Author Topic: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?  (Read 71617 times)

Offline FLS

  • AH Training Corps
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11617
      • Trainer's Website
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #510 on: January 01, 2020, 12:00:58 PM »
I've made my list of what I thought WT did well that Aces High ought to consider, and got screamed down the second I even HINTED at Complex Engine Management being implemented the same way turning off Stall Limiter and Engine Governor already is for my trouble.

You got 'screamed down' by relatively polite disagreement. It must have really hurt.





Offline Saxman

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 9155
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #511 on: January 01, 2020, 12:08:06 PM »
You got 'screamed down' by relatively polite disagreement. It must have really hurt.

Inventing definitions to disparage an idea does not qualify as "polite" in my book, while the entire disagreement ultimately amounted to foot-down "I don't want it and that's all there is to it."
« Last Edit: January 01, 2020, 12:14:42 PM by Saxman »
Ron White says you can't fix stupid. I beg to differ. Stupid will usually sort itself out, it's just a matter of making sure you're not close enough to become collateral damage.

Offline Vraciu

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 14138
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #512 on: January 01, 2020, 12:31:50 PM »
And I'm still of the opinion that AH should double down on the simulator aspects as part of its identity. If WT wants to be an arcade shooter, then ramp up the realism of AH to make it stand apart.

 :rofl

New players can't even takeoff as it is.   

Making the game more difficult is definitely the missing key to success and expanded popularity.  Definitely.
”KILLER V”
Charter Member of the P-51 Mustang Skin Mafia
- THE DAMNED -
King of the Hill Champ Tour 219 - Win Percentage 100
"1v1 Skyyr might be the best pilot ever to play the game." - Via PM, Name Redacted

Offline Vraciu

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 14138
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #513 on: January 01, 2020, 12:32:55 PM »
I've made my list of what I thought WT did well that Aces High ought to consider, and got screamed down the second I even HINTED at Complex Engine Management being implemented the same way turning off Stall Limiter and Engine Governor already is for my trouble.

Yeah, because we don't want it.

It's a pain in the arse that most people don't feel like dealing with via a keyboard.

And I don't recall anyone screaming at you, either.    :noid
« Last Edit: January 01, 2020, 12:34:53 PM by Vraciu »
”KILLER V”
Charter Member of the P-51 Mustang Skin Mafia
- THE DAMNED -
King of the Hill Champ Tour 219 - Win Percentage 100
"1v1 Skyyr might be the best pilot ever to play the game." - Via PM, Name Redacted

Offline ccvi

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2074
      • http://www.carl-eike-hofmeister.de/
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #514 on: January 01, 2020, 01:27:45 PM »
While making it more complicated, also remove the ammo counters.

And suddenly 109s are replacing the spits and yaks as beginner planes.

Offline FLS

  • AH Training Corps
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11617
      • Trainer's Website
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #515 on: January 01, 2020, 02:26:53 PM »
Inventing definitions to disparage an idea does not qualify as "polite" in my book, while the entire disagreement ultimately amounted to foot-down "I don't want it and that's all there is to it."

I reread the thread and missed the screaming. What does it matter if one or more players don't like your ideas? The only opinion that affects the game is Hitech's and he seems to prefer the current system. 

Made up definitions and exaggerations are both detrimental to productive conversation.

In my experience what you had was relatively polite.   :D

You may disagree.  :aok

Offline DmonSlyr

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6654
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #516 on: January 01, 2020, 02:49:14 PM »
My earlier post above turned out to be largely incorrect. I forgot that with Bowlma, AH still has at least one 20x20 terrain up.
I just thought of the similar huge maps like Ozkansas, TAGMA, Trinity and Compello.
Though Bowlma is somewhat more 'focused' than those.

Bowlma is horrendous during off hours. So difficult to find a fight when you have to fly across the oceans. All teams can't fight against each other. Everyone spread out. Just too damn big.

I'm telling ya, it's base distance and being able fight all sides at the same time that is key.

Who wants to sit there and fly for 5-8 minutes across the oceans to fight maybe 1 or 2 guys in P51s at 1am? It's just too slow.

Even with smaller maps, far distances defeat the purpose.

There should be a concerted effort to make as many maps as possible (and promote them outside of the forums so people know).


The Damned(est. 1988)
-=Army of Muppets=-
2014 & 2018 KoTH ToC Champion

Offline TheBug

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5652
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #517 on: January 01, 2020, 02:58:14 PM »
This probably goes both ways. I guess there is people who are actively playing WT or IL2, and have downloaded and installed AH, but cannot find the time to configure and/or try.

The difference to your case is, that if they find the time (or free up their time for that, having "no time" but playing is just making up excuses) to try AH they are looking $15/month compared to $0 currently. In your case, you already paid, and it doesn't matter for them if you try it or not. But even with a potential reduction of monthly cost you choose to not free up sufficient time to even try.

There's quite some inertia. Seems like peoples comfort zones is with exactly the configuration and flight-models they are used to. Any change would mean an immediate reduction of skill level, with new learning required. Probably one of the reasons why there's still as many players as there are.

Understanding why there's still players left might help to understand how have we lost so many people to this wonderful game (hey, that's right there in the subject) and then maybe why there are no new ones.
  • no motivation to re-learn flying (see above): prevents new players from other sims
  • want to complete the collect-25k-perks achievement: not interesting for someone who never played here (I guess no-one ever said "ok, let's start playing word of warcraft to complete all achievements", that works by becoming addicted first and then choosing the most time-consuming goal available)
  • married to the community: prevents new players (married to their current communities)
  • scenarios / special events: not really motivating much for new players, because not much can be experienced during the two free weeks; also, aren't their kind of game rounds in the other games, which are basically little scenarios, minus human interaction and flying around for an hour to maybe end up in a fight?)
  • prefer the open-world war aspect of the main arena: the only thing where AH is really different?

Anything missing?

I play games I like and don't play games I don't like.  It is as simple as that for me being just a player the developers can figure out the rest.   I haven't tried IL-2 yet, just because I picked it up a couple days ago and hadn't had a large enough window of sober free time to dive into figuring out the controls.  I have lots of games, AH included, that I wish I had more time play and don't find any real need to be married to just one of them.  But AH is definitely the only game that ever held my attention for the years that it has/had.  AH firing on all cylinders, in my opinion, is the best PC game I have ever played.  It just unfortunately hasn't been firing on all cylinders very often these days to really draw me in.

Players speculating why people are leaving or promoting game changes beyond a mere suggestion in the wishlist forum is a complete waste of time.  The best place for players to have an impact is within the game itself.  Promote a fight, a base capture, a squad, a mission, the history, etc...  Promote it to bring in the GV guys, the bomber guys, the fighter guys.  When that all clicks AH really shines above them all.  It also helps develop a sense of community which has the sticking power.  I know it is not easy, I have tried it.  You get a lot of flak from your own country men, but it does work.  And always funny to see the guys giving me a hard time when I try to get a fight started end up in the fight I was pushing for. 
“It's a big ocean, you don't have to find the enemy if you don't want to."
  -Richard O'Kane

Offline ccvi

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2074
      • http://www.carl-eike-hofmeister.de/
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #518 on: January 01, 2020, 04:24:15 PM »
There should be a concerted effort to make as many maps as possible

Making maps is not very motivating. I tried. I'm not even sure whether the one single feedback I got is the result of a misunderstanding or not.

Offline SirNuke

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1297
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #519 on: January 01, 2020, 04:53:01 PM »
Maybe the maps should be 10x10 or so? Doesn't matter how much people there is if there is enough player concentration for the action to develop?

Offline Ciaphas

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1955
      • DethKlokDave
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #520 on: January 01, 2020, 05:11:05 PM »
Maybe the maps should be 10x10 or so? Doesn't matter how much people there is if there is enough player concentration for the action to develop?

I think smaller maps with shorter field separation distances would be worth looking in to.

There are a few of us that are working on maps at the moment and I wouldn't mind throwing a smaller map together with smaller field separation to load as a player arena to try out.

10.(Jabo)/JG 26 Nuisance Raids Scenario


Offline Chalenge

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15179
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #521 on: January 01, 2020, 10:23:23 PM »
If you want to attract more people hold a month long competition with prizes, but be forewarned that it may invite the wrong people to come around.
If you like the Sick Puppy Custom Sound Pack the please consider contributing for future updates by sending a months dues to Hitech Creations for account "Chalenge." Every little bit helps.

Offline fuzeman

  • Aces High CM Staff
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8971
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #522 on: January 17, 2020, 10:20:58 PM »
I have no idea how to implement anything relevant to the following which is a bad start but here goes...
Aces High has a STEEP learning curve and is hard to learn. Most call that a disadvantage.
I remember the scene from Gene Hackman's 'Enemy of the State' when he talked about turning your disadvantages into advantages. Against a big attacker, a smaller guy is nimble and maneuverable, for example.
Off on a tangent here, I really don't think Gene Hackman would have make a good Kowalski in 'Vanishing Point' although he was one of the Director's, Richard C. Sarafian, preferred choices.
Back to my point, is there anyway to make the toughness to learn Aces High an advantage or work for the game?

Far too many, if not most, people on this Board post just to say something opposed to posting when they have something to say.

"Masters of the Air" Scenario - JG54

Offline CptTrips

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8269
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #523 on: January 17, 2020, 10:32:29 PM »
Off on a tangent here, I really don't think Gene Hackman would have make a good Kowalski in 'Vanishing Point' although he was one of the Director's, Richard C. Sarafian, preferred choices.


Damn I feel old knowing what your talking about. 

Great flick.  :aok
Toxic, psychotic, self-aggrandizing drama queens simply aren't worth me spending my time on.

Offline Eagler

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18201
Re: How have we lost so many people to this wonderful game?
« Reply #524 on: January 18, 2020, 09:53:39 AM »
KOTH tonight !!! (Thanks fuzeman!)

2100 EST

Some of the best fun in AH3 IMO!

Hope to see you there!

<S>

Eagler
"Masters of the Air" Scenario - JG27


Intel Core i7-13700KF | GIGABYTE Z790 AORUS Elite AX | 64GB G.Skill DDR5 | 16GB GIGABYTE RTX 4070 Ti Super | 850 watt ps | pimax Crystal Light | Warthog stick | TM1600 throttle | VKB Mk.V Rudder