Author Topic: Active Players  (Read 10379 times)

Offline CptTrips

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #135 on: October 03, 2023, 08:24:06 PM »
Aces High is the " Minecraft " of flight sims


Except Minecraft made a boat load of money.  Sold to MS for $2.5bil.

I still don't get how.  The world seems upside-down sometimes.



Toxic, psychotic, self-aggrandizing drama queens simply aren't worth me spending my time on.

Offline Animl-AW

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #136 on: October 03, 2023, 08:31:06 PM »
In the "hayday" of 600 players (even +200) you are correct that AH was the place to be.  Unfortunately, that has not existed for a long time, for a variety of reasons.  When the numbers in AH are low there really isn't much to do, so AH and your sim gear sits idle. 

Where DCS and IL2 endure is a decent A/I that allows for PvE and single player.  With combat flight sims being a niche, the more you have to rely on participation of others the less "bang for the buck" you are going to get.  You only need a couple players with PvE to have fun and the comradery.  If you only prefer going against humans then both DCS and IL2 have smaller maps and therefore you only need about 30 players, which is not hard to find at all. 

When I could carve out some time to play AH my routine was to log in and see if there were enough players with  a decent dar bar indicating a good fight.  Those instances became fewer and fewer, which resulted in logging off and finding something else to do.  With DCS/IL2 I can check for the same things and, if it is not available, I still have a wealth of single player missions available in whatever aircraft I feel like flying.  In short when I feel like I want to fly combat it is available 24/7.

With WWII aircraft, the graphic detail becomes much more relevant.  Not long ago I was flying a pony mission in DCS and lit up a 190 at point blank range.  Quite something to SEE the 190 canopy fly off and the pilot animatedly climb out of the aircraft to bail out.  Detailed ground terrain and ground units, along with good smoke/fire affects, increase the immersion and that is why we are all playing.

Bottom line is playtime is one of the most precious human commodities and everyone has to choose what gives them the most satisfaction.  Don't let any one game make you hang up you flight gear without checking out the others.

I'm not saying you don't have some valid points, I'm not directing all of this to you... but I will say what I've always said since Janes, WB, etc... if it's not fun, graphics don't matter. Ask almost any former long term AW player. In this and AW,... MP is what made both stand out. The MP concept kept AH and AW alive well past their time. And my point is hard to challenge without omitting the basics.

I've checked out Both IL-2 and DCS. In videos the way planes fly inIL-2...I'm not sure that's even a true FM. If more than 40% of a game is script drone missions,... my interest is instantly GONE. Not even a second thought.

DCS, it's very very nice, they haven't decided in one single FM, they have several.  If more than 40% of a game is script drone missions,... my interest is instantly GONE. Not even a second thought. AI IS arcade

Many would have to buy a new PC too,..and you haven't even gotten into the money pit of flying planes, which is THE most omitted point in the sales pitches. Some refer to this in terms of swindle. $70 for one plane, or 4.6 months of 120 AC, boats and vehicles,... whose graphics are NOT substandard. And the FM is solid.

yes,... we can at a glance say they look real good,.... until you dig into them. If that wasn't true..... we would not have people trying to selling it in every conversation like an meth addiction. That's a Tell all by itself.

If that's what blows some skirts up,... kewl, be with it, go there, ...
But if some are expecting a mass migration to fill a boring game,..they are not listening,..it's NOT gaining any ground here. If that was going to happen,...it would have already. It's now just cringe worthy to those of us who repeat ourselves endlessly to the endless sales attempt, we like the game play here. The main point that is always INTENTIONALLY left out to a crowd that has already well established,.. THIS is their home. Get off the lawn with the signs.  If I wanted AI,.. I'd go back to Half-Life. Ya can't be any more arcade than AI. <shug>

Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
if they are that great,.. WHY in the hell do they spend more time here, than there? Quite frankly,... they can't wait for AH to die, the sooner the better... the C movie acting is like glass. The body language screams BS.

i'm sure will all see DCS in the next 48 hrs. When someone can be 90% predicted, ya got them nailed.

:) <shrug>

Peace

Offline edge12674

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #137 on: October 04, 2023, 10:00:45 AM »
Some good points.  Keeping to the point of this thread, the truth is AH has been left dying on the vine by the developer for many years.  This is not a slam on Dale.  AH had it's time and I am thankful I got to enjoy it.
 
With the current number of players, combined with the size of the maps, AH does not provide anymore multiplayer experience than the current "popular" sims out there.  All the while providing outdated flight mechanics, graphics, and sound.  Do you need a "current" computer to play the "popular" sims?  You bet.  AH used to require that also, when it was still being supported.

"Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results."  Totally agree and I was guilty of this with AH, to the point of considering hanging up the hobby all together.  My message to others is "don't let this happen to you."  It is hard to leave a rut, but the alternatives are out there.

As far as cost is concerned, it takes just a little research.  There are a couple sims out there that you can try (both single player and multiplayer) completely free.  Not just two weeks.  AH is $150 a year.  For that amount you can get more than enough content to keep you entertained and learning for YEARS.  You might also find that it re-ignites your passion for the hobby.

From what I have seen, the "sales attempt" on this forum occurs only in response to those players expressing frustration over AH current game play.  Many are frustrated with AH game play.  Look at the length of this thread to prove my point.  Prior AH subscribers are just pointing out that "current" AH play will probably not get better and that there are alternatives out there.

We both agree that bottom line is everyone has to choose what is right for them.  :aok
 

TShark
"If you are alone and meet a lone Zero, run like hell...You're outnumbered" - Joe Foss USMC 26 kills

Offline edge12674

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #138 on: October 04, 2023, 01:27:32 PM »
"AH is $150 a year."

Err...I mean $180 a year....kinda messes with your credibility when you can't do basic math!   :D

TShark
"If you are alone and meet a lone Zero, run like hell...You're outnumbered" - Joe Foss USMC 26 kills

Offline JimmyD3

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #139 on: October 04, 2023, 05:25:42 PM »
Some good points.  Keeping to the point of this thread, the truth is AH has been left dying on the vine by the developer for many years.  This is not a slam on Dale.  AH had it's time and I am thankful I got to enjoy it.
 
With the current number of players, combined with the size of the maps, AH does not provide anymore multiplayer experience than the current "popular" sims out there.  All the while providing outdated flight mechanics, graphics, and sound.  Do you need a "current" computer to play the "popular" sims?  You bet.  AH used to require that also, when it was still being supported.

"Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results."  Totally agree and I was guilty of this with AH, to the point of considering hanging up the hobby all together.  My message to others is "don't let this happen to you."  It is hard to leave a rut, but the alternatives are out there.

As far as cost is concerned, it takes just a little research.  There are a couple sims out there that you can try (both single player and multiplayer) completely free.  Not just two weeks.  AH is $150 a year.  For that amount you can get more than enough content to keep you entertained and learning for YEARS.  You might also find that it re-ignites your passion for the hobby.

From what I have seen, the "sales attempt" on this forum occurs only in response to those players expressing frustration over AH current game play.  Many are frustrated with AH game play.  Look at the length of this thread to prove my point.  Prior AH subscribers are just pointing out that "current" AH play will probably not get better and that there are alternatives out there.

We both agree that bottom line is everyone has to choose what is right for them:aok
 

Correct, DCS is NOT for me, I'll stay with AH3.
Kenai77
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Offline Shuffler

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #140 on: October 05, 2023, 08:58:42 AM »
"AH is $150 a year."

Err...I mean $180 a year....kinda messes with your credibility when you can't do basic math!   :D

Cheap ain't it.
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Offline edge12674

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #141 on: October 06, 2023, 10:10:26 AM »
Cheap ain't it.

Depends on the person.  At the time I left AH, the MA was so deteriorated that I was only flying Monday Night Madness and FSO.  So about 3 hours a week.

I went to a popular sim and for that same $180 (granted all paid at once) I got the terrains and aircraft I was interested in.  My multiplayer time increased to 12 hours a week and has stayed that way for the past two years.  It reignited my passion for the hobby, had me pouring over YouTube videos, going to air museums, and got my brain matter working on learning new things.  Two years later I still have not exhausted all there is to offer from the aircraft/terrains I initially bought.

In addition, I now look forward to developer newsletters that come out EVERY week and feel the strain when there is not AT LEAST one program update in a month. 

Since that initial purchase I have bought other aircraft and terrains, but the cost has been about $120 compared to the $180 I would have spent on a second year of AH.  So for me it has been monetarily cheaper than AH and a HUGE bargain in entertainment.  Again everyone is different.   

TShark
"If you are alone and meet a lone Zero, run like hell...You're outnumbered" - Joe Foss USMC 26 kills

Offline Brooke

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #142 on: October 06, 2023, 12:14:40 PM »
Cheap ain't it.

Heh!  I remember folks paying $6-$12/hr to play Air Warrior, with monthly bills of $700 back in 1995 (which inflation adjusted is $1400/month today), or $17,000/year in today's money.  :uhoh

Offline edge12674

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #143 on: October 06, 2023, 02:08:05 PM »
Heh!  I remember folks paying $6-$12/hr to play Air Warrior, with monthly bills of $700 back in 1995 (which inflation adjusted is $1400/month today), or $17,000/year in today's money.  :uhoh

I remember those days as well, playing Air Warrior over GEnie.  Also remember $70 boxed flight sims ($149 in today's money).  How many hobbies get cheaper over the years?  We are pretty lucky!

TShark
"If you are alone and meet a lone Zero, run like hell...You're outnumbered" - Joe Foss USMC 26 kills

Offline Brooke

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #144 on: October 06, 2023, 03:06:53 PM »
I remember those days as well, playing Air Warrior over GEnie.  Also remember $70 boxed flight sims ($149 in today's money).  How many hobbies get cheaper over the years?  We are pretty lucky!

I feel the same way.  :aok

I remember how happy folks were when Air Warrior went flat fee, and it was only like $30-$50/month or whatever to play.  Heaven!  :aok

Offline Animl-AW

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #145 on: October 06, 2023, 08:24:40 PM »
Heh!  I remember folks paying $6-$12/hr to play Air Warrior, with monthly bills of $700 back in 1995 (which inflation adjusted is $1400/month today), or $17,000/year in today's money.  :uhoh

I remember that well, although couldn't play often becaus eof substandard PC. 386 I think, upgrade from 286.

I think the real issue is there is a different POV between very seasoned old skewl players, and others who came after 2000.
All we know of its MP, we cut our teeth on it....nothing else will ever match it. We've seen every variation of a sim anyone could imagine,...we know a lame selling point when we see one...without MP it just won't cut the mustard with us. We've seen the selling points on things like DCS and IL-2 and WT longer than they exist.. It's all the same glitter with a new face. Nothing said is new or inventive.

I'm not sure some realize there is no convincing us of anything else. We've done all the Fighter Ace and Janes Planes type re-branding. If it's not MP,... we have no interest at all. We've seen all the speeches, and variations of the same. Save the breath. We just know where the fun is, and it's not always graphics, and it will NEVER be AI.

<S> We is what we is.

Offline Molsman

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #146 on: October 07, 2023, 01:41:25 AM »
I feel the same way.  :aok

I remember how happy folks were when Air Warrior went flat fee, and it was only like $30-$50/month or whatever to play.  Heaven!  :aok

How can we forget the ultimate flying Death Star b17 in Air Wary when all the guns coughs manned by players. Dam I did countless with that thing and the best part was all of us drunks had a great time
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Offline save

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #147 on: October 07, 2023, 07:42:31 PM »
DCS lacks wwII planes badly, only a few late war planes like the 109K4, 190D, and Fw190a8 against P47D's spit9, and p51D, and Mosquito-6.

My ammo last for 6 Lancasters, or one Yak3.
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Offline fudgums

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #148 on: October 07, 2023, 08:10:53 PM »
That is why I left AH after over 20 yrs of playing.  Now I fly a sim that is constantly updated, has a vibrant community with good multiplayer options, and even a robust A/I that is always willing to fight 24/7.  It is only the fond memories of the years past that keeps me occasionally checking in on the AH forums.

Which community is that?
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Offline Animl-AW

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Re: Active Players
« Reply #149 on: October 07, 2023, 10:07:23 PM »
DCS lacks wwII planes badly, only a few late war planes like the 109K4, 190D, and Fw190a8 against P47D's spit9, and p51D, and Mosquito-6.

Pretty much sums it up. Its a cockpit sim.

I think it's beyond comical, that some try to make 15$ a mo sound like some massive cost.
I can get a McDs hamburger meal for 15$, and it's gone in 10 minutes. This whole 15$ is this huge expense is used lemon car salesman nonsense.
 DCS is a true money pit. The comparison is a joke, and insult to intelligence. Denial is a hellava a drug.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2023, 11:43:58 PM by Animl-AW »