P51b- Tank Buster

[oboe]

Originally posted by fdiron
JoeCrip-I am pretty sure that if they said the P51 was a tankbuster in Saving Private Ryan, it makes that statement 100% true.  Movies don't lie...

I know there is a hook in that bait somewhere... a fatter, juicier worm is rarely seen.

Ever see that Iron Eagle movie where they used WWII warbirds to accomplish some dumb mission?   Louis Gosset Jr's character made a statement about how P-38s cleaned up on the Japanese during the Battle of Midway.

[Widewing]

Originally posted by fdiron
Replicant-The only time I got instant kills were when I used my rockets on the Panzers.  All the other times I destroyed the engines on the Panzers with sustained fire on the rear of the tanks.  

Widewing-  Please take your advice and shove it up your *BEEP*.  You can continue to fly your super slow aircraft on ground attack missions, I will stick with a plane that is faster than a world war 1 fighter.

JoeCrip-I am pretty sure that if they said the P51 was a tankbuster in Saving Private Ryan, it makes that statement 100% true.  Movies don't lie.  On a side note, P51s really did attack tanks in the ETO.  After escorting Allied bombers to their target, some P51 flights were allowed to strafe targets of oppurtunity.

So, fdiron, how long were you deprived of oxygen?

FYI, I use the Typhoon, F6F-5, Bf 110G-2 and Fw 190 (A-5 and F-8) for jabo work. For air to air, I prefer the 190A-5, N1K2, SpitfireV/Seafire and Hurricane. However, I have no aversion to going after GVs in any type, should the opportunity arise. Note that every one of the above aircraft are cannon armed, making them automatically more effective for strafing vehicles than the under-gunned P-51B. Choose your own poison, but I prefer a more effective aircraft for mud moving than the Mudstain B.

By the way, what is your arena handle?

My regards,

Widewing

[illo]

I made 4-5 passes on a panzer in the 110 with 4 20's 2 30's...

Didn't scratch im +( it probably shouldn't but i had to see for myself

Yup 20 and 30mms (unless MK101 or mk103) have no change to penetrate Pz-IV armor. With .50cals it was just the same. Even 37mm Flak using wolfram cored ammunition could just barely penetrate T-34 side turrets at close ranges  for example. This is why 50/75mm PaKs were fitted and tested on planes like Hs-129 and Ju-88. all up to 30mm cannons were only good for strafing halftracks, trucks and  armored cars. I recently read that shooting through air ventilation holes on rear deck of panzers could have some success with disabling the engine...even with .50cals.

Otherwise it's only over 30mm HV guns that can kill tanks with rear, side and top shots. Even 50mm PaK may have problems with tanks like churchills and KVs. 75mm Pak is only sure killer.

[Angus]

P.O Jonsson of 65th squadron RAF flying P51C's was on combat air patrol with some of his squadmates in the autumn 1944. He spotted a train below and dove on it to check it out. BINGO, a tank transport train on the way to the front!
Having no ordnance, he dove on the train and put a few hundred bullet holes into it. Train stopped. Jonsson radioed HQ so they could send in the Tiffies to finish off the helpless tanks.
In his words: "The Typhoons were well equipped for it and we weren't"

[SKurj]

Yes Angus only because the Typh was commonly carrying rockets for just that task.
I have pilot accounts of spits strafing tanks to no effect, who then pulled off, and let rocket armed typhs do the job right +)


SKurj

[Swoop]

I specifically remember seeing an interview of an ex Tiff pilot on Discovery not so long ago.   He said that if a tank was on a hard surface (like a road) they would aim slightly in front of the tank so that rounds would ricochett (sp?) up from the road into the soft underbelly of the tank, rather than just aim for the upper armour.

If a tank was on soft ground then it wouldnt work.

[Revvin]

I've heard reports that close hits by bombs would flip Panzers in RL yet the other night a squad mate got two 500lb bombs and 6 rockets all within but a few yards of a parked Ostwind and it did'nt appear to take any damage at all and went on to score a number of kills before finally being killed.

[Raubvogel]

Originally posted by Swoop
I specifically remember seeing an interview of an ex Tiff pilot on Discovery not so long ago.   He said that if a tank was on a hard surface (like a road) they would aim slightly in front of the tank so that rounds would ricochett (sp?) up from the road into the soft underbelly of the tank, rather than just aim for the upper armour.

If a tank was on soft ground then it wouldnt work.

Take a .50 cal round...fire it at an angle at pavement....see what kind of ballistics and kinetic energy it has after impact.

[Fester']

Had a pretty cool hop ina 110G-2 against ground armor the other night.  Killed 5 Panzers, all rear hemisphere kills.  Hitting from the side doesnt seem to do a whole lot.

All other vehicles die pretty easy under that firepower.

Anyone use rockets in the 110 to any positive effect?  I stick to the guns.


FesCAF

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by fdiron

  The only real vulnerability is its radiator.  I had my radiator hit 2 or 3 times last night and managed to return to base safely.   The speed of the 51b also allows for fast jinking gun runs in order to evade ground fire.

Thats because the inexperience of the tankers to aim for the wings, not the body, of the incoming aircraft. Tougher to hit, but when you find the sweet spot...bub-bye!

[MOTJD]

Last night whilst doing some ground work in my Tyffie!!!. We were shooting some tanks running downhill (boy was that fun and alot easier than if they were standing still)> Anyways, i straffed one hard in the rear and he flipped and rolled several times before exploding.. i laughed so hard i almost crashed myself.

[MrLars]

Rips right. You have to aim for something else besides the prop disk. I try for one of the wings or just over the wing to hit the tail section. When the plane passes a quick shot to the canopy will surely get you a few whiney comebacks on CH 1