Please perk or reduce the late war monsters

[DmonSlyr]

You guys just don't get it. Top late war planes that literally get thousands of more kills every tour and have better K/D's at the same time prove that they are over used and abused. Perks do work. If they did not, the temp and the F4U4 would have thousands of more kills. Why are those planes perked? Why do we even have perk planes? When the temp gets 2K less kills than a 190D. I'd much rather have less people flying top E planes like the temp and flying timidly than more of them still flying timidly. I bet you the 190D is better than the Temp. You can play butterfly counterpuncher all day, which is my main style actually, but you have to actually know how to play well before you can be successful at that. Noobs have the hardest time against this. If you are noob and cannot figure out how to get more than 10 perks and quit. The game is obviously not for you. The same 4 planes taking over the MA every month with 10X he kills just isn't as fun as if they had a small perk and most of the players in the arena were in 15+ eny planes. That's where the better fights are. Less top E BNZ planes in arena is better for the arena. The #s prove the 190D with a better K/D at 3K kills than the P51 should be perked.

[Arlo]

You guys just don't get it.

[FLS]

You guys just don't get it. Top late war planes that literally get thousands of more kills every tour and have better K/D's at the same time prove that they are over used and abused. Perks do work. If they did not, the temp and the F4U4 would have thousands of more kills. Why are those planes perked? Why do we even have perk planes? When the temp gets 2K less kills than a 190D. I'd much rather have less people flying top E planes like the temp and flying timidly than more of them still flying timidly. I bet you the 190D is better than the Temp. You can play butterfly counterpuncher all day, which is my main style actually, but you have to actually know how to play well before you can be successful at that. Noobs have the hardest time against this. If you are noob and cannot figure out how to get more than 10 perks and quit. The game is obviously not for you. The same 4 planes taking over the MA every month with 10X he kills just isn't as fun as if they had a small perk and most of the players in the arena were in 15+ eny planes. That's where the better fights are. Less top E BNZ planes in arena is better for the arena. The #s prove the 190D with a better K/D at 3K kills than the P51 should be perked.

It's not that I don't get it. It's that I disagree. You haven't proved anything. You want us to believe it's bad for one plane to be so popular. You have not explained how it's bad for the 190D to enjoy it's current popularity, except that people evade you in it. If you can't accept the choices players make then maybe the game is not for you,  or more obviously, maybe there's room for everybody.

BTW the Temp roll rate still sucks doesn't it?

[Ciaphas]

Another issue, perking more planes can have a negative effect in the MA by retaining those aircraft for elite players. I myself don't really fly air to air often and don't rack up the perks to pilot some of the perked dogs out there. Perking more rides only removes more aircraft from the main stay of this game and widens the gap between casual cats and those that play this game a bit more seriously.

This doesn't mean the game isn't for me, it just means that this particular aspect is not my bread and butter. I would gather that a large portion of the player base is in the same boat I"m currently rowing. I often do well when I'm online and I further the fight wherever I am.


 

[DmonSlyr]

It's not that I don't get it. It's that I disagree. You haven't proved anything. You want us to believe it's bad for one plane to be so popular. You have not explained how it's bad for the 190D to enjoy it's current popularity, except that people evade you in it. If you can't accept the choices players make then maybe the game is not for you,  or more obviously, maybe there's room for everybody.

BTW the Temp roll rate still sucks doesn't it?

So actual # stats month after month don't prove anything? That's the best proof we have. When one late war plane cannot catch another late war plane even after diving on em, that doesn't prove it's an elite plane? Let's compare the 190D to the Temp. What's the difference?

When these planes are used to cherry pick and run, that's boring stale gameplay. The 190 has a better K/D because it's lack of turn capability means running is the only thing it can do once it loses alt advantage. That is game play that drives people away. More people in 190Ds to catch the 190D  does not make the game better. There is literally no reason for perks if they aren't going to be used for what they are supposed to be used for.

Another issue, perking more planes can have a negative effect in the MA by retaining those aircraft for elite players. I myself don't really fly air to air often and don't rack up the perks to pilot some of the perked dogs out there. Perking more rides only removes more aircraft from the main stay of this game and widens the gap between casual cats and those that play this game a bit more seriously.

This doesn't mean the game isn't for me, it just means that this particular aspect is not my bread and butter. I would gather that a large portion of the player base is in the same boat I"m currently rowing. I often do well when I'm online and I further the fight wherever I am.


 

How is that different than any other game? Most games I ever played I had to start with weak equipment and work my way up to better equipment. It's part of the "work toward something" approach to gaming that works very well.

If perking a plane literally reduces it's usage by 30%. Why not do that for planes that are top performers every single month? It will not widen any gaps. It will keep more player out of the plane overall, thus making more balanced fights because most elite players will choose a non perked plane. If perking planes did not matter, than the temps and f4u 4-C and would have way more kills. Why don't they?

[Wiley]

How is that different than any other game? Most games I ever played I had to start with weak equipment and work my way up to better equipment. It's part of the "work toward something" approach to gaming that works very well.

I don't think it's great for this kind of game because a novice with an equipment disadvantage is pretty much meat except in very rare cases.  Imagine starting out with a Hurri 1 being the only thing you can fly in the MA.  People wouldn't stick around for that.

If perking a plane literally reduces it's usage by 30%. Why not do that for planes that are top performers every single month? It will not widen any gaps. It will keep more player out of the plane overall, thus making more balanced fights because most elite players will choose a non perked plane. If perking planes did not matter, than the temps and f4u 4-C and would have way more kills. Why don't they?

Because the perk-free alternatives aren't that much worse than them.  9 out of 10 times I'd rather have a jug than a Temp.  A Nik will work in most situations where an F4U-C is good.

Wiley.

[Vraciu]

Give it a rest, V.  It's not going to happen.

Like Fess noted, it will be the same stuff just 75mph slower.

I loved having a rolling planeset in Warbirds.   Alas, it was apparently unpopular.  Short of that, you're just going to have what you have unless we get a zone-based ENY.  And then guys like me will just tank up our 51s and fly in from ten grids away to slaughter the EW rides.   Then ppl will whine some more and on it goes.

If you don't like chasing Doras and losing the foot race then fly Doras.   That's basically where we are now.

I fly 51s because of the vis and my ability to get away when it becomes 12 v 1 like just happened to me ten mins ago.   Hey, I got two and an assist.   In the real world I'd have a medal.

 

[DmonSlyr]

I don't think it's great for this kind of game because a novice with an equipment disadvantage is pretty much meat except in very rare cases.  Imagine starting out with a Hurri 1 being the only thing you can fly in the MA.  People wouldn't stick around for that.

Because the perk-free alternatives aren't that much worse than them.  9 out of 10 times I'd rather have a jug than a Temp.  A Nik will work in most situations where an F4U-C is good.

Wiley.

I agree with you to an extent. Starting off with early war planes wouldn't be suitable. They would still be able to use most of the late war planes, and even the P51, since it's the main ride. But even still "war thunder" didn't give me their top 190D to zoom and run away and spray and pray with 500 Cannon's. You will notice that most elites in AH do not abuse perked planes because they don't want to be considered to having to resort to perk planes to win. It's a psyhcological thing. By reducing the advanced planes for all players, and attaching a small perk, it would push more players into planes that are more balanced in the MA. Right now, you fly to a furball or roll into a furball and it's only Yak3s, 190s, and La7s. Even if a new player gets into these planes, they aren't going to have a change against players in the same plane that are better than them. Less elites would be in those planes if they were perked, which would be more beneficial to new players, especially when they save up enough perks to be able to fly them. Spending 5-20 perks to fly the best planes shouldn't be that big of a deal. They have over saturated the arenas.

I just want to see the flight stats between the 190D and the tempest to see exactly why the temp is perked when the 190D isn't

[Wiley]

I guess my point is, it seems to me your issue is more with behavior than the equipment.  No matter what you perk, it's just not going to change the behavior.  People will still BnZ and run as long as there are planes with different performance in the game.  Even in the same plane, people will BnZ and run.

Wiley.

[Ciaphas]

I guess my point is, it seems to me your issue is more with behavior than the equipment.  No matter what you perk, it's just not going to change the behavior.  People will still BnZ and run as long as there are planes with different performance in the game.  Even in the same plane, people will BnZ and run.

Wiley.

+1


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[DmonSlyr]

I guess my point is, it seems to me your issue is more with behavior than the equipment.  No matter what you perk, it's just not going to change the behavior.  People will still BnZ and run as long as there are planes with different performance in the game.  Even in the same plane, people will BnZ and run.

Wiley.

No, my issue is with the planes performance clearly outmatching the rest of the planes by statistics. Again, what is the point of perking planes to begin with? Let the noobs just fly free 262s. What's the difference? Why is the temp perked and the 190D not?

[Wiley]

...Because that much speed with 2x20mm and 2x13mm is nowhere near as good as 4x Hispano.  Also it's not as user-friendly as the Temp if you try to turn it.

Wiley.

[Spikes]

I think the main reason of perking is to stop the spam of something. It doesn't work for the T-35 85 because the price is too low and GV perks are very abundant and how good the T-34 85 actually is for the price. I think some people would think twice about rolling something like the Yak-3, P-51D, or Fw 190D-9 if there was a nominal cost to it (even if it were 5 perks as a base).

With the question of Tempest vs. D9, the Temp is pretty much better in every way...it's faster, can turn better,, can accelerate better, and has a more lethal gun pack.

[DmonSlyr]

I think the main reason of perking is to stop the spam of something. It doesn't work for the T-35 85 because the price is too low and GV perks are very abundant and how good the T-34 85 actually is for the price. I think some people would think twice about rolling something like the Yak-3, P-51D, or Fw 190D-9 if there was a nominal cost to it (even if it were 5 perks as a base).

With the question of Tempest vs. D9, the Temp is pretty much better in every way...it's faster, can turn better,, can accelerate better, and has a more lethal gun pack.

I completely agree with your first paragraph. It really would help, especially for the T-35. I just don't think these top MA fighters are making the MA great if that is all everyone has to fly just to compete. It's obvious that easy mode planes are too abundant and thus making game play unbalanced in furballs
 
I'd really like to see performance indicators for the temp Vs 190. I know 4 hispanoes are pretty much it's best advantage over the 190d, but I am just not so sure the 190D is slower or accels slowers and the 190D definitely dives to a faster speed. I think they both turn relatively the same, would depend on the pilot for that. I'd also like to compare the P51D to the 190D considering thr P51D doesn't have cannons at all, accels much slower and climbs much slower. In combat the only advantage the 51 has is turn rate and distance.

[Spikes]

http://www.gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php

Check the Tempy and 190D and Submit

The issue is it ends up being a slippery slope. Do you perk the Spit 16 because it's easy to fly? What about the La 7 because it is fast, or the N1K because it too has 4 cannons? Then there's the P-47M...