Author Topic: After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))  (Read 584 times)

Jagdflieger

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After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))
« on: January 01, 2002, 11:41:00 PM »
Well it's been about 30 days in the MA.  Time enough to form some opinions.

Fresh in from that "other" failed flight sim.

A lot to like in this Aces High.  Technically superior to Air Warrior in nearly every aspect.  Also interesting to fly with personalities that were in other countrys in AW.

Really like the multiple load outs and drop tanks etc for the aircraft.

The adjustable views are most excellent as well.

Can really notice the different trajectory etc between the different weapons.. specifically the poor performance of the German cannon compared to Allied MGs or Cannons.

Damage model is a gas!  Love aiming for a certain wing and watching THAT wing fall off.

Clouds are kewl!

Like the website based statistical break down.  (Was interesting to note some of the high K/D flyers do most of their hops as attack and build their outrageous K/D numbers with a very limited number of real fighter sorties.  Something like... 8 or 9 fighter hops for a 32/1 K/D as a fighter and over 300 hops as an attack.  It's a method?)

Things I would like to see.....

Doesn't play like an ACES High.  Plays more like Rammers High and Land Grabbers low.  
Not sure how you address the HO ramming issue.  I know folks say avoid them, but there are times in a close fight you are low E, and are gaining the angle and the puppy on the downside just HOs you.  Since E is low.. there is no where to go. Frustrating.

Bases are too easy to capture. There is no consequence to mass suicide attacks that are virtually impossible to stop.  Load up a bunch of mossies or 26s and some goonies and just flood the place, regardless of how many are knocked down.  Seems to deemphasize ACES HIGH.. more like Land Grabber Low.

Perhaps make bases much tougher to kill?  

What about putting a factor in the reset... that if plane loss exceeds a given percentage of sorties flown... that there are no perk points awarded for the reset?

Or award a reset based on a statistical number plus number of bases.  I.E. one side must be down to one base and the other two sides must attain a certain point level.  Airplanes killed etc add points, Planes lost or CVs lost detract points.

Night lighting seems to be off.  The moon is in my face but my dash board is so bright I cant stand it.  Turn the plane around and the dash get's darker but the light source is behind me.   Why does my knee board be come dark and almost unreadable at night?  With that bright dash it should be able to be seen JUST fine.

Read somewhere that the fuel consumption is accelerated by a factor.  If that is the case is the fuel weight reduced by a given factor?  Since we are artificially carrying more fuel than we need, we climb slower etc?

Are we seeing radar controlled ack off the CVs?  Seems like the CV doesn't target a plane until you are at X distance, but then will stay on you for a much longer distance.  Clouds do not seem to deter the gunners.  

Finally... more early model planes?  How bout making the plane set phase in over the camp?  Early planes for the first so many days then phase different models in as they historically arrived during the war.  The Ta152s and 262s etc arriving near the very end of the camp.  Would keep the plane set a little closer in performance level, and make it interesting.

Again.. one dweeb's opinion... your mileage may vary.

Offline Kieran

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After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2002, 09:31:00 AM »
I was there with you last night during the Mossie raid (callsign dolomyte). Yup, not much you can do once you have 20 high Mossies followed by multiple C-47's against a rear, undefended base. By the time you launch defense it's over. But, that's the way it goes. We had the Bishops hammering us in the north, the Knights in the south. Turning to face one attack meant neglecting the other. It's what we refer to "being in the bucket".

Let me tell you what doesn't help during those times; guys going off on country channel telling everyone what a lousy job we are doing, and how much better the other side is. This is why I told you to switch sides if you admired them so much. I'd spent the better part of my time online chasing bombers to keep our fields alive, and I certainly didn't need to hear the amount of squeaking I was (not from you necessarily). Once that wail reaches a certain point I log. I want to fly with guys that take it in stride, and since I cannot squelch country channel I can only tolerate the noise so long.

I am neither for or against your other suggestions, as the points don't matter to me. They may be good ideas, but more of the strat guys will have to weigh in there.

Rammers high? I guess it depends on your perspective. Sure, you get near the pointy end of the stick you're going to bleed, and there are guys that will go for the HO every time. Still it seems to me that most of my kills are deflections, usually someone crossing my path at a 90 degree angle (which they think is safe), or catching someone scissoring in front of me. I can't think of any HO's I have been in since I've been back that I didn't allow to happen.

Not sure what you mean by fuel weight, but the fuel burn is higher here, and that means your weight reflects the amount of fuel you have remaining, hence the weight of the aircraft lowers in accordance with the fuel burn, nothing more.

I've noticed CV ack does as you describe, but consider it will also zero in on the closest object. This is why it helps to bring multiple planes in from multiple directions and altitudes. One can draw fire while the other gets closer.

I'm all for more planes anytime.

[ 01-02-2002: Message edited by: Kieran ]

Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2002, 09:47:00 AM »
Yesterday, we did our Holiday D-Day mission, which we primarily save for special occasions such as Veterans day, June 6th, July 4th, and New Years day...that being mass Goons and mossies...its done once in a blue moon, and done for fun.  The reason we did not put fighters in the 3 missions we ran is because we didn't want to hear the endless whining on the BBS the next day...so, we went 'Naked', with the mossies hitting the city, no escort, and low flying goons giving you guys plenty to shoot down!

<S> all that joined up, I ran it 3 times, though I only wanted to run it twice, but peer pressure had me posting it again, and of course the 3rd time it failed miserably!  ;)

Offline Seeker

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« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2002, 09:48:00 AM »
"Doesn't play like an ACES High. Plays more like Rammers High and Land Grabbers low."

I hate to say it, but the rams are probably 90% your fault. AW taught us a head on merge (no HO's), and to fly through the bogey guns blazing (no collisions). You have to learn new angles and new safety margins here. I know when I made the move to AH I died countless times coming over the top of an immelman merge only to ram the guy I was roping. It takes time to adjust.

"Bases are too easy to capture."

I wouldn't know, don't do much capture stuff. But the Strat guys scream that all their hard work can be undone in seconds by one resupply goon. Sometimes, fighters aren't the best thing to scramble....

"Read somewhere that the fuel consumption is accelerated by a factor. If that is the case is the fuel weight reduced by a given factor? Since we are artificially carrying more fuel than we need, we climb slower etc?"

Fuel burn is an arena setting. It's set at a high rate in the MA to mitigate the Spit with 25% fuel phenomena we had in AW (and, bellybutton far as I know, WB). I'd be leery of messing with it's weight as fuel is used to satabilze C of G. Take 50% and DT's, same as the rest of us.

"Are we seeing radar controlled ack off the CVs?"

In short, yes. It'll stop firing at you under 3K. Plus, there's the player controled ship guns, which can load AA shells and hit out to (I believe) 15K. In other words, flying in a C.V.'s airspace is bloody dangerous, which seems about right to me.

As for the rolling plane set idea, forget it. No I mean it, forget all about that kind of thing in the MA, it's not going to happen, now or at any time. That's why we have perkies in the MA.

Where it may well take shape is the combat theatre, one of the other arenas. Hblair (and others) is doing a fine job of making the CT more responsive to specialist wants and needs such as limited plane sets, more flexibility with radar settings etc.. Take a look in there, it's a different style of AH.

And....welcome  :)

Offline Kieran

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« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2002, 11:01:00 AM »
"Naked"? You gotta be kidding! I love being "naked" in a Mossie!  :D

FWIW, run any mission you like. I was merely trying to point out there wasn't much we could do under the circumstances. We actually had three or four massive raids with which to contend at that point (two Knights, two Bishops) and were bound to get hurt. You guys were already airborne and high before we launched the first fighter. There was no chance we could stave off the attack once you dropped the hangars, as it was an isolated rear field. It was a guaranteed win for your side.

I teetered on the brink of heading there (I had just left the field north of 57), but decided we had a force headed to 53 already. My experience tells me it is better to complete an offensive operation during these times, rather than going totally defensive, so I continued to 53. Half our guys decided to leave the attack and head to 57, one B-17 I escorted was too timid to brave the 88, so we wound up with perhaps 3 fighters against a dozen or so swarming enemies.

We got a few, and I was helping one fellow with a Spit, but he let himself be drawn into the pack. I warned him to pull out and run, but he was locked on a Spit that was dragging him into an enemy pack. I did not follow. I had warned him to break several times and he went on in. I was in an A5 and saw nothing down there but La7's, Nikki's, and Spits. I didn't feel like giving up an easy kill at that particular moment.  ;)

I landed and logged after that, as I was tired of reading the "You guys are doing it all wrong" stuff.

Offline Furious

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« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2002, 11:30:00 AM »
The funny part is the all the teams are the same.

They all have the same shortcomings; whiners, tards, and wanna-be generals.  

They, also, all have some really great guys that are very much fun to fly and die with.


...well, maybe not the bish.


F.

Offline ghostdancer

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« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2002, 12:31:00 PM »
Nice job Ripsnort. We couldn't stop the first two attacks .. simply did not get enough defenders in place but it was a blast trying.

For the third attack we switched elements of a couple Rook squads to 57 in time to intercept you guys far enough away from the city at 57 to stop you.

It was a blast and really got all of our blood pounding trying to hold both 55 and 57 against the Knight onslaught while others held the Northern front versus the Bishops.
 
Look forward to butting heads with you again.

<S>

[ 01-02-2002: Message edited by: GhstDncr ]
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Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2002, 12:46:00 PM »
Hehe Ghost, I told the guys "hey, this only works once every 6 months, and usually can get away with it 1 or 2 times..."

Its a fun run, everyone expects to die, no one expects to capture...there's just something about 200 para's in the air that is fun!  The old record was 27 goons, but that was in the "Field Capture" days before you had to down a city to capture, nowadays as you know city must be down...so we upped 17 goons and 11 mossies.

Incidently, the fun factor for me was when Bishrook(don't remember which) launced 8 goons, and I happened to cross their path NOE in a tiffy..shot 7 of 8 down before running out of ammo(I know, shame...) but man, that was a hoot!  :)

Offline ghostdancer

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« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2002, 12:52:00 PM »
Must have been either Bishops or if it was Rooks must have been during the assaults on A60 and A61. Deman and the 81st were running the show down there while Nightmares were coordinating assault on A9 and then A12 area.

It was a blast and we ran out of ammo the first two times trying to get through the Mossies and then at the C47s and then the sky was full of paratroops. Kept shooting them and scrafing but I amd Fdutchmn and others literally ran out of ammo.

Was a hoot.
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Offline Kieran

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« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2002, 02:50:00 PM »
The only question I do raise about this tactic is what impact does 200 paratroops have on framerate, and what impact does the 32-player limit have on visibility of troops?

Offline LePaul

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« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2002, 03:17:00 PM »
I was expecting something worse than what the original poster wrote.  But, some good points in there.  Especially the clipboard map being nearly unreadable at night (or under overcast).  Why the map of all things becomes unreadable/dark escapes my logic.

And as someone mentioned, the re-supply goons carry more rebuild/supplies/rations than a fleet of C-5 Galaxies.  One *magic* goon completely reverses what a Squadron of Lancaster blow up.  Its sad, and a lot of the buff drivers are burnt out and just miffed that the game has come to that.

Welcome aboard.

Offline eskimo2

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After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2002, 03:20:00 PM »
Jagdflieger;

<S>, good post.
Good way to voice you opinions.

eskimo

Offline ghostdancer

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« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2002, 03:25:00 PM »
Kieran,

Not sure about 200 paratroopers but I do know that when they drop around 40 (4 goon loads) with the paratroops, Knight Aircraft and defending Rooks I did take a frame rate hit. Not too bad but did have stutters.
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Offline pbirmingham

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After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2002, 04:14:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by LePaul:

And as someone mentioned, the re-supply goons carry more rebuild/supplies/rations than a fleet of C-5 Galaxies.  One *magic* goon completely reverses what a Squadron of Lancaster blow up.  Its sad, and a lot of the buff drivers are burnt out and just miffed that the game has come to that.



Yeah, but these magic goons also carry enough troops to take a town and airfield.  Shall we address that inaccuracy as well?

Jagdflieger

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After 30 Days.... A dweeb's opinion ((long))
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2002, 08:38:00 PM »
Hey... good conversation going on.

Let's see ....

Kieran said:

We had the Bishops hammering us in the north, the Knights in the south. Turning to face one attack meant neglecting the other. It's what we refer to "being in the bucket".
===========================================
Didn't know it was called in the bucket but a 2 country gang on one is as old as these online flight sims.  Been through many of them.

Kieran also said:

Let me tell you what doesn't help during those times; guys going off on country channel telling everyone what a lousy job we are doing, and how much better the other side is. This is why I told you to switch sides if you admired them so much.
============================================
My appreciation of the organization of the raid did not mean I necessarily wished to be on their side.  There was some frustration because we had better than 60% of our country resources fighting 40% of the threat and they refused to shift south.  It is a fine balance trying to stem a flow, but it generally takes fewer to defend.  Of course, that also accepts that the defenders are willing to fly unrealistically and sacrifice themselves for a field in the same manner of the attackers.  Something that, frankly, I loathe.  I did not mean to offend you with my comments.  Apologies.

Additionally:

Rammers high? I guess it depends on your perspective. Sure, you get near the pointy end of the stick you're going to bleed, and there are guys that will go for the HO every time. Still it seems to me that most of my kills are deflections, usually someone crossing my path at a 90 degree angle (which they think is safe), or catching someone scissoring in front of me.
============================================
As Seeker mentioned some of my difficulty is learning to avoid the HO. However in quite a few fights, I'm working a Typhoon, or D9, or Hog against a Spit or a Niki (which can easily outmanuever me) and they will just turn into me and start shooting HO.  Avoiding the HO at that point and just leaving the fight is a viable option.  I am still trying to learn the planes tho, so often decide to try and push the edge.  Very frustrating to work a superior aircraft into the corner and all they do is HO or RAM. (shrug)

Even fought a 38 last night with a Cat.. and bled him E-DRY.. and as I'm bringing guns on he just SAGS back into me as he falls... collision.. I am dead he keeps flying.  ( I assume the collision code faults the guy that came in from behind? )

My point on fuel rate.....

If 25% fuel lasted as long as it would/should? and fuel rate is factored in correctly, then would I not climb to altitude in a shorter period of time than currently because I do not have to start with a much higher fuel load to ensure I have enough fuel?  

Or put another way.. in real life.. a 109 sortie from the coast of France would not find the 109 locked into combat with a nearly full fuel tank. However we are actually at a higher fuel weight in most cases because we don't have as long a time at our optimal fighting weight... and carry more fuel.  Not a big issue just something I had heard in passing about fuel useage and wondered why we had accelerated burn and the reason behind it.

Kieran said:

The only question I do raise about this tactic is what impact does 200 paratroops have on framerate, and what impact does the 32-player limit have on visibility of troops?
============================================
In my case it shattered my frame rate. Didn't even know we had a 32 player limit on visibility.


In respect to any type of raid where people just fling themselves at a target.  Understand this is a game, however, most games, pick a sport, there is a cost to just haphazardly wasting a resource.  You have bad field position, have to punt, strike out, etc.  In this game there is nothing close.  Just keep running lemming like in one direction.

AW often had scenarios and failed to model this.  If I may....

Battle of Britain scenario.  Germans try to get bombers thru to selected targets.  Points are awarded each side for kills of NME A/C vs LOSS.  Points are awarded for bomb damage for the Germans.  What is not modeled, and IMHO is critical is the attrition.  What NEARLY broke the Brits was the attrition of pilots.  To model this in a scenario it should be something like, you have 100 pilots and 300 available airframes. (numbers are just for example)
40 people actually sign up to fly for one side.  They can fly however they like... but if the scenario lasts six frames, and 1/2 of the people get shot down in the first 5 frames, they have no pilots left for the sixth and final frame.  If the opposite side is better at conserving a resource while accomplishing mission objectives, suddenly they run amok and win hands down.

I do not know how one would even come close to approaching this in the arena, other than to adjust perk points at a reset.  ( I don't even fly perk planes) Let perk points be divided up between the countries based on other factors such as victories vs losses etc and not entirely on bases controlled.  Then if a given country "wins" a reset but burned up so many airframes to accomplish it, it would get no perk points only a new map.  If the other countrys were more judicious in their resource consumption, they would actually see some points.  Again, just a discussion point.

Thanks for the info on the CV.  I have had a factory ack shoot me down when I was on the deck, going away, at high speed and extreme range, and had just dropped below field elevation behind a hill.  I cannot imagine ack gunners being so proficient that they could lob a shot below their elevation and hit a plane flying down a valley.  But it happened. <G>

Finally (if you read this far)  I don't want to come off as negative.  My observation of the night lighting I believe is just plain dead on, it is wrong.  The rest is trying to find the gamesmanship of the program so that I understand what reality is in AH compared to my perception of it in the real world.  Once I have the AH reality down I will have fewer questions.

Salute,

[ 01-02-2002: Message edited by: Jagdflieger ]