Author Topic: 109E-4 roll rate (Read 251 times)

Raubvogel · « **on:** March 27, 2002, 12:21:34 AM »

I'm no expert on the 109E-4, but that thing rolls like it's in concrete. Has anyone tested it? Just a feeling, but it seems very slow. Rolls like a buff.

Kweassa · « **Reply #1 on:** March 27, 2002, 12:28:55 AM »

Had discussions about that earlier on, Raub, but generally people seem to agree it's roll is a bit porked. But the evidence given was all specualtion, and no hard data to back it up.

Wilbus showed us RAF test data of 109E-3 in comparison with SpitMkIa, but the roll speeds were measured at 400 mph speed. We couldn't find any data on more 'normal' combat speeds, preferably between 200-300mph.

Few things were pointed out, such as the natural advantage of square wingtips over pointed/round wingtips. In comaprison with the RAF where they sliced off their Spit wing tips to increase roll-speed, 109s had their wingtips rounded out after "F" versions. Logic would dictate if the pronciples are the same, the E should roll better, or at least, as good as a 109F.

Karnak also mentioned all his readings suggested the 109E rolled better than Spitfire MkIs.

....

Thus the conclusion.. "evidence yet to be presented, but generally people agree on it being porked".

We don't have any more specific data except individual anecdotes...

Karnak · « **Reply #2 on:** March 27, 2002, 12:57:28 AM »

Yes, I do think the Bf109E is rolling a bit poorly, but by contrast I think the Bf110C-4b is rolling way too fast. Seems to out roll Spits and 109s.

Hurri I seems to roll much too fast as well. It should suffer from the same "cloth aileron" issues as the Spit I.

Kweassa,

re: square vs rounded wing tips. I don't think the shape matters very much, if at all. I think it is simply a matter of wing area. In the clipped Spits, the wing simply has less area to offer as resistance in a roll.

As for the Bf109, didn't the entire wing pretty much get redesigned going fron the E to the F series?

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #3 on:** March 27, 2002, 01:04:54 AM »

This plane responds so poorly in rolling that I think I broke my Joystick fighting/scissoring in a 109E4 after the release. I was pushing as hard as I could to get it moving. Its awful. But will HTC fix it? Hopefully they will as they have addreses many issues very quickly like adding weight and drag to the 110 and lowering the E4 climb rates. This fix should come just as fast, right?

Sikboy · « **Reply #4 on:** March 27, 2002, 07:10:10 AM »

I was flying it in the CT last night (had a blast in there btw, feels like a totally different game) and I noticed that it rolled poorly, but I figured it was just because I've been flying the A8 a lot in the MA.

-SB-

SKurj · « **Reply #5 on:** March 27, 2002, 09:52:13 AM »

Hmm I was always under the impression that the hurri out rolled the spit...

SKurj

ergRTC · « **Reply #6 on:** March 27, 2002, 10:04:50 AM »

Hurrie rolls pretty slow too, but better than the 109 or spit. I think that is in line with the history right?

Whether it is historical or not, right now, the way it is, I think the BOB setup is the biggest rush for dogfighting on the net. Those planes are so evenly matched up it is always a thrill! Its so satisfying to see how well these planes performed against each other. Even with the carb induced engine cut outs, and speed like a 90 yr old man on viagra, the hurri is still a 'good' plane for 1940. Cant climb, cant go fast, but it can do well if it has an e advantage, or gets them to come down and furball. It can also absorb large amounts of 12.7 mm lead.

For those that love the lw birds, a bnz 109e (yes that is a good strat for that plane in the ct) is impossible for a hurri or spit to deal with. Its also got cannons. Same goes for the 110.