player logs in for the first time and sees only a few dar bars and a couple of plane icons it doesnt look very interesting. They dont know that dar is down at a number of bases along the front  and there may be 20 players "hiding" inside those downed dar circles. They just know that there isnt much action going on and so leave.

The whole point, I believe, with this new dar setup is to make it "LOOK" like theres a party goin' on right here!

[MWL]

Hey all,

  Haven't had time to play in to long of a time.  However, my wife owned a business in a small town.  Lots of people had 'great' ideas of how she should run her business.

  Unfortunately, none of them had skin in the game.  For example, if you think she should lower her cost for dry cleaning - cool.  How about you drive the 20 minutes to the nearest dry cleaner.  You think we should carry your favorite tape/color of pen, cool, you purchase 60 dollars worth and we will see how soon they sell.

  It is HiTech's game - it is his money.  Let him run his tests.  I don't care.  It is a great game.  I will maintain my subscription until it is gone. 

  Granted, we (as in the community) need to recruit some new blood - I am working this with my son, his friends and a grandson.  That is where the future is. If we loose the past, we are doomed to repeat it.

Regards,

[gldnbb]

No, it only takes out the "lone" buff runs. Join in the game, get a mission together, Get some cover to chase off the attackers.

Disagree.   This past week the Dickweeds  put together  TWO sorties of bombers.   Each time they 'gathered'   there were enemy fighters upping  3 or  4 sectors away   to arrive  25k to 35k.   While enroute were a few p47s, 110s or 190s  and by the time the bombers got to target were greeted with 3 163s  and the remainder of bombers on the way home.   Therefore I had no choice but to 'game'  the arena dar  by  feinting attack on the 163 base  to  tie up two  163s   to  give bombers enough time to make their run.   HAHA  Arcade style ya'll!


Anytime a  'group'  of icons gather   or a  dar bar  'increases'  it  only facilitates in immediate enemy response and  intercepting.

AKA -  ruining missions.

Oh and makes  Goon  aka c47s  almost impossible to use.

[Wiley]

Disagree.   This past week the Dickweeds  put together  TWO sorties of bombers.   Each time they 'gathered'   there were enemy fighters upping  3 or  4 sectors away   to arrive  25k to 35k.   While enroute were a few p47s, 110s or 190s  and by the time the bombers got to target were greeted with 3 163s  and the remainder of bombers on the way home.   

Two things:

1) That sounds to me like "gameplay".
2) How is that different from people seeing your bardar under the old system and coming after your mission?

Wiley.

[Zoney]

Disagree.   This past week the Dickweeds  put together  TWO sorties of bombers.   Each time they 'gathered'   there were enemy fighters upping  3 or  4 sectors away   to arrive  25k to 35k.   While enroute were a few p47s, 110s or 190s  and by the time the bombers got to target were greeted with 3 163s  and the remainder of bombers on the way home.   Therefore I had no choice but to 'game'  the arena dar  by  feinting attack on the 163 base  to  tie up two  163s   to  give bombers enough time to make their run.   HAHA  Arcade style ya'll!


Anytime a  'group'  of icons gather   or a  dar bar  'increases'  it  only facilitates in immediate enemy response and  intercepting.

AKA -  ruining missions. (You mean engaging in combat between bombers, interceptors and escorts.  That's what happens, and my friend, that is what the game is all about.  No more hiding, no more sneaking.  I love this setting.

Oh and makes  Goon  aka c47s  almost impossible to use.

[dieter]

I really think the fighter icons should go away, and radar contacts be simply dots.  If you want to make it more realistic, take the time period's resolution cells into consideration.  For the time's RADARs, the range resolution was half the pulse width,  and a narrow pulse for the chain home series was 60 microseconds.  The speed of light propagates at roughly 1 nanosecond per foot.  That means the narrowest resolution was 30,000 feet.  Any two aircraft within that were seen as one.  How did they tell the difference in a single plane, or a bomber formation?  The intensity of the return.  I know trying to actually run the real  RADAR parameters is unrealistic, but maybe we can at least go to dots? 

<<S>> ULDieter

[Zoney]

The "radar" as they have it now is a crock. I agree the radar on base serves no purpose. It's turned into nothing but a total fighter game built for furballs only.

Really?  I sure see a bunch of bases being taken, bases being defended, I see buff missions with escorts very effectively used.

What I don't see is the sneakiness to grab a base with no one defending, oh yeah that's right, I could never see that because it was sneaky.  It didn't promote fights, it just rolled maps, whoopee, lets not fight each other and roll maps.

Looks to me like the game has positively evolved into something much more realistic.  Pretty damn sure single buffs didn't do a lot of bombing in the war.  Even more sure that it took teamwork to be successful.

If I was a new player, as that player I could choose what I wanted to do.  Don't want to fight in a furball?  Don't fly to one.  Want to fly with a few other guys and intercept a few other guys, now you can see it develop.  Don't want to be jumped by 6 guys while you are trying to get those first few precious kills, now you can see them coming.


This is better for the new guys that haven't been staying 10 minutes with the old system.  You know, those new guys, the ones we need to keep the game going?  Hell, we've been burying our friends that have passed away in the last couple of years faster than new guys have been joining.

[Litjan]

Thanks for the interesting analysis!

I think it should be pointed out that the FIRST column is the "all seeing radar" one (even though itīs chronologically BEHIND the July timeframe). Just to not get confused here.

Another important part of information is that the "all seeing radar" column depicts an 8 day timeframe, while the second "old radar setting" column depicts a 31 day timeframe. If you normalize the total kills, it is obvious that (with a factor of ca. 3.88) a lot more kills were achieved for nearly every vehicle shown.

So in conclusion: New radar setting -> more kills/time -> more action.

Jan

[Devil 505]

I'm not seeing a down side to any of this.

[bozon]

You forget that not only interceptors can see the bombers, the bombers can see the interceptors as well. They know not to bury their heads in the bomb sight, they can change course to a less favorable interception direction (force a chase) or turn back early to completely avoid the fighters till they are engaged by someone else.

I think that this is a better explanation to their increased k/d than assuming that more fighter players are trying their hands at intercepting bombers - we are an old population, not many noobs here.

[Litjan]

I think part of the increased K/D for bombers is the killing of ground vehicles. I have seen many bombers, even formations, beeline to the ground vehicle icons and then carpet bomb them.

While this may seem like a problem, it is actually (like so many "issues" with the new radar setting) a question of employing the correct counter: If you see bombers up, place your GV so that a tree or house blocks the line of sight of the approaching bombers. They HAVE to see your icon (1.5 while moving, 800 while stationary). If line of sight is blocked, they canīt acquire and bomb. If you are in a Wirb or even better Ostwind, you can really pepper them on their botched attack run.

Jan

[ccvi]

If you see bombers up, place your GV so that a tree or house blocks the line of sight of the approaching bombers. They HAVE to see your icon (1.5 while moving, 800 while stationary). If line of sight is blocked, they canīt acquire and bomb.

The icon doesn't matter much. GVs themselves are clearly visible in the bomb site, without icon. Hiding still helps of course, but that's not related to the icon.

When hunting GVs in a Jabo I am spotting most by seeing the GV itself, not the icon. The icon helps for finding badly hidden ones only. In the open clearly visible no icon needed; well-hidden no icon whatsoever, can only by found searching every single tree; badly hidden the icon sometimes appears for a short moment simplifying the search. (this is without GV dot dar, obviously. With dot dar there is no searching needed)