Author Topic: HCMode (If you would say so)  (Read 545 times)

Offline Downtown

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« on: May 28, 2000, 09:13:00 AM »
Pyro seems to be saying that those of us who appreciate a challenge (not a quote, a aglomeration of statements that I am using here) are not populace enough to keep HTC in the BLACK!

Ergo to keep the financial coffers filled, at some point, in some fashion, an EZMode type flight model will be introduced in some fashion, and may (calm your nerves) be introduced into the main.

Now I am all for HTC Making Oodles and Oodles of money.  For my dime I wouldn't mind if HT and Pyro were calling Bill Gates a pauper.

Heres the Rub, I fly Aces High for the Challenge, I know that I am not the best pilot, I am not the top in any category.  But, I like the challenge, I look for Torque in his F4U-1C, I look for Citibria in his 38, I look for the Stormio Casa Guys in their Macchis, I look for Natedog, HT, and Pyro when the fly, cause I figure to improve, I got to fly against the best.

So, if the HTC, HT, and Pyro need the fundage that an EZmode would garner them by drawing new blood.  Could HT and Pyro consider a HardCoreMode and HardCore Arena?

Who would fly it, remember there has to be enough response to warrant their time and effort to do the development.

So, if you like it rough, say so below!

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[This message has been edited by Downtown (edited 05-28-2000).]

Offline RAM

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2000, 09:19:00 AM »
As long as EZmode is away from the arena I am flying Its okay with me.

If I am in the choice of flying in a mixed arena or fly nowhere then I fly nowhere (but of course my money remains in my pocket).

Is very simple ,as I see it they can open another arena called the "mixed Main Arena". THey can do whatever they want there, I dont mind (as I'll never put my nose in there). But If HTC puts it into MA, then I'm gone.

and if they open an HA and put Mixed on MA I'm gone too. Why? because I like MA rules. I dont want to change countries in order to choose some planes (as I'd have to do in HA). YEs, I fly something more than Fw190  

This is my position. As long as EZ is away from where I want to be ,its okay for me...if not, with sadness, I'll take my $s and get outta AH  

Offline Saintaw

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2000, 09:25:00 AM »
I will not leave, because Shootin/getting shot is only PART of the fun I have here (I like to talk about Fishin' with Tonto over RW)...

But if thee is one (Tough arena) I sure will stay in it... I haven't been shot down so many times to quit now, you see  

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Offline snafu

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2000, 09:45:00 AM »
Yup,
Easymode arena would be fine (But give it's own arena - Not the MA). I would stick with the (more) realistic one we have now - I have enough problems living with one flight model.

TTFN
snafu

Offline indian

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2000, 09:48:00 AM »
Like it hard like it is. No easymode here.

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Offline 1776

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2000, 09:59:00 AM »
Throws vote to one arena for all...one community for all....Now, HTC,HE HE,how ya gonna do it?  I'm game for some experimentation!!!!

What's ya got??  Go for it!!

The owners,designers,and programers fly this sim too.  Do we really think they would trash it for bucks?  NO!!

[This message has been edited by 1776 (edited 05-28-2000).]

Offline StSanta

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2000, 12:32:00 PM »
The thing is that setting up an arena is one part, populating it another. As it is right now, attendance is low during American snooze hours and adding one or two more arenas will thin out the number of people even more.

What HTC is saying is that they've tried it before and it makes financial sense and that their customer base won't be affected in a negative way at least financially.

Think it's important to acknowledge that there aren't too many of us purist level playing fields fanatics out there. We sure are outnumbered by the people who transition from say Fighter Ace to a more complex sim.

We'll likely see a shift in the customer base - out goes the purists, and in their place we have one or two transitional pilots. Good for those pilots, good for HTC, but less good for the few purists.

To be perfectly honest, the reason I never thought about EZ mode before is that I did not think AH was trying to reach out to the transitional crowd - in my mind it was trying to fill a very small niche, but one that was large enough to produce enough cash to make a relatively small company survive economically. But it seems that niche isn't very big, despite the hundreds of millions of people with an internet connection.

I just realized that I have two criteria - "maximum realism" and "level playing field". AH will certainly continue to fill number one in terms of flight model, damage model etc, so that one cannot be criticised. Number two is a different matter.

How do you find out if you're a Level Playing Field Fanatic(tm)? Well, if you've played a sim, be it against computer AI or humans and you've thrown your joystick into the monitor in disgust while screaming "*I* cannot do that by pulling the stick. He's using an alternative way of controlling it than through surfaces!" you're in the danger zone.

If you've gone with a thai boxing veteran friend of yours to a training session for the first time and said "no, I don't want you to hold back, that's not fair", you're probably a LPFF. :=D

Now if *you* where the veteran, you'd likely hold back - unless you where in the finals of a competition or something. And I gather you'd scream "not fair, he's using a gun!" if he pulled out a semi automatic, smiled grimly and pointed it your way   .

I didn't work my way up the foodchain to be eaten by a furry wabbit with a Colt .45.  

I don't know Westy, I hope you do not consider this whining. HTC, I hope you won't see me as evil and against you - I am not and I've got high opinions of you and you've deserved it. It's just that for a few of us, not having the favourite dish at the restaurant will make us find another one, no matter *how* good the rest of the food is, how well it is served, how clean and nice the waiters/waitresses. We're just hardwired in another way for better or worse, and I don't consider us superior to transitional pilots so it's not a matter of elitism.

To restate one of RAM's points (using other words); I need to try it as much as I need to try eating something I really don't like and pay money for it. Just a matter of personal taste here people   .

In the end I'll probably try it, get a foul taste in my mouth and scream "THAT'S why I don't eat this!"   .

Sorry for the long post. I've contracted the Badgerivian virus.

Sincerely

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StSanta
II/JG2
 

[This message has been edited by StSanta (edited 05-28-2000).]

Offline SC-GreyBeard

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2000, 06:21:00 PM »
From a business point of view, I can see the need for a EZ mode. It does make sense after all to try and appeal to as many "ability" levels as possible, thus increasing the customer base. At the same time, I can see the "purists" POV also.

Being a low skill type flyer, I'd not mind an occassional excursion into EZ mode myself. HOWEVER, I'd be miffed more than a tad, if i was flying "Real Mode" and some guy that has the skills to beat me in RM, was using EZ just to rack score. Be honest, it has and will happen.

That being said, I'm in the wait and see mode currently. HT and crew have thus far given us one hell of a great product. I doubt that they'll intentionally alienate a % of thier customer base the way the majority of the guys posting about this are saying.

We already have a training area. Perhaps, HT will use THAT for EZ mode, and leave the main alone for the more stout hearted. Time will tell.

Myself, I'll stay in the "Real Mode" area as long as I have fun 80% of the time I fly. (I figure the 20% is the amount of time I'm so miffed I wanna chuck the puter through the window)

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Offline Pongo

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2000, 10:11:00 PM »
Seperate arenas will have to balance against the feeling of comunity we all get flying togther. Maybe a number of kills till easy mode turns off would be better.

Offline RAM

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2000, 06:48:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Pongo:
Seperate arenas will have to balance against the feeling of comunity we all get flying togther. Maybe a number of kills till easy mode turns off would be better.


I agree on the number of kills for easy mode. Can be a helpful measure for newbies,and for not letting expert people fly in EZmode.

It has its drawbacks and I dont like it very much...but I wont whine too much if implemented (hehehe)      


[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 05-29-2000).]

Offline Maniac

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2000, 07:12:00 AM »
If there gonna be an easy mode then i hope there will be an easy mode arena to go with it.

One thing i really like about AH is that i know that _everyone_ has the same setting (real mode) in the arena.

Regards.

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Offline CavemanJ

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2000, 08:22:00 AM »
Pongo that might be a workable solution

but, barring that, one of the problems is gonna be when a seasoned vet starts flying EZ.  Imagine Torque flying his DweebC in EZ mode.  
SYSTEM: Victory 21 by Torque of =357th Pony Express=
Not a pretty picture.
I'd also be mighty upset if/when some newbie in EZ mode pulls a 7G turn to pull lead and not blackout when I can't pull more than 4.5Gs to get away and still see where I'm going.  Part of this sentiment (I think) comes from learning the flightmodels starting back in beta tour 1.
I think that mixing the MA would be a very bad move

funked

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2000, 08:50:00 AM »
Cave WB EZ mode doesn't allow you to pull more gees before blacking out.  It's got an AoA limiter so you actually pull LESS gees than the normal planes.  

WB EZ mode planes can't do anything a normal mode plane can't do.  In fact, due to the AoA limiter, the envelope is a little narrower.

WB EZ mode IMHO crippled the airplane.  The only thing overmodelled about it is the whining on AGW.  

However EZ mode lets a hamfisted pilot run right at the edge of the envelope without fear of making a mistake and flick-stalling or spinning.  And you don't have to worry about trimming.



[This message has been edited by funked (edited 05-29-2000).]

Offline popeye

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2000, 10:22:00 AM »
Well, I'm willing to wait and see what HTC comes up with, but my gut feeling is that I want to know that the other guy is playing exactly the same game that I am.  Otherwise, the competitive aspect of the game is lost or seriously devalued in endless speculation of the possible (dis)advantages of this or that mode.

If HTC is losing customers because of a steep learning curve, I like Pongo's idea of a limited time (number of kills, whatever) EZ mode for new players.

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Offline DmdBT

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HCMode (If you would say so)
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2000, 10:39:00 AM »
How about an official training course similar to AWTA (Air Warrior Training Academy) which had a pair of trainers work with classes of 4 to 6(max) over a period of what, 8 weeks, that helped get them up to speed in the arena. It taught the basic commands, acm, tactics, and plane strengths/weaknesses, and a written exam. It was a well structured learning environment and was very effective in turning out competent newbies.

For myself, I am all for increasing the customer base. A mixed arena wouldn't bother me if limits like time/kills were in place and they were unable to accumulate points towards riding the uber-planes. I did play WB's for a while with the mixed arena, didnt really notice or bother with it.

Now a separate arena like AW's relaxed realism would be ideal. Just cruise over there and look, generally there are 5 times more players in RR than FR.

T