Author Topic: What I learned last night... (Read 217 times)

gofaster · « **on:** April 25, 2002, 09:25:54 AM »

Last night was an educational session for me. I decided to take a F4U1D with drop tanks and rockets and attack a front-line enemy airbase to stem an attack on two of our airfields. Climb out on WEP was uneventful and I was actually able to avoid the enemy fighters and find the enemy base amongst the rolling hills and heavy underbrush. At 15k alt and 250 knots, I nosed it over into a dive and put the gunsight pipper on a gun emplacement, squeezed off two rockets, put the pipper on another gun emplacement, squeezed off two more rockets, then pulled the nose up to avoid a collision with the ground.

The nose went up, the aircraft went into positive pitch, wings level, the wind was screaming through my ears, but ...

THE PLANE WAS STILL GOING DOWN! Argh! Tunnel-vision, black-out, impact. Back to the tower.

I tried some similar attacks, dropping the tanks with 50% fuel onboard, dropping gear, dropping flaps, but I still kept waiting too long to pull up and my Whistling Death only whistled its death to me. Guess I should practice my rocket attacks offline. I'm sure more than a few Bishops got kill credits simply by being in the right place when I augered in.

Next time - dogfighting!

Ripsnort · « **Reply #1 on:** April 25, 2002, 09:30:16 AM »

Yes, but then of course there's folks like Mandoble that think the F4U is uber. LOL!

TheOxman · « **Reply #2 on:** April 25, 2002, 09:32:01 AM »

In thoses planes it's hard for me to dive bomb. I use my rudder to slow up a bit. Try that;)

Hortlund · « **Reply #3 on:** April 25, 2002, 09:34:32 AM »

The F4U is one of the fighters I fear.

I fly 190s and the F4U is one of the few who can keep up with me if I want to extend. Add x Nr of .50cal MGs with unlimited ammo, and you see why I dont like to have one hanging D800 on my 6 when I pull into a zero G dive.

Eagler · « **Reply #4 on:** April 25, 2002, 09:38:45 AM »

cut throttle when you dive, then use rudder to slow if you have to..

works in the 109's anyway

Don · « **Reply #5 on:** April 25, 2002, 09:41:04 AM »

There is also the effects that lag may have on your a/c which, tend to go unnoticed or are not considered. If your Host Queue readings are bad, very strange things will occur eg. auger for no apparent reason; rubber bullets; warping and unresponsive controls.
In another flight sim we used to call the effect a suck stall; where for no apparent reason you would stall out or spin out with no hope of pulling out. Corrective stick inputs didn't work because your connection or the arena lag was so bad your a/c didnt respond.
I use the F4U 1D for Jabo a lot, and I usually do the same things in the same way; sometimes I have success and am accurate, other times inexplicable things happen.

Apar · « **Reply #6 on:** April 25, 2002, 10:22:03 AM »

Using rudder to slow down in a dive bomb or dive rocket attack will totally mess up your aim.

You need to practise the dive bomb or rocket attack off-line or in TA.
I use 10k alt (relative to base), cut throttle, dive in release at 4-5k alt and gently pull out. It is not a problem at all in the f4u, there are other planes that compress much earlier than the f4u.

GL

Apar

AKDejaVu · « **Reply #7 on:** April 25, 2002, 10:28:52 AM »

Its difficult to regulate your speed at the bottom of the dive... one of the best places to do it is actually at the start of the dive. If you begin a dive at 350 IAS... its gonna be real damn tough to keep slow enough for a pull out.

Practice off-line to see what speed you need to be at from different altitudes. Or practice on-line. Just practice.

Oh yeah... and when you hear the creaking... make sure "auto-trim" is off and use the trim tabs to pull out of the dive. Anything else is going to leave your wingtips floating to the earth as you rocket towards it.

AKDejaVu

gofaster · « **Reply #8 on:** April 25, 2002, 10:53:07 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by AKDejaVu
Its difficult to regulate your speed at the bottom of the dive... one of the best places to do it is actually at the start of the dive. If you begin a dive at 350 IAS... its gonna be real damn tough to keep slow enough for a pull out.

Practice off-line to see what speed you need to be at from different altitudes. Or practice on-line. Just practice.

Oh yeah... and when you hear the creaking... make sure "auto-trim" is off and use the trim tabs to pull out of the dive. Anything else is going to leave your wingtips floating to the earth as you rocket towards it.

AKDejaVu

Good advice! I was starting my dives between 250 and 300 knots (a couple of times, I tried going in at 15k alt and 250 knots and 10k alt at 300 or so knots just to see how it would affect a run). I cut throttle before going down, and dropped my landing gear as a dive brake and 1 notch of flaps, too. I think my problem is that I'm having trouble judging my acceleration and hence my speed at the bottom of the dive, and then I'm getting too low to pull out. Basically, this bird is heavier than I thought it was, and I'm spoiled by years of divebombing in the F4U in "Air Warrior" which didn't feature the problem of mushing at the bottom of a high-speed pull-out. I augered the F4U in CFS2 many times the first few nights when I tried some strafing attacks on barges, for probably the same reason.

One other thing I learned is that a P-51D can outpace an F4UD in level flight. A couple of times I tried to run down some marauding Mustangs after I pickled my ordinance and drop tanks, only to see the rangefinder tick up the yards as the P-51s pulled away. I guess its a good thing Pappy Boyington didn't have to worry about belligerent Mustang pilots!

Ripsnort · « **Reply #9 on:** April 25, 2002, 11:05:19 AM »

My advice: Begin your dive at 10,000 feet, not 15. If you come in higher than 10k, then spiral dive down to 10k, then flatten out, line up, and begin your dive, when you start seeing the AA getting close to you, you should be plenty close in your 60-80 degree dive to release, then pull back gently on the stick til the nose it up,and start turning so the AA doesn't drone target you.

Nifty · « **Reply #10 on:** April 25, 2002, 11:34:47 AM »

at least he knew to deploy his landing gear as a dive brake in the D Hog!

Personally, I dive from about 8-10k. release about 3-5k. Well, for bombs anyways. I don't dive to release rockets, usually just come in near ground level like I'm strafing.

Also, I'd recommend just using the 0.50 cals to strafe the ack. Save the 8 rockets for something with more hardness. However, do what you have the most fun doing.

Ripsnort · « **Reply #11 on:** April 25, 2002, 11:47:31 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nifty

Also, I'd recommend just using the 0.50 cals to strafe the ack. Save the 8 rockets for something with more hardness. However, do what you have the most fun doing.

Bingo

Although I can de-ack a base with rockets only (and live, one of my training films showed this) its much better to use gunfire if you want to have a higher chance of survival.

cajun · « **Reply #12 on:** April 25, 2002, 12:18:41 PM »

I almost allways fly F4U1-C and found the best way to dive bomb is to come at as much of a 45 degree angle as possible at your target (don't dive straight down at high speeds) I cut engine and lower flaps before diving and using rudder 2 slow me down a lil. While diving at a 45 degree angle u can use your gunsight to aim your bombs/rockets accuretly, works for me 90% of the time but takes practice...

PS I havnt read all the posts so I may just be repeating what somebody already said.