Author Topic: Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?  (Read 962 times)

Offline Dead Man Flying

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2002, 02:05:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
JFK! LOL!  Now I'm busting a gut!  I'll save my opinions of him for another thread (Though I will credit him for one good thing, Civil rights)


JFK didn't accomplish anything with civil rights.  He was a policy wonk who sweated every last detail, and in so doing he ensured that civil rights legislation was going to be tied up by Southern segregationists who were also sweating every last detail.

If you're going to give credit for civil rights to someone, at least give it where it's due.  Lyndon Johnson championed civil rights reform as Senate majority leader (along with space exploration, which was his little baby long before Kennedy came along), and he shepherded civil rights legislation through the same recalcitrant Congress within which Kennedy had been unable.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2002, 02:10:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dead Man Flying


JFK didn't accomplish anything with civil rights.  He was a policy wonk who sweated every last detail, and in so doing he ensured that civil rights legislation was going to be tied up by Southern segregationists who were also sweating every last detail.

If you're going to give credit for civil rights to someone, at least give it where it's due.  Lyndon Johnson championed civil rights reform as Senate majority leader (along with space exploration, which was his little baby long before Kennedy came along), and he shepherded civil rights legislation through the same recalcitrant Congress within which Kennedy had been unable.

-- Todd/Leviathn


Civil Rights Bill, 1963.

Offline Nath[BDP]

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2002, 02:30:39 PM »
make 3 a 4 and you are right.
++Blue Knights++
vocalist of the year


Offline Dead Man Flying

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2002, 02:30:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Civil Rights Bill, 1963.


Are you thinking of the Civil Rights Act?  This was passed by Congress in 1964 with Johnson as president.  It was introduced in 1963 under Kennedy, but it faced endless debate and revision.  It was nowhere close to being passed when he died, and it took Johnson's leadership (and his strong relationships with Southern senators from his majority leader days) to get things done.

At the heart of it was a fundamentally different approach to congressional relations.  Whereas Kennedy was a policy wonk who sweated every single line, every word, and every detail, Johnson was a big picture kinda guy.  Because Kennedy insisted on exact wording, he came to blows with Democrats and Republicans alike who found fault with his administration's interpretation of civil rights legislation.  Conversely, Johnson preferred to let Congress sweat the details so long as they didn't touch some of the key provisions he insisted remain in the bill.

It's funny to listen to some of the recordings of Kennedy or Johnson discussing civil rights with staff.  I recall one in particular where Kennedy and his staff are going through the bill line by line making grammatical and punctuation changes.  In the background, you can hear Vice-President Johnson suggest that they forego such a wasteful enterprise and just send the thing to Congress.  Kennedy and his aids pause for a few seconds, say nothing, then go back to line reading again.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2002, 02:40:33 PM »
Okay, I correct myself, I don't like Kennedy for anything then! (that was the only thing I "held onto" for hope for that man) Hehe!

Offline Dead Man Flying

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2002, 02:46:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Okay, I correct myself, I don't like Kennedy for anything then! (that was the only thing I "held onto" for hope for that man) Hehe!


Ah, but now the question is... how do you view Johnson now that you know this about him?  :)

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2002, 02:49:08 PM »
Honestly, I don't have an opinion on Johnson, haven't read any books on him.  I do know he was far from a typical "Left wing Liberal" that we have in todays politics, so anything towards "Moderate" is fine with me.

Things I disliked about Kennedy:
Hookers at the 1960 Democratic Convention
Buying Votes in West Virginia
Illicit Relations by Government Officials
Hotel Sex Orgies
The fact he almost got the entire planet nuked!

Offline midnight Target

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2002, 02:49:54 PM »
I bet FOR the USA in the soccer game BTW Meitla. While I lost and now have to place this sickening lie into my siggy, I am still proud of the fact that I supported our boys while someone who I won't mention...............
but his initials are RIPSNORT
................chose to bet with the Germans! Makes one wonder about Rips true allegances.............hmmmmm mmmmmmm?

:p

Still waving the flag with my left hand :cool:

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2002, 02:51:15 PM »
I bet with my head, not my heart. ;)  (That's why I always win!) ;)

Offline midnight Target

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2002, 02:56:08 PM »
I will exact my Pinko Lefty Liberal revenge on you. However I am bound by the pinko lefty liberal code to feel remorse afterward. :)

QUAH!

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2002, 02:58:12 PM »
LOL Midnight! Have a great week end, I'm off the BBS for a couple day!

Offline Ripsnort

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2002, 03:00:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dead Man Flying


Ah, but now the question is... how do you view Johnson now that you know this about him?  :)

-- Todd/Leviathn


I also might add, had I been 30-40 years old back then, early 60's, I might have been a dedicated democrat, but as my father-in-law puts it.."I did not leave the Democratic party, IT left ME!"

Offline eskimo2

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2002, 03:05:00 PM »
FDR

Offline mietla

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2002, 03:06:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by midnight Target
I bet FOR the USA in the soccer game BTW Meitla. While I lost and now have to place this sickening lie into my siggy, I am still proud of the fact that I supported our boys while someone who I won't mention...............
but his initials are RIPSNORT
................chose to bet with the Germans! Makes one wonder about Rips true allegances.............hmmmmm mmmmmmm?

:p

Still waving the flag with my left hand :cool:


And that's why I'm so proud of you. :)

Offline midnight Target

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Midnight, just who WAS the greatest president in modern times?
« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2002, 03:15:44 PM »
My real actual no watermelon favorite Pres of all time is Teddy R. He is by far the most interesting of them all, and arguably one of the smartest and most foresighted. He was THE worlds expert on a particular type of fowl (don't remember the genus, I'm sure its in google somewhere). He established our national Park system. He was a brilliant orator, even finished a speech after being shot in the chest. He was as they say "bigger than life".