I am confused?

[Downtown]

According to the History Channel, B-17s operated with full crews in Electrically heated clothing, and had oxygen so that they could operate at 300 feet.  Most B-17s were lost to enemy fighters.  In AH most fighters are useless at 30,000 feet.  Plus the service ceiling on many of these planes is above 30,000 feet, yet they have difficulty clmbing and turning at 30,000 feet.  Is there a gameplay allowance, or are level attacks against bombers at 30000 feet accurate.  I have always read that you made a diving attack on bombers, can't dive on em if you can't turn at 30000 nor can you climb above em at 30000.  So whats the problem?

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"Downtown" Lincoln Brown.
    lkbrown1@tir.com    
 http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1
Wrecking Crews "Drag and Die Guy"
Hals und beinbruch!

[funked]

1.  The bombers didn't bomb at 30,000 feet.
2.  Most of the fighters have a ceiling of 35,000 to 40,000 feet.  They can still climb at 25,000 to 30,000 feet but the amount of excess power is greatly reduced from that at sea level.  Excess power is what makes maneuvering possible.
3.  The bombers in this game can use very small fuel loads because they don't have to fly very far.  With nearly dry tanks, they have much better performance than the "official" ratings which are for a full fuel and bomb load.

[Replicant]

The RAF did bomb at 30,000ft with some of their early B17s and the USAAF did go up to that altitude on some missions.  The main problem was gaining altitude and the rate of fuel consumed just to get to that alt - heavier fuel load.  Also the B17 engines had oil pressure problems at that altitude for some reason.

'Nexx'

[Fishu]

Not to forget to mention that fighters drains fuel quuuite fast in AH arena.. (and they must start chase with full load)

[Downtown]

But, when you get up that high in a fighter, and you have burned off fuel, and you try to manuver to get a shot, if you have to make even a slight adjustment you stall.  Climbing, my plane saches (sa'chaize) back and forth all the time.  I have a hard time just keeping up, and you are meat for even a novice gunner.  It just seems incredible to me that I can't fly ahead of a bomber, reverse and dive on its nose like I have read was the standard attack against a bomber. I...

1. Can't get above a bomber

2. Can't fly fast enough to get ahead of a bomber.

3. Can't manuver if I manage to get into position.

4. If I am lucky, I get one pass and that is all.  If I manage to get above and ahead, I can't climb back in position to get the second pass before the bomber is gone.

Planes I have attacked buffs with.

N1KJ (I know this is a bad plane to fly to alt, but I was the onlyone who stood a chance to get to the 30K buff.)

P-51 A Plane that Escorted bombers, flew at the same altitude and could manuver well enough to combat enemy aircraft at that altitude.

109G10  Wasn't this plane used to attack bombers by the germans?

109A8 Ditto

F4U1C  I don't know that this attacked a lot of bombers but it seems to me that with 4 20MM it should be a "Bomba Killa."

I believe something needs to change, I can see a need for "Gameplay" allowances for Buffs, but not to the exclusion that they are offensive weapons.  I routinely get attacked by B-17s and B-26s in a fighter.  I don't think that, that should ever happen!

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"Downtown" Lincoln Brown.
     lkbrown1@tir.com      
 http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1
Wrecking Crews "Drag and Die Guy"
Hals und beinbruch!

[This message has been edited by Downtown (edited 06-07-2000).]

[RAM]

I will only say that a Fw190A8 is hard to put higher than 25K.

IN WWII many of the Fw190s used against bombers had GM1 booster ,that significantly improved the high altitude of the 190 (not enought to couple with enemy fighters but for sure it was a much needed improvement).AFAIK, GM1 isnt provided to 190A8 (It would be a good hangar option, as it significantly reduced the range, but gave Fw190 a much better altitude performance).

Me109s should perform very well at high altitudes, as DB series had very good high altitude performances due to well designed superchargers. P38 should do very well over 30K too due to turbosuperchargers.

IMHO Bombers are UFOs right now. I cant believe that a B26 comes and bounces my Fw190A and he can follow my breat turn (the Immelmann after it was another thing, tho   ).

[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 06-05-2000).]