awesome fight with b17's

[Wiley]

Anyway (and again) I'd like to hear from any of the buff pilots involved. If they had fun, <S> to everyone involved. Otherwise, experiences like this just discourage further retro buff missions of that ilk.

JMO...

Why do you even play a multiplayer game?

Wiley.

[molybdenum]

Why do you even play a multiplayer game?

Wiley.

I'm assuming that's not a "real" question, but I'll answer it anyway: to help a team achieve an objective. There's more to it than that of course but that's a big part of it.

I know you in-game as a fighter pilot who regularly patrols at high alt, seeking buffs upon which to pounce. That's not very sporting but I have no quarrel with it: if I were a fighter pilot I would probably do the same. But why imply people like me don't want to fight when what we really want is a chance to accomplish something big picture while fighting? And I'd argue that many of the high alt pouncers don't want to fight so much as they want to "win" (by attacking enemy planes with the advantage of lots of altitude and E).
I don't bump into you all that often any more but I can't remember you ever attacking my buffs at a disadvantage in order to stop me from white-flagging a town or taking out a VH, for example. Which in itself is totally fine, it's your $15 and all that. But don't you see that the high pouncing thing isn't really much of a fight at all? And why imply people who also prefer to have some sort of advantage--or at least a decent chance of survival--ought to be playing something else?

[Wiley]

I'm assuming that's not a "real" question, but I'll answer it anyway: to help a team achieve an objective. There's more to it than that of course but that's a big part of it.

I know you in-game as a fighter pilot who regularly patrols at high alt, seeking buffs upon which to pounce. That's not very sporting but I have no quarrel with it: if I were a fighter pilot I would probably do the same. But why imply people like me don't want to fight when what we really want is a chance to accomplish something big picture while fighting? And I'd argue that many of the high alt pouncers don't want to fight so much as they want to "win" (by attacking enemy planes with the advantage of lots of altitude and E).
I don't bump into you all that often any more but I can't remember you ever attacking my buffs at a disadvantage in order to stop me from white-flagging a town or taking out a VH, for example. Which in itself is totally fine, it's your $15 and all that. But don't you see that the high pouncing thing isn't really much of a fight at all? And why imply people who also prefer to have some sort of advantage--or at least a decent chance of survival--ought to be playing something else?

You're Havermyr right?  Now Osmium?

I can't recall ever bumping into you doing anything other than high alt strat runs in a high speed bomber.  Of course I'm going to set up properly for that, because it's suicide to attack bombers above 30k at speed any other way.  Even then the way you do combat turns makes it near impossible to get at you from any angle other than the back.

For some reason we must miss each other doing more tactical/field stuff because generally speaking, I'll go after whatever's coming into the airspace I'm working.  I preferentially attack from above, but generally speaking if I have fuel and bullets, I'll try to kill whatever's there.

My point was your previous post was essentially saying "You're possibly getting people to leave by attacking them successfully."  Which is frankly, a ludicrous statement in a combat game.

Wiley.

[guncrasher]

How was I denigrating anyone?
I'm glad you guys had fun, just was wondering if the bomber pilots who got killed before they dropped thought the same.

I am under the assumption that you have never shot down anybody in the game because you are afraid they're not having fun and they might quit.

I didnt post this thread as a look at us thread.  it was more of a testament to the bombers skill.  they flew very well and they covered each other while making 2 turns while we harassed them.  I have never seen and I am not joking walls of fire with each and every dive we did.  we got lucky they didnt kill us all. 


semp

[molybdenum]

My point was your previous post was essentially saying "You're possibly getting people to leave by attacking them successfully."  Which is frankly, a ludicrous statement in a combat game.

Wiley.

Yup, it would have been ludicrous to have said that, which I didn't. What I said was "experiences like this just discourage further retro buff missions of that ilk," which isn't the same thing at all, and which is what semp and the other Pigs were excited to have encountered.

And semp, I apologize if my post gave the impression that you or anyone else posted on the threat as a "look at us" thing. I know that wasn't it. You and your crew had a great time beating up on those buffs, and I've no doubt they defended themselves admirably. The point I was trying to get across is that you guys seemed to assume the buffs had just as much fun as you did. That seemed unlikely to me, hence my invitation for them to offer their perspective.

[Wiley]

Yup, it would have been ludicrous to have said that, which I didn't. What I said was "experiences like this just discourage further retro buff missions of that ilk,"

So... the defenders should have done what, precisely, in your opinion to avoid discouraging these poor, hapless bomber pilots?

Wiley.

[The Fugitive]

Yup, it would have been ludicrous to have said that, which I didn't. What I said was "experiences like this just discourage further retro buff missions of that ilk," which isn't the same thing at all, and which is what semp and the other Pigs were excited to have encountered.

And semp, I apologize if my post gave the impression that you or anyone else posted on the threat as a "look at us" thing. I know that wasn't it. You and your crew had a great time beating up on those buffs, and I've no doubt they defended themselves admirably. The point I was trying to get across is that you guys seemed to assume the buffs had just as much fun as you did. That seemed unlikely to me, hence my invitation for them to offer their perspective.

That is the main reason I up buffs, in the hopes that I WILL be attacked. Bombing things that DONT move nor shoot back as about the easiest thing to do in this game. What makes it exciting is to be attacked on the way in or the way out.

The same goes for fighting in my Jug. I'll turn fight a NIK if he looks a bit sloppy on his turns because its a challenge. I think we need MORE players who put the "action" of a fight ahead of a mission.   

[1stpar3]

I think you guys are misinterpreting what Moly is trying to say? Keep in mind...the day this occurred and well quite often..the MA is a 2 on 1, Horde them all type deal. Now NOT saying this is a bad thing at all, or even that this is why he posted what he did...but you pork chops were gang banging for 3 hours before this mission lifted(I loved it...more targets). So...as we ALL KNOW...situations and circumstances (YMMV) lead to some bad game experiences. I am just saying....a WHOLE LOT of folk on each side will B and Moan at some point or other...so why does every single thing end up being so snide and condescending. Moly to my knowledge, absolutely loves when folk try to get him in his bombers..doesnt mean he cant be wary and point out that some dont like this(some NEW PLAYERS start in bombers as the flight characteristics make them easier for noobs).Maybe he was being to proactive in his assumptions? With numbers as they ARE...I cant begrudge him for saying hold up a bit and not run folk off...IMO. This isnt one of those cases though...The Dickweeds didnt stop talking about that run until about 12:30 AM. Pretty sure that it is because all of them but 1 logged and went to bed! We need all of US to keep this game going...and condescending and bickering will cause nothing but problems.

[The Fugitive]

I think it tells a tale in how game play has changed over the years. In the days of "yor" this is what we lived and played for!  For both sides! We had guys manning every gun and hoping guys would try and jump us. AH has the formation s but you still can add a gunning and fire ALL guns. Combat was the name of the game!

Today, not so much. People runni nbn g to acknowledge, people crying because they did t get to drop their bombs because the mission. got busted. Boo hoot is what the game is suppose to be about. Your trying to complete a  mission and it's the fighter guys mission to stop you. Only one side can win unless your playing the game to have fun and fight your way through the challenge,  then both sides win.

[Wiley]

I cant begrudge him for saying hold up a bit and not run folk off

How exactly does this line of thought work?

Again.  What precisely should the defenders have done?  "Oh, there's a big ball of bombers headed into our airspace.  We should ignore them because we wouldn't want to make them sad."  Or perhaps the thing to do is get into their resupply M3s and goons and get ready to mass resupply whatever they're hitting?  That way they get to drop their bombs and feel good.  No wait, that discourages them too because their damage is undone before they land.

Or perhaps instead of actually going after them, they should send a token number of aircraft to fly straight and level at their sixes so they get the chance to shoot them down and feel good about themselves without having to worry about getting shot down?

He indirectly admonished them for a successful bit of gameplay because it might discourage the other side.  In a combat game.  They weren't horde vulching a field for hours on end in this case, they responded to an inbound mission that had no escorts and stuffed it.

Some might call that "gameplay".

Wiley.

[bustr]

In our strategic assessment we were pretty sure it was the DickWeeds. We chose to not fly 262 even though POTW has perks to burn as a group. We know what that really does to group initiatives and we save that kind of pain for other situations and individuals. We chose to fly prop planes to intercept locked together B17's flown by experienced vets.

Moly and 1stpar3 are part of the reason this game is turning into an SJW nightmare. Not the DickWeeds or POTW since both squads on our squad nights pick fights and fight all comers like both squads have done since AH1. We just pick a field and break it's toys and boys until it starts a fight or we capture that field. It's the MA not the DA and after almost 20 years our squad is very good at being a squadron.

Why don't you wish for a "Baby on Board" sign for new comers along with invincibility mode so they don't get their feelings hurt....

[DubiousKB]

Why don't you wish for a "Baby on Board" sign for new comers along with invincibility mode so they don't get their feelings hurt....

WE CAN DO THAT!?   

[Oldman731]

Why don't you wish for a "Baby on Board" sign for new comers along with invincibility mode so they don't get their feelings hurt....

...so...Bustr has joined the SJW Warrior Club...?

There's no need for this kind of disdainful, caustic treatment.  Both of those guys were respectful in the way they raised their issues.  Making fun of them like this is its own nightmare.

- oldman

[1stpar3]

How exactly does this line of thought work?

Again.  What precisely should the defenders have done?  "Oh, there's a big ball of bombers headed into our airspace.  We should ignore them because we wouldn't want to make them sad."  Or perhaps the thing to do is get into their resupply M3s and goons and get ready to mass resupply whatever they're hitting?  That way they get to drop their bombs and feel good.  No wait, that discourages them too because their damage is undone before they land.

Or perhaps instead of actually going after them, they should send a token number of aircraft to fly straight and level at their sixes so they get the chance to shoot them down and feel good about themselves without having to worry about getting shot down?

He indirectly admonished them for a successful bit of gameplay because it might discourage the other side.  In a combat game.  They weren't horde vulching a field for hours on end in this case, they responded to an inbound mission that had no escorts and stuffed it.

Some might call that "gameplay".

Wiley.

Wiley,if you cant grasp it..not sure I can explain it so you can. THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN NO WAY...to determine WHO was in the bombers, BEFORE one went BOOM. I didnt take his post...OR THE PIG"S post as anything but what it was....A SALUTE to a good time..and AN HOPE this wasnt some NEW GUYS who got slaughtered by one of the better squads in the game. Nothing more Nothing less. To Os's/Molys post..I had no problem personally or in any other way with his HOPING it wasnt Baby SEAL CLUBBING as....stated in my post..those HOGS were ROOTING and tearing watermelon up all evening! It was just an observation from another view point. I didnt read it as an admonishment at all. It could have been? Thats why I prefaced my thinking before hand...he very well COULD have been..especially if a few of his sorties had met the same fate. PRETTY sure it did...heard "That DAM RAZOR in his Mossy" more than twice I am not in Molys head, I dont know what direction he intended, then again I read EVERYTHING before I comment. I saw this going to the same place other discussions here do..someone takes it personally and it devolves into a petty fuss.

[bustr]

Trying to pull a CBF here it appears oldman. Whenever I see a baby on board sign I have a moment of wanting to drive my Ram 1500 where it shouldn't. I've met a lot of citizens with that same sentiment over the last 30 years the signs have been popular. Somehow SJW things like that sign seem to be self anointment's to making the poster of it and their supporters more special than everyone else taking the exact same risks with their lives or in this case their money and time.

So oldman you gonna start selling "Baby on Board" signs for our resident SJW fans? When we take off into the unfriendly sky's of the MA, we all take the same risks. Or do you and others have a platinum account with HTC only the special people know about? Do they also have a hidden shadow forum like bluberry used to invite all the special people to back in the bad old days when the muppets tried to take the forums away from Hitech with a mob? Now that was some real SJW silliness where it ultimately goes out of control when it's not confronted and allowed to metastasize. But back then the muppets and company were fire breathers about their silliness while today like this post it's all virtue signalling while trying to get in a drive by zinger.