Flight Stick Problems Help me make Dad happy

[jalurp]

No longer as mobile as he once was, one of the few joys my father has left is flying online. Somehow, his throttle stick no longer works, using CH F-16 Joystick, CH Pro Throttle and CH Pro Pedals.

I am in from out of town, and not real familiar with gaming, but my brother emailed me a template for speed keys, and I also tried uninstalling and reinstalling Aces High. The setup appears correct, flight stick to throttle, rudder pedals to game port, and throttle connected to extension from gameport off rudder pedals, which is labeled to joystick. Also, keyboard is correctly plugged in to adapter off throttle hookup. As best as I can tell, this is correct from the help files, but he does not have the CH Prods manuals. Also, he says it was working fine and just stopped, and that he has not disconnected or reconnected the original setup.

The Wepons buttons, hat, etc on the throttle work, but no engine response to the slide control or keyboard on throttle setting. When on the runway, the engine cuts down to an idle and does not respond either from the keyboard or throttle.

Was hoping someone could offer some advice, or that someone living in the Cleveland area could possibly take a look at it.

I also thought of checking his game card calibration, but again, he does not have the manual.

As stated, my knowledge of gaming is limited, pretty much to what you see typed here, and I know nothing about keyboard mapping. However, Father has literally no PC knowledge. He really needs the help of someone who knows, puters, peripherials, especially CH Prods, and has Aces High knowledge. Finding a tech in the area has been unsuccessful.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
mjg

[spiffykraits]

I assume he's using Win98SE or Win98, so go to Control panel and the Game Controller applet and check that the joystick is working there. I expect it isn't.

You can try this:

Remove the joystick driver from the Game Controller list in Control panel.

Unplug all the connectors for his stick, throttles and pedals with the PC off, and plug them back in this order. Pedals to gameport, Throttle to pedals and keyboard adaptor, then joystick to Throttle.
Make sure all connections are tight and the retaining screws are done up good. You may plug and unplug the connectors for each a couple times to make sure that they are making good contact.

On rebooting hold down all at once ALL three gray buttons on the rear of the throttle, which should reset and clear the throttle as it boots. When the PC beeps and complains let go the buttons.

Re-instal the stick driver (remembering to select the rudder box) in Control panel, and check to see if it is now recognized.

If it is calibrate there as normal.  Now use Speedkeys to reprogram the throttle, making sure the "right" joystick selection is made in Speedkeys in the drop down box in the Speed keys screen.

Sometimes this happens, usually due either to a bad connection on the connectors, or the wrong joystick has been selected in Speedkeys. Resetting the throttle at boot should clear it. For some reason connecting up the pedals throttle and joystick in the wrong order can also affect if it is not recognized.

If none of the above work, go back to control panel, system, devices, remove the gameport from the devices list, and let windows re-install it on a reboot. Make sure the gameport is set to 0200 as the first figure in the resources panel under properties.

Hope this helps!

[jalurp]

Thanks for the reply.

Sorry, forgot to mention, he is running Windows ME, and I did try the joystick in the control panel applet, which surprisingly works, and allows to calibrate. I also did a hard reset.

CH tech support wants us to send the thing in for eval, which, I won't be here that long to get it out and back. They said, occasionally the internals of the slider throttle may have had some wire or circuit disconnect. (For what it's worth). I also requested if I could try another template to test, and they reccommended Descent 2. The throttle does not respond from Aces High with that template.

I'll try the other stuff and advise.

Regards,
mjg

[spiffykraits]

ME is similiar to 98 as far as the game controller setup goes.

If the joystick works in the Windows Control panel game conroller applet then it should work for AH, it doesnt sound as though there is any hardware fault in this respect, so its likely software.

Check these:

Make sure that the correct stick is selected in Speedkeys, if Speedkeys doesn't detect it there is something wrong in Windows.  However, if it works in Windows calibration Speedkeys should see it.  

Check that the right choice of model stick is made in Speedkeys under the joystick button. If that is correct, also check that incremental steps are set for the throttle under the throttle tab in speedkeys.

Note that there are two types of CH F16 stick One is the CH F16 Combat stick only programmable by the throttle, the other the CH F16 Fighter stick (which is independently programmable). Select the correct one you have.

Finally open the AH folder, find the settings folder, backup and then delete the file stick.cfg.

Re-run AH to see if it is now recognises the stick and throttle.

If ALL functions work in the Windows game controller screens, including the throttle function and it will calibrate it should work in AH at least in default mode.

You should be able to clear and reset the throttle for reprogramming by pressing the three grey button on the rear of the throttle simultaneously when booting. Selecting a different joystick in Speedkeys will also reset all programmed macros to default again.  You must select the correct stick type for programming to function correctly of course.

[jalurp]

Thanks Spiffy:

I tried all you said, except the last. However upon rebooting I cannot get the joystick to respond in windows calibration.

My brother was telling me he is unable to use F-16 combat stick in his config, but uses 3 axis 2 (or 4) button joystick, but was not in front of his puter and did not recall which.

I used to use Saitek and had problems adding my setup and had to go to an * axis * button joystick to get it to work, but that was so long ago and in Win 95.

Anyway, CH is telling him he needs to go out and get USB, and said even using  a game card will only have a 50/50 chance of working, and at that, no guarantees for how long. They say Win ME is the worst platform to use with their products and that and his Dell Dimension 4100 is a generation ahead and there are speed incompatibility issues, which is why there is a problem.

Anyway, I downloaded the CH drivers and will try that. If I can't get it to register in Windows calibration, all is pretty much a mute point unless I know which joystick to select. He was using F-16 Combat stick (win98), when it was working, but now, as stated not responding. The joystick driver is still the same, after removing the gameport controller and letting windows reinstall it- vjoyd.vxd in the windows\system folder.

[jalurp]

Ok: basically, I have done all you have suggested. at this point, I found some of his CH Prod disks and installed the drivers. Now windows Cont Pan applet recognizes the stick in test, as follows: joystick movemements, rudder pedal movement, and throttle movement, but no buttons whatsoever. Also, it will not it will not allow me to calibrate under the F-16 Combat stick or the few others I tried.

This was after I removed the stick.cfg file from the Aces High\ Settings directory

Going to the game with this file removed, we now have joystick, throttle, and pedal movement, (and can get off the ground and fly around offline) but cannot use buttons, which is consistent with windows control panel functions.

What I am wondering, is what joystick I should be selecting in windows for calibration, and then again in the aces high game? Or that perhaps the speedkeys program is corrupt, i.e. removing the stick.cfg solved some of the problem, or a combination of both, Speedkeys corruption and correct joystick selection in Windows and Speedkeys. (I referred to this in my last post, and our posts may have crossed).

Also, going into the game and to setup/joystick, the joystick input column is showing numbers that are fluctuating in value, kind of fluttering. (i.e. the last three or all three digits flutter as to all other values being consistent) in each of the columns, specifically, the Xaxis range flutters from 32, 407 - 32,587;  the Y axis from 32,382 - 32,687;  the Z axis from 0 to 151 and the RZ axis from 33,096 - 33,260. All other numerical values are consistant. My father advises this is not normal. Also, unable to calibrate in game settings.

Please advise next step if you are not yet frustrated with us.

[spiffykraits]

Ok now we are getting somewhere.  If the stick you have is marked  F-16 COMBAT Stick select that in Windows, if that doesn't work use the default windows 4 button 3 axis driver.  Either "should" work. The latter should give you some buttons that work namely the red ones on the joystick.,however all other buttons and hats on the stick are programmable through the Prothrottle and speedkeys via macros, even if you dont see them in the Windows applet.

Make sure if you have more than one game controller the CH stick is first in the list under Controller ids in Control Panel, game controllers.(he may have a gamepad?) While in there also un-check the box marked "poll with interupts enabled" or else this will give spiking or fluttering on the controller.

When calibrating just press 4 times on enter when setting the POV hat views in windows, no need to move the POV hat when calibrating.

You must always set the F16 Combat stick in the Speedkeys list whether you are using the default 4 button 3 axis driver or F16 Combat driver in Windows controllers. Program the stick and throttle functions with Speedkeys, via macros. The pro-throttle should see all the buttons and hats.

Lastly you might like to check this:

If you know how to set up a shortcut for running a program in Dos mode, you should find under the CH software a dos facilty called Jcentre.exe. Set a shortcut to it that will run it in dos mode. You can then check that the gameport and stick are calibrated correctly directly from the gameport, irespective of the Windows calibration directly under DOS. Its best to do this before calibrating in Windows. If it doesn't work at this level then there is a hardware mismatch.  

I agree with CH, ME does not handle joystick calls as well as Win98SE for older CH gear.

[jalurp]

Before trying any of the above, let me advise where we are at, though I don't know why.

When we had joystick and throttle but no weps or buttons, we had tried the game offline. My Dad tried it online, for the heck of it, and lo and behold, all functions are normal but one joystick button, the red button on the joystick itself, located on the top left corner above and next to the two hat buttons.

I am unsure whether to leave well enough alone and simply try to program that button or not. I do not know how to use the speedkeys program and do not want to mess anything up, and niether does Dad.

However, I do not see how the thing even works. It still cannot be calibrated in windows or the game. I HAD also tried jcenter.exe prior to the game finally working, but it too did not register. Yet it works.

Do I leave well enough alone ('if it ain't [completely] broke..."...?

I almost do not want to try jcenter again or try the 4 button, 3 axis joystick and risk nothing working again?

[spiffykraits]

Until you get someone who knows to sort it, leave well alone but it would do no harm to try out the Speedkeys.  Just save the current profile as another name and try a new profile to see how it works.