Author Topic: Sig 365  (Read 913 times)

Offline nopoop

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #30 on: August 15, 2025, 01:42:00 PM »
nopoop

It's ALL about the fight.in a brew...

Offline Widewing

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #31 on: August 16, 2025, 08:50:41 PM »
Hadn't seen the magazine conversion for the 870, but then, I haven't been looking. I have a Winchester pump. It's a hunting shotgun, but it stays loaded with 00 Buck, and slugs, in a close closet, for home defense.

Had several combat style shotguns, years ago, sold them when I changed my career. That was a drawback for the 18" combat shotgun at the time, capacity. A magazine conversion would help, a few were tried, with mixed results. When they had feed issues, they tied up the action, that's big problem. You could always single feed in an emergency if the tube ran dry. But if the action ties up...... That's why a lot of agencies not only didn't use semi auto shot guns, but also issued 2-1/2" ammunition for 3" rated guns. You can slam a 2-1/2" shell home even in a dirty or fouled 3" chamber. A combat firearm that doesn't go "BANG!" every time you need it to can often get the wrong person killed. Hence why I haven't bought an AR style shotgun. I haven't seen a known make/model that hasn't exhibited problems. It's the only purpose for an AR platform shotgun. If I cannot count on it to go "BANG!" every time, then it isn't going into my cabinet or safe.

For the same reason, I will hone/tune the action, but I rarely use reduced rate trigger return or hammer springs in a combat firearm. Only when I know the originals are extremely over rate. Again, if it doesn't go "BANG!", or the trigger won't reset.....

I have pump, semi-auto and side by side shotguns. I accessorized my rugged, reliable H&R 870 clone for home security. Hogue furniture, see under rail with Fastfire 3 red dot. Fiber optic front sight. LED light. Velcro shot cards. Fore stock strap and quick adjust sling. I have a Mossberg 590A1, 940 Pro, 500 Tactical 20", and a cheap but reliable Maverick 88 (upgraded). I sold my Franchi LAW-12 years ago. It was too finicky. Hard to beat a pump shotgun for reliability and simplicity. Of course, a 12 ga Coach Gun will certainly get the job done.



My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #32 on: August 16, 2025, 11:19:26 PM »
Got an email today, the Panzer Arms Ar-12 is on sale cheap enough to consider trying it. If I can make it reliable, cool, if not, it's not a huge loss.
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline hazmatt

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2025, 12:19:36 AM »
I was curious what it went for and I found one listed for $199. I figured they cost a bunch more then that.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2025, 09:03:33 AM »
I was curious what it went for and I found one listed for $199. I figured they cost a bunch more then that.

They're imports, a lot are made in Turkey. Another reason I'm not huge on spending the money, I like to support U.S. made products and manufacturers. Still, I'm considering one, and a couple of higher capacity magazines. If I can make it reliable....

However, I just bought a DSA Gray Wolf FAL clone, DM rifle. It needs a scope, rings, a rear sight, a fire control upgrade, and a couple of spare magazines. I'm working on a battle rifle collection. I need another Garand, an M-14 and a BM-59 (James River makes nice examples of both), and a G3. CMP is apparently going to have new Garands, forged receiver and match grade barrels, they're setting up to manufacture. I'd like to have an original again, too.
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline Widewing

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #35 on: August 19, 2025, 06:48:27 PM »
They're imports, a lot are made in Turkey. Another reason I'm not huge on spending the money, I like to support U.S. made products and manufacturers. Still, I'm considering one, and a couple of higher capacity magazines. If I can make it reliable....

However, I just bought a DSA Gray Wolf FAL clone, DM rifle. It needs a scope, rings, a rear sight, a fire control upgrade, and a couple of spare magazines. I'm working on a battle rifle collection. I need another Garand, an M-14 and a BM-59 (James River makes nice examples of both), and a G3. CMP is apparently going to have new Garands, forged receiver and match grade barrels, they're setting up to manufacture. I'd like to have an original again, too.

There are several world class firearm manufactures in Turkey. Canik, Girsan, Sarsilmaz (SAR USA) and Tisas to name a few. I own six pistols made there. Indeed, Girsan makes a clone of the Beretta 92/M9 series that has better machining and finish than my Beretta M9A1. For 30% less money. These pistols have passed NATO testing, being approved and are in service with several militaries and police forces. Their "race" guns are outstanding. Engineered for competition, they have the preferred bells and whistles. Their 1911s are also excellent and great values. Photo of two Girsan Beretta types.

I get why some folks prefer not to support Turk businesses. However, many of those guys think nothing about putting Chinese made optics on the pistols. Indeed, if you want to spend under $500 for a quality optic, Chinese made (Holosun, Osight, Cyelee, Crimson Trace, CVlife, etc) are the primary options. Even Burris and Bushnell red dots are assembled in China. 

« Last Edit: August 19, 2025, 06:55:41 PM by Widewing »
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #36 on: August 19, 2025, 08:36:01 PM »
There are several world class firearm manufactures in Turkey. Canik, Girsan, Sarsilmaz (SAR USA) and Tisas to name a few. I own six pistols made there. Indeed, Girsan makes a clone of the Beretta 92/M9 series that has better machining and finish than my Beretta M9A1. For 30% less money. These pistols have passed NATO testing, being approved and are in service with several militaries and police forces. Their "race" guns are outstanding. Engineered for competition, they have the preferred bells and whistles. Their 1911s are also excellent and great values. Photo of two Girsan Beretta types.

I get why some folks prefer not to support Turk businesses. However, many of those guys think nothing about putting Chinese made optics on the pistols. Indeed, if you want to spend under $500 for a quality optic, Chinese made (Holosun, Osight, Cyelee, Crimson Trace, CVlife, etc) are the primary options. Even Burris and Bushnell red dots are assembled in China. 

(Image removed from quote.)


Agreed. I may be actually being a bit harsh. But I don't have anything from china, or any place like it, in my "arsenal". I may change my mind. I don't have any trick optics. I think some of my scopes are South Korean. I absolutely get what you're saying.
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline Widewing

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #37 on: Yesterday at 12:29:05 PM »

Agreed. I may be actually being a bit harsh. But I don't have anything from china, or any place like it, in my "arsenal". I may change my mind. I don't have any trick optics. I think some of my scopes are South Korean. I absolutely get what you're saying.

I really dislike having to buy Chinese products. However, mismanagement of American business and so-called "Globalization" (just an excuse to export manufacturing to increase bottom lines) has caused us to have few choices. We own e-bikes and electric scooters. All were manufactured in China. There are American companies who manufacture these products, but most of them use Chinese motors, controllers and brake components. Moreover, you end up paying almost double. Then there's the name brand price gouging in firearms.

Here's an example. A Glock G19 MOS will cost right around $600. The MOS indicates their optic mounting option. However, you have to use an adapter plate which elevates the optic and costs extra to buy. Glocks sold in the US are, for the most part, assembled in the USA.

Compare that to the Ruger RXM. This pistol is based upon the Glock Gen 3 design. It has direct mounting of optics without adapter plates using hardware included. All major footprints are accommodated. The optic sits lower on the slide. The RXM has suppressor height sights, allowing their use through the optic glass. Unlike the Glock, it is a modular pistol with a serialized Fire Control Insert. This allows the pistol's action to be transferred to different frames in about 5 minutes. Magpul makes the grip frame, with much improved ergonomics and textures. They make alternate grip frames in various colors and ammo capacities. These cost about $38. You can put a Glock slide assy on the RXM and it works. You can put the RXM slide assy on a Glock and it works. The RXM uses Magpul Glock compatible magazines and any Glock G17 or G19 factory magazines. Reliability is no different than Glock. Every component is made in the USA. It is assembled in the USA. Yet, the RXM costs as much as $200 less than a Glock G19 MOS. So, even though I own a G19, I would not have bought it if the RXM was available at that time. The RXM is everything the Glock should be. This is why Glock is gradually losing market share. They no longer innovate, but prefer to rest on their original design, updating only as necessary. Meanwhile, companies like S&W, Ruger, CZ, SIG, Beretta, SAR, Walther, Canik, and many others are innovating and gaining market share at Glock's expense. Stores can't keep S&W Bodyguard 2.0 and Shield X handguns in stock. Both extremely popular for concealed carry. Size, weight, ergos, and ease of shooting are first rate. Meanwhile, Glock still offers decade old designs that are inferior in every metric, except reliability, which is not better than those new Smith & Wesson pistols. Oh, and the S&W pistols are optic ready and cost less.

So, there are quality American made pistols available that are as good or better than offshore competition. However, unless you have deep pockets, you will likely have to buy Chinese if you want a red dot optic.
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: Sig 365
« Reply #38 on: Yesterday at 04:55:32 PM »
I really dislike having to buy Chinese products. However, mismanagement of American business and so-called "Globalization" (just an excuse to export manufacturing to increase bottom lines) has caused us to have few choices. We own e-bikes and electric scooters. All were manufactured in China. There are American companies who manufacture these products, but most of them use Chinese motors, controllers and brake components. Moreover, you end up paying almost double. Then there's the name brand price gouging in firearms.

Here's an example. A Glock G19 MOS will cost right around $600. The MOS indicates their optic mounting option. However, you have to use an adapter plate which elevates the optic and costs extra to buy. Glocks sold in the US are, for the most part, assembled in the USA.

Compare that to the Ruger RXM. This pistol is based upon the Glock Gen 3 design. It has direct mounting of optics without adapter plates using hardware included. All major footprints are accommodated. The optic sits lower on the slide. The RXM has suppressor height sights, allowing their use through the optic glass. Unlike the Glock, it is a modular pistol with a serialized Fire Control Insert. This allows the pistol's action to be transferred to different frames in about 5 minutes. Magpul makes the grip frame, with much improved ergonomics and textures. They make alternate grip frames in various colors and ammo capacities. These cost about $38. You can put a Glock slide assy on the RXM and it works. You can put the RXM slide assy on a Glock and it works. The RXM uses Magpul Glock compatible magazines and any Glock G17 or G19 factory magazines. Reliability is no different than Glock. Every component is made in the USA. It is assembled in the USA. Yet, the RXM costs as much as $200 less than a Glock G19 MOS. So, even though I own a G19, I would not have bought it if the RXM was available at that time. The RXM is everything the Glock should be. This is why Glock is gradually losing market share. They no longer innovate, but prefer to rest on their original design, updating only as necessary. Meanwhile, companies like S&W, Ruger, CZ, SIG, Beretta, SAR, Walther, Canik, and many others are innovating and gaining market share at Glock's expense. Stores can't keep S&W Bodyguard 2.0 and Shield X handguns in stock. Both extremely popular for concealed carry. Size, weight, ergos, and ease of shooting are first rate. Meanwhile, Glock still offers decade old designs that are inferior in every metric, except reliability, which is not better than those new Smith & Wesson pistols. Oh, and the S&W pistols are optic ready and cost less.

So, there are quality American made pistols available that are as good or better than offshore competition. However, unless you have deep pockets, you will likely have to buy Chinese if you want a red dot optic.


Same. I've always been seriously annoyed by not having reasonably priced U.S. sourced options. It really angered me when certain people were buying up U.S. companies, parting them out, and sending the jobs overseas. It's never made sense to me, if you send jobs overseas, how do people here buy your product? Driving manufacturing out of the country has to rank right up there with government run schools in the stupidity category.

And now we have this group of idiots and their "private equity" corporations. They buy up businesses, and then kill every part of the product line that isn't an "A mover" in the warehouses, and all of the custom stuff, too. It drives people out of their hobbies, and makes business for guys like me nearly impossible. Most of the time, the "private equity" corporation makes their money, makes it look like the company is doing well because the 30 day bottom line looks good, sells the company, and the company dies.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 04:59:26 PM by Captain Virgil Hilts »
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe