Author Topic: I am not sure if I understand this correctly... (Read 1193 times)

zipity · « **Reply #30 on:** June 30, 2002, 07:02:57 AM »

One thing is certain, HTC is in business to make money. If this feature brings in a whole bunch of new players allowing HTC to make more money and thereby give us more/better releases...that's a good thing. If on the other hand, this feature ruins the game play we've all come to expect, I'm sure HTC will hear about it before we all give up on the game and quit. Given HTC's history I think we can all relax a bit with the understanding that HTC will make changes to keep their customer base intact.

In the mean time, if anyone can name a sim that is more responsive to their community, has a better flight model and costs as little as AH...please speak up..I'd love to give it a try.

lord dolf vader · « **Reply #31 on:** June 30, 2002, 10:38:08 AM »

dude you beter specify massivly multi player cause except for that il2 beats um on all counts . and every thread dosent get attacked as a whine by the chearleaders.

RRAM · « **Reply #32 on:** June 30, 2002, 10:50:27 AM »

I am sure that everyone knows what I think about any help of this kind into MA.

so I'll simply save my words for until the release has happened.

Kweassa · « **Reply #33 on:** June 30, 2002, 11:04:39 AM »

Learning how to fly has a lot to do with learning limitations.

Hard practice and study rewards players with "skill".

"Skilled" people know their aircraft by every inch, every corner. A "skilled" pilot feels rewarded and earn some sense of pride from the fact that they have mastered the plane of their choice - whereas an unskilled pilot does not know where the limits lie in, and consistantly meet failure. A steep learning curve is what motivates people to try harder, and feel competitive towards someone better than they.

I spent a lot of time learning to control my degree of pulling the stick, how much I may wield it without having to stall everytime, what sort of maneuver it takes to sucker the other pilot into augering and so on..

If I ever get to see cocky newbies flying around and pulling super tight turns(which, people like me have had to practice for months to learn the right degree of control - with a large risk of crashing the plane) in an already disgustingly(my personal opinion!) well turning Spitfires or N1K2s the first day they get off the ground... I think I'm gonna be sick.

Or, when I see a total newbie sticking behind my 6 OC no matter what I do, and get to think to myself "gee, this guy hardly understands flight and tactics.. he would probably smack the ground in wild stick pull if it weren't for that stall-limiter..!"...

It's gonna be a really sad day.

I just hope this function is disabled at the MA... and host-controlled in H2H games.

ps) On the other hand, if it isn't what some people believe it is(allowing people to achieve maximum possible AoA in current situation without worry of stalling the aircraft)..

and if it is a simple 'crutch' tool so the limiter literally limits the stall in terms of 'likely-to-stall basis' (meaning, it will stop stick input at the moment stall buzzers start to ring) - so that it is a nifty tool for basic training purposes, but virtually useless to be used in actual combat..

I guess it's ok in that case..

RRAM · « **Reply #34 on:** June 30, 2002, 12:16:55 PM »

Yep Kweassa...That is what I think too.

I just know that I learned how to fly the hard way. Fighting and dying. By the old means of the trial&error. And I loved each moment of learning even while sometimes it was hard.

Everyone who started in the MMOL flight simulaton world,learned to fly that way. As many others here did. What's the problem with it?.

Maybe I'm too closed minded to understand it, but, well, for me this is no good. We already have autotakeoffs. We already have CT (wich I heartly dislike). We will have incentives for the trainers to teach new people.

Why to add FBW into AH?. One of the first BIG issues in ANY realistic flight simulation is to understand why planes stall, and how to avoid it. It is the FIRST rule to learn here...and now we're bypassing it with this option.

That is something than even in TA is not good. That doesn't teach you to fly properly, that just will create a vice on any newbie who turns it on.

This is no good...But that's just my take on the matter.

Vortex · « **Reply #35 on:** June 30, 2002, 12:21:17 PM »

dolf vader,

I'm not sure what others would define as "Massisvely Multiplayer", but if one goes by what seems to be the norm in the gaming industry you'd be something like the following: 2-3k people on a given server would put you in the ballpark, with 20-30k playing during prime time over numerous servers. MMP applies more to the Big 3 RPG's...EQ, AC, DAoC, and to a lesser extent now, UO and AO. I'm not aware of any online flightsims that come close to this level of user base. Lots of "Multiplayer" ones out there, no "Massive" ones though.

Vortex

RRAM · « **Reply #36 on:** June 30, 2002, 02:34:42 PM »

From news:

7 Added a stall limiter, this has a number of modes of configuration from the host.

a) No one can use it.
b) Everyone must use it.
c) User selectable.
d) Only new users (1 month) can select it.

I guess MA will be in d) mode. I still don't like it (I really don't see how putting a stall limiter will help the learning of anyone), but the sky's not falling after all.

.

No whinestorm it seems, hehehe. As I said, I don't think is a real help for any newbie, but it's a nice idea on how to implement it without enabling an EZ-mode in MA

RRAM · « **Reply #37 on:** June 30, 2002, 02:36:49 PM »

BTW wtf is HT doing WORKING in sunday?

this guys sometimes --really-- amaze me

BOOT · « **Reply #38 on:** June 30, 2002, 04:34:26 PM »

People seem to be concerned that this Stall Limiter will make Aces High an arcade game !

IMO the MA is already there.

1. The FM in AH is not anywhere nearly as difficult as FR was in AW.

2. I would welcome a RR arena in AH, because it would allow AH to have a FR Arena where we could have friendly collisions and no kill shooter.

3. We could have FR without HO's... and we wouldn't have the Gang Bang theory of attack being the most prevalent form of attack on bases...

4. It would provide a seperate arena for the not quite so serious players to play and have fun... while allowing those that truly love the Flight Sim and realism aspects to fly without interference.

5. We might actually get some good one on one fights !!!

I am all for a RR arena in Aces High. For kicks our squad used to go into one of the RR arenas for a squad nite once in awhile...
We went in took names and plain and simple kicked arse...
the only problem was after flying in an RR arena... It took a little time to re-acclimate to the FR flight model

Just my .02cents worth

X2Lee · « **Reply #39 on:** June 30, 2002, 05:44:38 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by BOOT
People seem to be concerned that this Stall Limiter will make Aces High an arcade game !

IMO the MA is already there.

1. The FM in AH is not anywhere nearly as difficult as FR was in AW.

Yes but AW FR wasnt a good FM it gave you a difficult FM by giving you unrealistic penaties for leaving the flight envelope.
Like those BS spins and at least a thousand ft of alt loss to recover.

And did you know you can stall an aircraft without spinning it? In RL anyways, not in AW

Just a few of the unrealistic things in the AW FR BS FM.Harder does not translate into more realistic.

AW was 10 times as arcadish as AH is and thats a fact.

sling322 · « **Reply #40 on:** June 30, 2002, 05:49:15 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by BOOT
3. We could have FR without HO's... and we wouldn't have the Gang Bang theory of attack being the most prevalent form of attack on bases...

So explain to me once again how this is going to get rid of HO attacks?!?!

Fariz · « **Reply #41 on:** June 30, 2002, 05:59:15 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by RRAM
BTW wtf is HT doing WORKING in sunday?

this guys sometimes --really-- amaze me

I think that HTC tried to make it in time until the end of month, that is why work on sunday. They did not promised this, but said it will be most likely out till end of month. When they saw that they can't make it, they put out some information to keep people from killing the server by checking forum for news every 3 seconds

Hortlund · « **Reply #42 on:** June 30, 2002, 06:09:11 PM »

First time I ever took off in the MA was in dec-01. I had spent perhaps 2-3 hours offline learning the basics. I was an ace on offline sims though. And I suffered heavily from the "hard turn"-syndrome, basically it was the only acm I knew (well that one and the Immelmann anyway) all other manuvers forced you to loose eye contact with the bandit at some point in the manuver.

So I rolled a 190a5 from A42 in the Baltic map. Got off the ground ok, saw that there was some action over the water, so I turned my little 190a5 gently to the left and headed for the action. I must have pulled too tight though, because the next second the stall horn was going off like crazy, and I found myself in a nasty stall. Less then 30 seconds later I was back in the tower. And I was ashamed too...better believe it. I thought every pilot within Icon range sat infront of their monitors laughing their tulips off at me.

So anyway, I grabbed myself another 190a5, got on the runway. This time I drove smack into the tower on the takeoff roll.

So now Im sitting infront of my monitor embarrased beyond words. In fact, I was so convinced that I now had a reputation among the rooks (yes you read right, I started out as a rook) as being the worst crappy rookie ever, so I switched country. I became knight, and once again I chose the 190a5. I chose a desolate field (I think it was A1 or something...miles from anything) and once again I started the engine. This time it worked better, I got off the ground, and I spent an hour or so trying to master all the difficulties of flying.

Nowadays I'm somewhat better on taking off (but I still have the occational smack into the tower or some FH on the takeoff roll). And sometimes when Im rolling from some base I see some new guy with a handle like 6644833 or Jedi15 desperately trying to get his ride off the ground. And I smile some, not to be mean or anything, but because I remember what it was like to sit there sweating infront of the computer trying to get airborne in the MA for the first time.

Im sure I had a point to this story when I began. I suppose it was something like, its supposed to be hard in the beginning, it gets so much more rewarding when you learn to master it.

And now you also know why I fly for the knights (true story).

funkedup · « **Reply #43 on:** June 30, 2002, 06:13:42 PM »

Yep Hortlund I have sat in the tower and just watched guys trying to take off over and over again. Roll, rotate early, spin, crash, repeat. If this can reduce their frustration level so they stick with the game long enough to learn how to do it right, that's good for business. And it means more targets for me.

McQ · « **Reply #44 on:** June 30, 2002, 06:59:39 PM »

We already have stall limiter.
It's your pitch sliders in a joystick set-up screen.
I've got mine 1/4 of the way down ( from the top ) and what it does is let me pull all the G's I want (up to 4-5 G's at 300mph).
You will still stall trying to pull 4 G's at 200 but that's where the stall horn comes in handy. On the other hand if you pull more than 5 G's or so at 300 mph you'll black-out. Yes i know, we all have done a pull out from a steep dive completely blacked out and next thing you see is blue sky. Maybe fixing this bug will come later but for now I try to avoid black outs, just like the real pilots do.
BTW, if any of guys wanna give it a try use the G-meter in your cockpit and have your stick set-up so you are just on a edge of black out at your plane's corner speed.
!S!