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Author Topic: Fifty years  (Read 2287 times)

Offline Toad

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Fifty years
« Reply #30 on: March 06, 2003, 03:28:21 PM »
There ya go... at least 12 million eternally peaceful customers.. and you guys are dissing him.

BTW, thanks again Boroda. I need a laugh today. I'm telling ya, you could make way more than Yakov Smirnoff. He just jokes about it. You appear to believe it. That would make the act WAY< WAY funnier.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Ossie

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Fifty years
« Reply #31 on: March 06, 2003, 03:45:39 PM »
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In 1927 he had nothing.


Er...didn't he have an officer corps at about that time?
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Offline Dowding

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Fifty years
« Reply #32 on: March 06, 2003, 03:49:49 PM »
No, that's Nazi propaganda propagated by decadent and biased Western post-WW2 historians. There was never an officer corps, just huge day trips for uniformed men around recently opened open cast mines. Some of them were careless and slipped, machine gunning themselves from behind as they fell into the hole.

It really was a tragedy.
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War! Never been so much fun. War! Never been so much fun! Go to your brother, Kill him with your gun, Leave him lying in his uniform, Dying in the sun.

Offline Toad

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Fifty years
« Reply #33 on: March 06, 2003, 03:54:48 PM »
And such a common trajgedy. You'd have thought they'd have put up safety ropes or cancelled the trips altogether.

Which brings us to the US/Jewish/Muslim extremist conspiracy to implement dangerous day trips to open mines for the Russian officer corps that was well known back then.........
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Hangtime

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« Reply #34 on: March 06, 2003, 04:58:55 PM »
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BTW... can you name 10 Americans who deserve the honor more than MLK?


I think there might be a few more than 10 to be found among the folks who've recieved one or more of these...

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Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #35 on: March 06, 2003, 05:06:19 PM »
I am a frequent visior to the official MOH memorial. (It is 5 miles from my home) They were indeed heroes Hang, and should be honored.

None however affected the lives of as many people as MLK.  

On your list funked, I will only agree with Jim Beam.. the rest are pretenders.

Here is the museum
« Last Edit: March 06, 2003, 05:11:46 PM by midnight Target »
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Offline Boroda

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« Reply #36 on: March 07, 2003, 12:59:20 PM »
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Originally posted by Ossie
Er...didn't he have an officer corps at about that time?


If I understood you correctly.

My Grandfather was a Kombrig (Brigade commander) in 1932. He was an Imperial officer. 2nd Pskov Lieb-Dragoon regiment, Riga front since 1916. He was a kornet. Second lt. in your terms. Order of Red Banner #123, a regiment commander in 1919...

In 1932 ge was arrested as a "member of officers coup".  There was no such word as "officer" in Soviet language that time... Anatoly Nikolaevich was released  in 1933, but became an ordinary major...

He was one of the best. I have a photo where he is with Kirponos and  other great Army commanders.
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Offline Ossie

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« Reply #37 on: March 07, 2003, 04:03:29 PM »
Hmmm, almost, but no I don't think you quite understood. By "corps" I meant "corps" as in "The Officer Corps for the US military consists of graduates from West Point, Anneapolis, The Citadel, etc."

My question was if the military, as it existed when Stalin came to power, had a corps of officers. This is in your reference to Stalin, the great politician, turning "nothing" into "something" when he came to power. My question is in regards to this "something" (military officers) seemingly becoming very much "nothing" during the same length of time, a time that by your own assertion was focused on preparing for war. But of course I can't say for sure that I'm not a victim of Nazi propaganda and US/Jewish/Muslim extremist conspiraces...
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Offline Frogm4n

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« Reply #38 on: March 07, 2003, 04:10:41 PM »
henry ford was a nazi
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Offline Boroda

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« Reply #39 on: March 09, 2003, 01:09:01 PM »
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Originally posted by Ossie
Hmmm, almost, but no I don't think you quite understood. By "corps" I meant "corps" as in "The Officer Corps for the US military consists of graduates from West Point, Anneapolis, The Citadel, etc."

My question was if the military, as it existed when Stalin came to power, had a corps of officers. This is in your reference to Stalin, the great politician, turning "nothing" into "something" when he came to power. My question is in regards to this "something" (military officers) seemingly becoming very much "nothing" during the same length of time, a time that by your own assertion was focused on preparing for war. But of course I can't say for sure that I'm not a victim of Nazi propaganda and US/Jewish/Muslim extremist conspiraces...


Ossie, Red Army had no "officers" until 1940 (IIRC). They were called "commanders".

My GrandFather was an old Imperial officer who retired in 1918 after the collapse of Riga front and Brest peace treaty. Later he was recruited by the famous Trodskiy's order and became a regiment commander in about one year.

Stalin didn't have real "officers corps". The "specialists" like my Grandfather were rare and. The best word that describes the fate of Russian Imperial officers corps is "tragedy"...

Anyway, Stalin had to create a whole new officers corps. My another GrandFather is a good example: he was a son of a Ukrainian village blacksmith, who went to Krasnodar Artillery College in 1937, and in Summer, 1941 was one of the first specialists to work with jet mortars. He spent about one year at the frontline and then served as a tutor in Krasin's Artillery College until the end of the War. This people who graduated from military colleges and academies in late 30s-early 50s were the main force (wrong word, maybe "mainstay" is the right one?) of the Soviet army until the 80s.

Dowding, where did you get that 12 million number? Just curious. 12 million is almost 10% of the whole population of USSR in the 30s.
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Offline Dowding

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« Reply #40 on: March 09, 2003, 01:26:02 PM »
Various accounts. I've seen the figure quoted from 8 to 40 million with 12 million being most often quoted by reliable historians.

The true issue, however, is not this grotesque numbers game, it is the fact that Stalin did kill millions of his own people - deliberately, intentionally, cold-heartedly and with the exact same deliberation as those who devised the Final Solution for European Jews. And for you to bask in some sick 'glory' of Soviet achievement, while in passing merely mentioning that the wholesale murder and terror was 'necessary to survive' is laughable. I only hope your opinions aren't shared by many Russians, but sadly I know that not to be the case.
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Offline Boroda

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« Reply #41 on: March 09, 2003, 01:54:04 PM »
Yes, my opinions are not shared by many Russians, but are shared by millions too.

Dowding, you probably quote Solzhenitsyn, who already said that he simply used numbers that he thought will be big enough to accuse "bloody commies".

Do you know that now in Russian Federation we have more people in prisons and camps then in the whole USSR during the worst years of Stalin's terror?... Definetly something to think about :(

It's too easy to make accusations. Charles Dikkens wrote that for stealing 20 shillings you could be hanged in good old England...
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Offline GRUNHERZ

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« Reply #42 on: March 09, 2003, 01:59:33 PM »
How can you just excuse off stalinds murders of millions as some lie Boroda...

What the diddly is wrong with you, have you no shame?
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Offline Habu

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« Reply #43 on: March 09, 2003, 02:14:45 PM »
Some credible scholars believe that Stalin was in the process of planning a nuclear war with the West when he died. He had also ordered the construction of massive prison camps at that time. For this reason it was believed that he was also about to start another massive purge.

It is now believed that he was poisoned by his own inner circle with warfarin a rat poison that causes hemorrhaging.

They did this to prevent the war with the West.

It is a blessing for the USSR that he died when he did.
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Offline Ossie

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« Reply #44 on: March 10, 2003, 01:46:10 AM »
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Ossie, Red Army had no "officers" until 1940 (IIRC). They were called "commanders".


That's great. Now that we've cleared up the semantics, what exactly happened to roughly half of his "commanders" in the late `30's?
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