HTC, for 1.07, can you please, PLEASE remove the inflight Radar?

[hblair]

hehe, no problem straffo.   I see what you're gettimg at, but I don't think there would be such a huge difference in opinion between the guys who acces this forum and the guys who don't.

[lazs]

fix the field capture first then we will talk about "in flight dar".   last night there was no dar for the rooks.   The guys who flew bombers and P51's loved it.  everyone else hated it.   I burned two tanks of fuel without a decent fight.  The buffers and buddies liked it cause everyone was so bored and fearful of beimng gangbanged that they went on "missions"  (gangbanging undefended or lightly defended fields).

And pepe... I know for a fact that people log off when there is no dar.  

Get the fields fixed for longer fighter availability and it will in effect make the fields closer together 90% of the time and concentrate the fights.
lazs

[AKDejaVu]

 

The buffers and buddies liked it cause everyone was so bored and fearful of being gangbanged that they went on "missions"

Huh?  Radar was down because Knits had captured bases adjacent to it... and proceded to bomb the hell out of our city then it.  Dar going down was a sobering experience for most who took it as an opportunity to make our dar less accessable.  Very few missions... just people who didn't want to have this happen for the rest of the tour.

The only other option was to let the knits roll over the rooks and reset the arena.  Maybe that would have been more fun for everyone lazs?  Think a little more before spewing out the "M" word as if it were vulgar.

 

And pepe... I know for a fact that people log off when there is no dar.

One country rallied around loosing their dar and captured 6 bases with it down.  Another country chose to log off when they lost their dar.  It changes.

One thing is for sure though... there are people that will log off if dar is down.  Not many on last night liked it when dar went down.  People did what they had to do to make sure it didn't go down again.

What does that tell us about how MOST people view dar?

AKDejaVu

[hblair]

 

Originally posted by lazs:
fix the field capture first then we will talk about "in flight dar".   last night there was no dar for the rooks.   The guys who flew bombers and P51's loved it.  everyone else hated it.   I burned two tanks of fuel without a decent fight.

While you were flying in circles, burning your gas, your countrymen were taking your bases back for you, and had your radar back on by 9pm CST.  

 

Originally posted by lazs:
And pepe... I know for a fact that people log off when there is no dar.

Yup, but that is because the other country HAS radar! There's a difference there.  


 

Originally posted by lazs:
Get the fields fixed for longer fighter availability and it will in effect make the fields closer together 90% of the time and concentrate the fights.
lazs

Next time your online lazs, type .join hblair, press enter, and I'll show ya how to find a fight.  

[hblair]

 

Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
What does that tell us about how MOST people view dar?
AKDejaVu

It tells us that most people realize the strategical importance of radar in the current setup. If the other countries have radar available, and you don't, you are at an obvious disadvantage, most people realize this.

It does not, however, tell us whether the majority of the players in the main arena would prefer in-flight radar available as an option in the game or not.

[Pepe]

lazs,


 

Originally posted by lazs:
...

And pepe... I know for a fact that people log off when there is no dar.  

...

Not that hblair (thks, hblair) hasn't explained it to you again perfectly, just to state that I do not deny that fact. What I point is the flawed logic after the assumption that this behaviour can be extrapolated to no In-Flight radar -> less players in the terms brought about by Maverick

On your next paragraph, you hit the same stone time after time. You seem to think that everyone would fit into your total-furball-madness arena. I definitely won't. I do not want a reduced arena with invulnerable arfields with ethernal and omnscient radar. In fact I want to have the option to use more flying styles into this sim/game. I would love to fly with my squad a NOE mission in some cannon armed B-25's (A-26 would do, for the sake of it  ), and capture a field deep into enemy's land, before they even realized what's going on. Probably our side would suffer from that too. This is something only a software-tweak away and I fail to see the downside of it as severe and hampering in terms of gameplay for the average player as Mav (or you) present.

I am all to open new facets in gameplay, not restricting it. More variety is what I think improves the game experience, not the opposite.

I understand that my ideas are not bread & butter for the whole Arena, and thus, I try presenting them as my personal points of view and staying away from "thats what this game needs" type of sentences and talking as if everyone else agrees with them. I think you shoud try to present your ideas the same way.

Cheers,

Pepe

[Zigrat]

I'm glad im an assasin, with the smartest guys in the community in my squad   Pepe makes some damned good points too.

Lazs, you will still be able to find the fightxs, since you will have radar in the tower. Its teh lack of being able to auto vector onto dots while in flight thats kinda redic.

[bakerm]

Hmmm Well I'm not as bright as alot of you guys.  I fly for the fun of it.  I like action.  I've been on for hours at a time and not realized where the time has gone. I get a kick out of saving a field by knocking off the troops of a well planned attack and foiling the enemy.  This dar system isn't perfect, but it works pretty well.  I've notice that the dar is up sometimes and down others.  Heck I didn't even know you could knock out a fields radar. I am one of the guys you elite pilots need.  A target. hehe  I am happier knowing where guys are so I can get over there and get a fight going.  I don't want to spend all night looking.  There is so much negative feed back I thought I put my 2 cents in.  Dar or no Dar I hope to see you flyin.  

[Pepe]

lazs,

If you could not find fights (do not know wether they would fit your decency standards  ) was, above all, because you did not want to. I was flying rook (as usual) yesterday, and I would like to state that:

• Losing radar was mostly Rookland's fault. Apart from Knitland skills, we were roughly equal numbers, but a number of us decided It was more rewarding staying at A1/A8 furball. Nothing to object to that, but you have to admit that we have had PLENTY of time to counter Knitland's moves (S! for them, was a very nice rush).
• Having no radar was not boring or fearful for all of us, or the rest of us not flying buff or pony. At least it was not for me. In fact was amazing when two of us (Borete & me) were patrolling over A28 just in case Knits wanted to take it, and seeing not less than 5 Rooks respond to a Scramble petition on seeing 5 unidentified dots that resulted on a Lancaster and a group or 109 and 190 approaching the field. Quite intense fight there  
  
  
• Until TG 53 is sunk, there was a big battle over P33 & A22. Publicly announced on Ch2, for your (and others) furballing pleasure.
• All the time we were with no radar, was easy to see the progressive destruction of our premises, so not so difficult to figure out where the buffs were to be destroyed.
• The thing that you fail to see is that the actual radar/counter bar settings negate us some defense possibilities, as it would be a surprise sneak attack to their City & HQ (flying NOE B-26 or hvy fighters), and having hardened radar would not save us from being crushed, as we rather liked to split our forces in two fronts, instead of countering the bigger threat, even with full knowledge of what was going on (Continuous help requests on Ch2).

All in all, yesterday's atmosphere could be defined, in my oppinion, as tense and frustrating, because of both uncertainty and lack of proper attitude to counter a well executed attack. But tension and frustration lie on the opposite corner to boredom. I would bet that most of yesterday night logs were made on frustration, not on boredom.

I hope Rookland do not forget so fast our turn in the southern corner, permanently gangbanged (of course, no radar at all) and next time we pay attention to the important things. If so, I would better try to get used to flying blind  

All in all, I would not define yesterday situation as a "target poor" environment.

Cheers,

Pepe.

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by Zigrat:
Lazs, you will still be able to find the fightxs, since you will have radar in the tower. Its teh lack of being able to auto vector onto dots while in flight thats kinda redic.

That's the weakest argument for getting rid of it.

The difference from someone vectoring you to the fight and you vectoring yourself is that you don't have to sit there typing four hundred lines of text to figure out where you are going.

You want to kill people with their heads in their keyboards?

Phew, that's weak.
-SW

[Pepe]

bakerm,

The real pity of the situation is that most (correct me if I'm wrong) of the supporters of the current settings had not tried other options, still they do not want to give it even a try. And I can assure you It was really fun, at least with WB settings. The radar controller was an appreciated task, and quite fun too. And the vectoring process, very intense, on both ends. Besides the vectoring, you could effectively plan a stealth flying route, avoiding radar stations, and that was fun too, etc.

Bear in mind that we are not talking about getting rid of radar completely, just disabling it In-Flight (with some really interesting ideas, as the PBY radar/spotter plane), and readjusting the counter bars.

Hehehe, as for the target matter, all of us are one.  

Cheers,

Pepe.

[Pepe]

Mr. T,

Have you ever been vectored?

Cheers,

Pepe

[hblair]

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
The difference from someone vectoring you to the fight and you vectoring yourself is that you don't have to sit there typing four hundred lines of text to figure out where you are going.

You want to kill people with their heads in their keyboards?

Phew, that's weak.
-SW

SW: Hi guys, wheres the fight?
teamate#1: furball at 10,7,6
teamate#2: 3 lancs inbound A11 form south, need help

Thats the kinda stuff you'd see. Notice, you don't know exactly where the cons are, but you have a good idea, and you got the info from your countrymen, not some code.


[This message has been edited by hblair (edited 05-09-2001).]

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by hblair:
 SW: Hi guys, wheres the fight?
teamate#1: furball at 10,7,6
teamate#2: 3 lancs inbound A11 form south, need help

Mmmmkay...

Lets put this more into perspective...
Person just logging in: Hey guys what's going on at field xx?
...
...
...
...
...
...
Person just logged in, been here for 3 minutes: Hello?
Person that just logged in thinks to himself "To hell with this" and goes out on his own.

I see this happen regularly, not just to me either.

And you want to take away in flight bar radar?

Really... if you think I'm bad on open comms right now... you'll find out how irrate I can really become when no one wants to clue me in as to where I am going and what I'm going to run into.
-SW

[Wlfgng]

sigh...

Bar dar will get you to the fight Mr T.

what more do ya need ?