Author Topic: Level bombing question... (Read 700 times)

Max · « **on:** February 13, 2003, 10:21:29 AM »

I've read two tutorials on level bombing and the new calibrations needed. Yet I must be doing something wrong as my bombs are falling way long. Here's my checklist:

1. Line up approach to target at least a sector out.
2. Steady speed and open bay doors...usually around 15 miles out.
3. Select F6 and hit U for calibration mode.
4. Push stick to take x-hairs forward...usually 1/2 way to the horizon.
5. Zoom and hold a spot with Y key depressed for 5-10 seconds.
6. Release Y key and relieve pressure on stick.
7. Bring up clipboard and place cursor on target, click target for alt.
8. Hit U key to exit calibration mode.

At which point my x-hairs pass on target and bombs are released, my plane is over the target as well. I can see the eggs dropping...knowing they're gonna fall long

What am I doing wrong here?

Thanks
DmdMax

mia389 · « **Reply #1 on:** February 13, 2003, 10:42:21 AM »

Hmmmm sounds like your doing everything right. Might wanna make sure your drop alt and alt are the same if they are you can practice offline to figure out what your doing wrong try this link. I found by practicing off line at diff. alts I need not to zoom in as far when calibrating.

http://members.cox.net/srmalloy/AH/Bombing.html

That shows you how you can calibrate off line and shows where bombs are gonna fall.

SKurj · « **Reply #2 on:** February 13, 2003, 11:37:49 AM »

CLick on target for alt first... not sure if this will make a difference or not, but I always do this before calibrating.

The transition from climbing to steady speed, can take awhile..

15 miles may not be enough. It sounds like at the time of drop you are going faster than when you calibrated. Reduce throttle, I try and bomb from around 200mph, and I try to have a whole sector to get speed steady

SKurj

Soda · « **Reply #3 on:** February 13, 2003, 12:10:33 PM »

A couple of hints.

1) Ensure you are at constant speed. Top speed is not necessarily the best, but you need to be constant, so give yourself lots of time to settle to a speed.

2) Start your tracking of the target spot (whatever you target) before pressing and holding the calibration key. I've noticed some people who press it and start to calibrate at the same time, making for error as they settle onto the tracked point.

3) Calibrate for a MINIMUM of 10 seconds, the longer the better, with about a slow 20 count usually good to give pin-point accuracy.

4) You can select your target alt well away from the target, like about 30 seconds after you take off or while levelled and gaining speed. I usually do this early because once it's set it's unlikely the target alt will change while all other dynamic issues around your calibration will be adjusted properly when you calibrate the point later.

I don't think the order of marking the target altitude is important as I've done it first or second. Also, you can calibrate with your doors closed BUT you must open them just before you drop. The doors cause about 10mph of drag which sets in rather slowly, so leave them closed, calibrate with them closed, then JUST before you drop (like a second or so before), open them, drop , and close them. Speed difference will be minimal that way and you don't have to leave them open.

Finally, go offline, find a mid-alt field to launch from, then turn on the jabo bomsight in the settings. Once you do that, you can practice calibrating over and over again and see how well you do on each. Basically, the jabo bombsight (constantly computed impact point) displays as a green + and marks the point where your bombs would land. Calibrate your bombsight, then compare the + from the bombsight with the green + of the jabo sight (which display on each other in the bombsight) and you can see how well you calibrated. No need to drop bombs... and you can calibrate over and over and over until you get practiced.

-Soda
AH Training Corps.
The Assassins.

Soulyss · « **Reply #4 on:** February 13, 2003, 12:31:05 PM »

The trick is to look at the altitude that you calibrated at, or "drop alt" and your current alt. These numbers have to be the same. If your current alt is increasing it means your plane is accelerating still and you have to come back on the throttle and visa versa, if it's decreasing it means your too slow. These numbers have to be the exact same if you want to hit anything, or else adjust your aim long or short to compensate for it.

medicboy · « **Reply #5 on:** February 13, 2003, 01:29:32 PM »

The only things I would change is set target alt first. Once you let go of the joystick and calibrate button you have about 2-4 sec to press "u" before it resets to the defalt view. Which is looking straight down, hence seeing your bombs and hitting long.
The other thing I would change is make sure you are level and your speed is steady further out from target. Use your clipboard map to line up the best you can at least 1 sector out. Then when you approach use your joystick in the f6 bombsight screen to fine tune. This uses only the rudder and does not change your alt (ie. a flat turn)

The text in the upper left corner of the screen will turn yellow in the calibration mode and after calibration and hitting the "u" button in time should be green, i'm willing to bet it is still red when you hit long.

hogenbor · « **Reply #6 on:** February 14, 2003, 01:22:19 AM »

Soda, that's a neat trick! This way I could have learned level bombing a lot quicker.

I don't usually do level bombing because I think it is boring... ever tried to get a Lanc to 15.000 feet with 14k bombs? I shudder at the thought to use Lancs in the Trinity map with it's occasional Himalaya mountains in the way... and there's the problem of shaking off the drones too! But at least I have a reasonable accuracy (sank a CV once from 10.000 feet with B17's).

Some questions remain though, if you do everything perfect, how accurate can you possibly get? I tried to hit a VH from about 8k with a Kate, did the best I could, but missed less than the width of the VH itself (to the left, not long or short).

And how will correcting your heading (slightly) from the bombsight after you calibrated affect accuracy? I try to line up with the help of the clipboard, use calibration mode to look at my target to correct heading, start the bombrun, calibrate, switch to normal bombsight and drop at the appropriate moment. Nevertheless, when I see the crosshairs move over my target, I regularly see that my heading is just a bit off and for correcting this it's usually too late. Setting up a good run takes ages, so again one of the reasons I don't level bomb that much.

bounder · « **Reply #7 on:** February 14, 2003, 07:37:35 AM »

Also, if you are bombing above the wind layer, you need to adjust your course so that the drift takes your a/c ver the tgt. If you justpoint your ac at the target and calibrate, you will need to adjust course continually to stay on target, making your drop completely off.

Some helpful chap posted a ready reckoner that I have since lost, for calculating course deviation correction.

If you bomb straight into or out of the wind, deviation is not a problem. I use the nose gunner in full zoom and steer with my rudder controls to get an exact line on the target before going onto calibration.

Blank · « **Reply #8 on:** February 14, 2003, 09:24:48 AM »

is all fine, but I still find (for carpet bombing cities or towns) that the least amount of time between calibration and drop is best, not setting up 200 miles away.

I normally calibrate as said then while looking down sight wait tell i can see target and make sure I am all lined up (hopefully will not need to change course)

so I'm happy I'm going to fly over the correct bit of target, I can see town/city etc in the bombsite, and I quickly calibrate again (you still have enough time for at least a 10 count on the Y button) then once finished you'll probably have like maybe 5 secs before drop.

Like this there is very little time for errors to creep in, wind to blow you off course etc.

And remember the wind on the Trinity map goes S to N at 16k all the others are E to W (or other way round) at 14k

And if your worried about your bombing stats remember that you get a higher hit % if you take out lots of buildings with a 4K bomb rather then taking out the same amount with lots of 250's

Max · « **Reply #9 on:** February 14, 2003, 10:55:02 AM »

Thanks folks --- appreciate all the help

~~DmdMax~~

Soda · « **Reply #10 on:** February 14, 2003, 11:00:52 AM »

I think the biggest problem people have with level bombing is they run out of time and have to rush it. Typically, they go level too late and are still accelerating as they approach the target, waiting till the last minute to calibrate.

Level out early, accelerate as best you can, then stop accelerating, even if it means cutting back the throttles. You DON'T need to have full throttles open to bomb... though everyone seems to think so. I often bomb at only 80-90% of top speed which makes it so much easier to accelerate to 80% of top speed vs trying to milk every last mph out of something like a bomber. Note your speed and manifold pressure at the calibration speed though. If you ever get off speed, accelerate with your excess throttle, then set it back to the previous manifold pressure when you are close to your original speed.

I've used this technique to easily make a follow-up run in the opposite direction within visual distance of the field without having to recalibrate. it takes some practice though.

A last thought, typical low alt bombing tends to be from about 10K, below that and you are ack/fighter bait. From 10K- the wind layer (as mentioned 14K on most maps) you should be able to laser bomb. Above the wind layer, it gets tougher, and I think most people are rather inconsistent. I know I'm hit and miss, but I hate investing the time to climb to 20K anyway so rarely go that high.

-Soda
AH Trainer Corps
The Assassins.

Boozer · « **Reply #11 on:** February 20, 2003, 06:24:49 AM »

<>

I can hit individual gas & ammo with salvo 1 at 26k+ level bombing with 17's, so you can be as accurate as before calibrating was implemented if you do everything perfect.

*hic*

spiffykraits · « **Reply #12 on:** February 20, 2003, 02:23:41 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Boozer
<>

I can hit individual gas & ammo with salvo 1 at 26k+ level bombing with 17's, so you can be as accurate as before calibrating was implemented if you do everything perfect.

*hic*

When I calibrate and hold down the Y button I keep the position of the stick exactly there, when I hit the U botton to exit calibration, without letting go of the stick! If I let go I get some errors creeping into the calibration. I always seem to get overshoots if I don't hold the stick in position until i have hit U to store.

Don't bomb at full speed, throttle back a tad, open the bomb doors, let the formation settle into a constant speed and height before calibrating. I don't also push the stick far forward when calibrating but only a little forward when using Y. I always set the target alt before using Y. If not under attack I use outside view in buffs to adjust my lineup on approach, and recheck my calibration just before the target. I normally gun myself so being under attack in the drop zone is a pain.

It makes it easier also to bomb downwind or upwind rather than a crosswind if you are above the wind layer altitude. Usually this is either N/S or E/W depending on the arena. Press the wind button and see which direction the wind is and the altitude for each arena. If you are above that altitude some side force usually is required if you are bombing crosswind when pressing Y which makes it a tad more difficult to hold the calbration steady.

I can normally hit Hangers now from 20K or more quite regularly, I do "miss" sometimes if I have been hasty in calibrating. I use normal delay of 0.05 for precision bombing, for a spread such as towns etc you can increase to 0.08. If you are flying formation I release the bombs a fraction early (only a fraction) so that the drones will have a good chance of hitting the target too, as they should be immediately behind you.

Boozer · « **Reply #13 on:** February 21, 2003, 11:39:08 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by spiffykraits
If not under attack I use outside view in buffs to adjust my lineup on approach, and recheck my calibration just before the target.

My buffing routine....

A. Use the clipboard map edge as a straight edge, move the map so that your plane icon straddles the map edge... then it's a simple matter of minor adjustments to see that my flight path (approach due N, S, E or W depending) cuts the target icon right down the middle. I have my target perfectly aligned while I'm still 50-75 miles away, usually no adjustments necessary after that. If you approach either directly with or against the wind all you need to do is get your compass needle exactly on N/S (or E/W) and hit auto.

B. I like to throttle down for bombrun which gives me 1 second more to swing onto second tgt during drop, I fly 40 manifold if into the wind, 35 manifold if with the wind. (21-23k or so now) I'll have manifold dialed in for drop and let the planes settle in 50-25 miles out at level flight before calibrating for target. Open bombay doors. Use the clipboard rule edge again to ensure you're still aligned. I'm still 1 full sector from target.

C. Cruise the half a sector checking outside (F5) for interceptors (this is when I decide weather to continue run or fly a dry run to gun down the dweebs climbing to me, I don't drop if I have to fight off interceptors) nice & level, constant speed now, I start looking for my calibration mark at 13 miles out. Hit U and click tgt for alt setting, I verify that my drop alt & plane alt match exactly (if not, U out and start again). Now, because I did the perfect alignment 50 miles back, I get the luxury of looking forward with the sight and using a target field feature to mark on. Zoom full. I calibrate with just the horizontal crosshair, no lateral movement ever (no wind for me to adjust for,I dont worry about exactly lining up the X on some hangar, just keep the horizontal crosshair on the mark, I use the end of runway, or split the center of a runway length). Get mark stable and count 2 or 3, then hold down Y while you're already on the mark, count 5, 10 or 15 while the mark is held (longer is better), release Y while still keeping mark, and count another 2 or 3 before I let pressure off the stick and release my mark, NOW it's safe to U out of calibration and be confident you have it right.

D. Verification, Jumping to nose gun (for us glorious B-17 pilots) with full zoom will let me see everything while still one third a sector away, not just my perfect approach

but also which targets still need to be hit. Just a quick 2 second check. Zoom out full and get in norden for drop.

E. By now the field is slowly rolling into in my sights and I can adjust up to 5 degrees to line up onto a specific gas or ammo installation in F6. Salvo 2, zoom in, zoom in, adjust final, and BOMBS AWAY when X is right on the target. porked field.

*hic*