Author Topic: No damage model on Buffs (Read 159 times)

BGBMAW · « **on:** September 11, 2002, 10:02:56 PM »

Ok..im sick and tired ohf having bomers Blow up in a sigle pass....way too manyt imes this happens...

1 ftr should not be able to Kill 2 b-17s in a sigle pass..

I hate this..and it is a real disapointment...

As a ftr i see it too..and i think its complety wrong..

You guys at HTC do a very good job..so i dont understand why the bomers are getting sucjh a crappy damage model.....

It doesnt happen everytime...but its way too often....

1 pass and you lose 2 B-17's to a mustang?????

That is not right...

Disapointed pilot who flys all planes....

BiGB

Shiva · « **Reply #1 on:** September 11, 2002, 11:49:49 PM »

Quote

1 ftr should not be able to Kill 2 b-17s in a sigle pass..

The problem would appear to be at least partially due to netlag, which I'm sure you've experienced after getting shot down and listening to anywhere from five to ten seconds of rapid-fire hit sounds while you're in the tower.

Basically, it works like this: J. Random Buffbuster sails up and unloads a ton of fire into the lead bomber, which rolls over and goes down missing the left wing. The pilot bails, being autojumped into one of the other two bombers. All of the netlagged hits that were recorded by the shooter's FE as being assessed against the buff driver's plane -- the lead bomber -- get assessed by the buff driver's FE against his plane, which is now the second bomber.

This could be resolved by changing the hit data packets that the FEs exchange to include a plane number -- for people flying fighters or not in formation, the plane number would always be '1', but for buffs in formation, it could be '1', '2', or '3'. By identifying which plane in a formation is taking the damage, it would allow a player's FE to ignore shots hitting a bomber after the player has bailed from it into another bomber. eliminating automatic damage spillover when the pilot bails.

NOD2000 · « **Reply #2 on:** September 12, 2002, 02:28:31 PM »

shiva i have to dissagree i am a very experianced 26 pilot and got shot down by a p-40b in one pass and that was in a H2H game with no lag what so ever and 4x .303 cal and 1x .50 cal (he only had one working) and he takes me out with me pounding him that is really sad just really sad

Innominate · « **Reply #3 on:** September 12, 2002, 03:11:08 PM »

I'm pretty sure shiva is right,
the only time buffs go down in multiples is when a TON of damage gets put into a single buff at once.

Flying the 190A-8, it's not uncommon to bag all three in a formation in one pass.

A single buff being killed in one pass is acceptable, a good stream of hits will do it, and would do it even in 1.09. Against a well flown plane, any buff is a fairly easy kill. But it is nearly impossible to kill two buffs in a pass, without ramming one, or getting a bug on your side.

BGBMAW · « **Reply #4 on:** September 12, 2002, 03:21:43 PM »

well...

I was kiiled in 1 pass....2 of my 17' s EXPLODE!!!

My buff didnt even have a chance to spiral down..they exploded from a MUSATANG..with no cannons....in one pass from 6 Klok....

Yes this is wrong.. I can understand 1 buff dying in a pass ..but defnlty not 2 ...especially form a p-51...

FW 190 a8 STURMJAGER..well its got huge Cannons..so ..i can say yes its DEADLY against buffs...

Love BiGB
xoxoxo

moot · « **Reply #5 on:** September 12, 2002, 03:30:20 PM »

If you have it filmed, check to see where the damage is; even though i've some movies of passes on buffs that show the damage at the wrong places, maybe he had everything in one spot. Blowing up fuel tanks or the right angle on even a near-6oc isn't impossible to kill the pilot.

Heinkel · « **Reply #6 on:** September 12, 2002, 03:34:29 PM »

Another problem with buffs is:

you are xxk (lets say 20k) in a b17 on auto piolt, a plane bounces by suprise, and takes off your vert. slab. You can still fly fine. As soon as you make a small move, your planes starts to spin

IRL, b17s could not fly perfectly level, and when they lost a vert slab, they were done for. In AH they can keep going. The funny part is...it's this time when they usually shoot you down.

MrLars · « **Reply #7 on:** September 12, 2002, 03:54:17 PM »

There IS something screwy with the damage model.

I have films of me killing the lead buff in my F6F-5 by sawing off one of the wings not hitting the drones at all but seeing the drone take the exact same damage less than a second later...funny but it always seems to be the drone on the port side of the piloted plane that takes the damage when not hit.

Could be as stated that the hits carry over to the drones but if that's the case it should be fixed.

BTW, I don't fly buffs so I have no motive other than seeing something that should be fixed...no rush on my account though, I'll gladly take any extra kills that I don't have to work for

Mickey1992 · « **Reply #8 on:** September 12, 2002, 04:23:03 PM »

Shiva,

The reason you hear pings even after the attacker has passed or after you are dead and in the tower is because of a change made by HT about a year ago.

People used to complain (even more than they do now) about one ping kills. Most of these weren't really one ROUND kills, but people only heard one PING. So HT changed the FE so that you heard pings from rounds that hit you even after the attacker passed or you were killed and sent to the tower. The "ping" sound is too long simulate every round hit.
------
However I do agree that something is screwed up with the bomber damage getting inherited to other bombers. I once had a 262 kill all 3 of my bombers in one pass at very high speed.

I posted in the bug forum about how the gun ammo count was getting transferred from one bomber to the other. So it seems feasible that there is a bug that transfers damage too.

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=63736

BenDover · « **Reply #9 on:** September 12, 2002, 05:16:33 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Heinkel
Another problem with buffs is:

you are xxk (lets say 20k) in a b17 on auto piolt, a plane bounces by suprise, and takes off your vert. slab. You can still fly fine. As soon as you make a small move, your planes starts to spin

IRL, b17s could not fly perfectly level, and when they lost a vert slab, they were done for. In AH they can keep going. The funny part is...it's this time when they usually shoot you down.

In real life, how hard was it to COMPLETLY blow off the vert. stab of a b17s arse?

I think that for 1.12 we should get an improved damage model

BGBMAW · « **Reply #10 on:** September 12, 2002, 05:51:48 PM »

here..here ...yes damage model needs new working.....

bozon · « **Reply #11 on:** September 13, 2002, 03:21:38 AM »

IMO, bombers should be very hard to brake - like taking off a wing or the entire tail section.
from what I've seen on gun footage and read in books, the bomber took damage to controll surfaces, engines, pilots/gunners, hydraulic systems and so on... but stayed in one piece more or less, going down as a disfunctional piece of metal still in the shape of a bomber.

Bozon

Blue Mako · « **Reply #12 on:** September 13, 2002, 04:14:37 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Shiva
This could be resolved by changing the hit data packets that the FEs exchange to include a plane number -- for people flying fighters or not in formation, the plane number would always be '1', but for buffs in formation, it could be '1', '2', or '3'. By identifying which plane in a formation is taking the damage, it would allow a player's FE to ignore shots hitting a bomber after the player has bailed from it into another bomber. eliminating automatic damage spillover when the pilot bails.

Simple. Brilliant but simple. Someone tell HTC to try this...