Author Topic: Ar-234: Why is it perked?  (Read 1041 times)

Offline Skuzzy

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2001, 07:11:00 AM »
Guys, remember that Pyro said the perk system is still under going changes and is not static yet.
Give em a chance to iron things out.

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Offline Westy

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2001, 07:15:00 AM »
 What Skuzzy said.  But what do you really think would happen if the 234 was available as freely as any other regularly available aircraft is?  It wouldn't take long till all you saw were 234's everywhere PORKING bases. Because that is all they can do. They can't dogfight, they cannot capture a base nor can they resupply one. They are good for are fast, lighting quick strikes.

 -Westy


[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 03-09-2001).]

Offline Lephturn

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2001, 07:21:00 AM »
I flew the Ar a bit last night.  I also jumped into a H2H game and played with it.  Holy crap, if this thing had a couple of .50's in the nose it would be the best BnZ platform in the game.  Completely untouchable.  I was cruising through furballs letting higher guys dive on me, then just doing a 0G dive and checking out on them easily.  Once you hit about 400 Mph you can wave buhbye to anything.  If a higher fellow gets close, just drop the nose a tad to get up over 400, then level it out.

Worst case scenario, a bounce by a higher contact?  Reverse on him as he comes in and Split-S out of there... by the time he figures out what happened he won't be able to see you anymore.

BTW, the Ar235 does a really nice hammerhead.  It actually reverses cleaner at about 30 Mph going straight up, you just yank the stick back and it will flop down perfectly for you with a notch of flap.  Although it seems to accelerate slowly at low speed, if you wind it up to 300 or so and dive it slightly, it really hauls ass.

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Offline Ripsnort

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2001, 07:24:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Cobra:
I flew the Arado exclusively last night.  It SHOULD be perked.

It was untouchable, period.  I also think it should NOT get the 20mm.  In needs to have a weak link somewhere.

I bombed and re-armed and bombed again without any worries.  Once or twice a couple of 152's and Doras would get close, but put the nose down a little and bye-bye.

I am in favor of leaving it perked, and I also intend on flying it alot.

Cobra

I'm in total agreement with Cobra, I too flew it and also chased it (with a TA152 at 30k advantage, 234 was at 20k, didn't catch it!)...it needs to remain perked.

Offline Vermillion

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2001, 07:25:00 AM »
Maybe I'm reading the situation wrong from your description.  But if you were 23k and he was 25k, at approximately nose to nose situation, why did you try to manuever at all?

Blow under his nose to avoid the HO, and keep going. He would never catch you, well maybe in 2 or 3 sectors, but by then you have dropped your bombs and now he cant catch you.

You can't think defensively with this bomber, think agressively and use your speed to get past opponents.

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TheWobble

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2001, 07:29:00 AM »
 
Quote
used in numbers it represents a difficult if not impossible force to stop

thats my point kieren, that the ONLY way they are much of a threat, and at 70 points a pop there are not going to be many times that a large number of people will be able, this perk plain rally that we have now will dry up soon when people use up their stashes of points, after that there wont be many people slaving away for the 70 points needed to buy the arado, so raids of more than 3 (at most) of them will be rare to non-existant.

 
Quote
Did you try dropping the nose to gain a little speed when attacked? I haven't, but I would be curious to see who has and what the result was. I suspect it wouldn't take long for the 234 to get enough separation to escape.

yep it picks up lots of speed, but if any fighter is above you or co-alt all he has to do is follow ya down and he will either stay even with you till you level out and then kill you, or accelerate faster in the dive than you and kill you..either way, yer dead.

i outran a dora at 10k..i had to push it to the ground to keep the 2.0k distance and the only thing that saved me was that he just lost interest.   anything like a L-7,p-51D, P-51B, yakU, YakT, will catch it if they have over 3k at advantage and are reasonably close, and those are not even perk planes.  The tempest and the 152 will smear it like nothing.

The tempest is amazing, it has many things that make it really good and dangerous, SPEED, Good guns, good climb rate, fairly agile, dives great, goes verticle great, a will rounded lethal plane. so it is the most expensive fighter in the game.

THe 234 is fast....thats it..it DOESENT climb that great, it has NO guns, it has a pathetic bomb load, it has HORRIBLE fuel consumption..aside from the speed everything about the Arado is JUNK...yet it cost as much as the Tempest...

I dont want to compare a fighter to a bomber cause thats Apples and Oranges, BUT  like I said
The arado is NOT to the bombers what the Tempest is to the fighters.

 
Quote
I'm in total agreement with Cobra, I too flew it and also chased it (with a TA152 at 30k advantage, 234 was at 20k, didn't catch it!)...it needs to remain perked

Noone is saying it shoudent, the discussion is about the price, is it worth 70+ GOOD sorties just to buy 1?

For the record ive flown over 25 sorties with the Arado so far, have been killed twice and have earned exactly 18 perk points.  On almost every single mission I hit my targets, so based on those numbers at the rate im going for getting points ( and with 3 bombs ya cant get much more) i will have to fly over 100 successful arado missions without being shot down 1 time just be able to keep flying it.

100 missions in a row without ever being shot down, in a plane that climbs slow and has NO guns, and has disgusting gas milage, that is the minimum to keep flying it.

[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 03-09-2001).]

Offline CavemanJ

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2001, 08:09:00 AM »
I flew one sortie in the Arado last night.  Was going to bomb a hanger and rtb.  Ended up dropping my eggs when 2 La7s and a spit turned in behind me.  With the eggs gone I started to leave'em behind.

Saw a 190 (assumed D9 since it's new and unperked) at about 10oclock high and coming fast.  Started an easy turn into him, making sure to stay under his nose to avoid a HO.  He came around behind me, getting as close as 900yds on my FE as I put the nose down a little.  He held at that range for a minute or so then started dropping back.  He tried a little spray and pray as the range opened to 1.1+ but never landed any strikes.


Offline Ripsnort

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2001, 08:12:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by CavemanJ:
I flew one sortie in the Arado last night.  Was going to bomb a hanger and rtb.  Ended up dropping my eggs when 2 La7s and a spit turned in behind me.  With the eggs gone I started to leave'em behind.

Saw a 190 (assumed D9 since it's new and unperked) at about 10oclock high and coming fast.  Started an easy turn into him, making sure to stay under his nose to avoid a HO.  He came around behind me, getting as close as 900yds on my FE as I put the nose down a little.  He held at that range for a minute or so then started dropping back.  He tried a little spray and pray as the range opened to 1.1+ but never landed any strikes.

That was me in a TA152!(are they listed as '190' on enemy FE?) Near A15 I think?  Yep! never got closer than 900 then I hit the 'sonic layer' and slowed...good show!


[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 03-09-2001).]

Offline gatt

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2001, 08:16:00 AM »
From another post of mine:

 
Quote
There is something that puzzles me. Well, I dont see the need to perk any plane in a 1944-45 plane set, provided they flew and were in combat during those years, and since production numbers dont mean anything here.
Are the Niki and the C-Hog the kings of the arena (so far)? Yes. Indeed we see lot of them ... clouds of them, literally. Look at the stats. Well, why do I have to see clouds of Niki and C-Hog "dweebs" and not clouds of Tempest or Ta-152 "dweebs"? Whats the difference in a "what-if" plane set? I've been playing for many months against some of the best a/c of the whole second world war (P-51D, 109G-10 and Georges for example). Now that we have more of them (maybe we lack only the late Spitfire IX-XIV, the late Yak-3 and the Ki-84) ... why do they have to be perked?

Becouse they were the best from 0 to 15K (Tempest)? Becouse they were the best super-high alt interceptor of the 1945 (Ta-152H)? Hmmmmmmm ...

I know the perk system will be under evaluation for some time. Lets wait and see. But I hope HTC will find a good solution to this weird situation.

No flame, but it looks like using double standards to me.
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Offline texace

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #24 on: March 09, 2001, 08:24:00 AM »
Use the Arado like it was designed for. Run on the deck at 400 IAS and just go. Pop to drop bombs, dive to deck, go home. Easy.

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TheWobble

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #25 on: March 09, 2001, 08:36:00 AM »
 
Quote
Use the Arado like it was designed for. Run on the deck at 400 IAS and just go. Pop to drop bombs, dive to deck, go home. Easy

That would be the case if it was possible to avoid radar, even if yer flying 10 feet of the water you will show up on enemy dar, so trying anything sneaky has pretty much been banned in AH.  I would love to come burning in at 300 ffeet pop up and drop my eggs then vanish again below the radar..but in AH its not possible, do whatver you want and you will show up on dar no matter what...kinda sucks IMO.

Offline mx22

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2001, 08:43:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort:
 That was me in a TA152!(are they listed as '190' on enemy FE?) Near A15 I think?  Yep! never got closer than 900 then I hit the 'sonic layer' and slowed...good show!

Ta-152 is labeled at 152.

mx22


Offline Tac

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2001, 08:45:00 AM »
ZOOOOOOOMMMM!!! Eat my dust runstang!

Offline fd ski

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2001, 08:45:00 AM »
Think about it as a the kick bellybutton jabo plane...
-it's faster then any fighter
-it carries VERY good bomb load ( 3 x 1000lb - more then P47 i believe )
-it has a norden <sic> therefore you can't miss.
- you can fly to far target and back in really quick sortie. Lanc is something of 1/3 of it's speed.
- if you fly it at 10k and are careful enough to see attacks coming - you are pretty much untouchable.

It's an ultimate jabo bird. Squadron of 8 planes can whack the radar for whole country in one 25 minute flight with relative immunity.


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Offline Pongo

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Ar-234: Why is it perked?
« Reply #29 on: March 09, 2001, 08:53:00 AM »
You climbed up to evade a fighter?
You happend accross the only situation that would form a threat to you. And you lived even though you did the totaly wrong evasive....
What is not perk about that?
If you see the tempest fight at less then 10k you will undersand totaly why it is perked. I suspect the same is true of the ta152 at its alt. See them in the arena and then decide....