Author Topic: History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......  (Read 497 times)

Offline hazed-

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« on: April 20, 2003, 06:35:23 AM »
I didnt get the title of the programme , I think it was called 'suicide tanks' or something. It was all about the poor quality and fighting characteristics of many of the allied tanks.

Well anyway, later in the programme it shows you some handheld filming during a tank battle in a german town.First you are told that a sherman M4 is hit and the film actually shows the crew bailing.The horrific thing is the guy has not foot left as he tumbles out trying to escape.The commentator mentions that the guy bled to death which makes veiwing it a little bit morbid.
Then it shows a pershing tank move forward to intercept the german tan, which is a Panther and he is reversing swiftly away from the pershings huge gun. The gunner is interveiwed and he mentions how the panther reversed behind a building and so he took a pot shot at where he thought the tank was THROUGH the building.He is smiling when he says 'I hoped it would go right through and kill the tank'. The film at this point is the most fascinating ive ever seen. The pershing continues to hunt the Panther quite openly as if they are quite sure they can tackle it.Ie they are in the middle of the street moving fast towards the retreating Panther.
Then the gunner says'We suddenly saw the panther and i took a shot on the move, which hit.We then pulled to a stop and i fired and hit again'.
Well this is the amazing shot Id like you all to see, the cameraman actually has the panther in his veiw as it is struck 4 or 5 times! Amazing but sobering because most of the crew are obviously killed in the ensueing inferno!! You actaully see 3 or so holes where the pershings AP go right through, showing up as bright orange circles as they show the burning insides against the black body of the tank.

The last shot of AP is particularly interesting as it really does show how the larger gun of the pershing slices through the armour. The shot is aimed at the thinner side armour behind the tracks and wheels and it hits and rockss the Panther showing a sudden bright ball of flame as you see again the burning insides though the perfectly round AP shell hole. It says the tank burned for 3 days!! and you can well beleive it when you see how furiously the tank burns in the film.

I have to say it was the best piece of documentary film work ive ever seen by the guy who filmed it.I'll keep an eye out for a repeat of this programme an try to get all the names involved as they definately deserve further research.
I now want to see all of this cameramans work.Simply astounding.

made me rethink about how AP shells work i can tell you.They went through the thickest armour like it was butter in the movie.Tony williams you have to see it if you can.A real record of the effectiveness of the later Pershing heavy calibre guns.

AH players after seeing this film may well think twice about how the tanks we drive 'should' stop this or that calibre gun.There are several shots of ap hits on various vehicles and it seemed to show you wasnt safe in a tank. Anything from poor quality armour to an unlucky hit could spell your doom in WW2.Those tank crews were brave bastards!.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2003, 06:43:14 AM by hazed- »

Offline Berra85

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2003, 06:43:23 AM »
DOH, i havent been watching the history channel lately, since extreme sports channel came on the air.

Offline Rasker

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2003, 03:06:40 AM »
I have watched the footage of the Pershing stalking the Panther on the streets of Cologne.  Great footage, and the cameraman should have worked for CNN running that roadblock a few days ago. :)

The Panther was definitely vulnerable on the sides.  The Tiger, OTOH, was nearly as thickly armored on the sides as on the front.  The roof and rear were the points to shoot for on the Tiger.  Allied troops facing the Panther from the front were advised to aim for the mantlet, the 'collar' where the gun emerges from the turret.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2003, 03:08:44 AM by Rasker »

Offline GRUNHERZ

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2003, 03:42:17 AM »
Tiger I had identical armor thickness on the sides and rear.

Offline Makarov9

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2003, 10:37:58 AM »
Found this site with some pics of the battle. Would love to see the video footage. If you find out the name of the show please let me know.

http://home.earthlink.net/~crcorbin/ColognePictures.html

Offline hazed-

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2003, 02:59:51 PM »
makarov it was suicide tanks or something very similar.

those pics are the right ones for the film :) if you look at the 5th picture of the panther on your link you can see the glowing hole (above the top track in the recess below the side armour) made by one of the shells.In the movie there are at least 3 such holes showing clearly between clouds of smoke.It really is an amazing film.

Offline gofaster

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History channel..best film ive seen in quite a while......
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2003, 12:56:34 PM »
Jim Bates' account of the battle really sets the tone (bold emphasis is mine).  He states it so matter-of-factly, which I think says something of the type of men that went into battle.

"In the center square in front of the Cathedral was a German Tank that a Sherman tank thought was disabled but the tank put a shell through the Sherman and killed three men in it.  A Tank Commander named Robert Early from E Company 32nd. Armored Regiment went on foot to investigate. I asked to go along and we went on the mezzanine of a building and saw the tank. He told me to stay there and he would come back in his tank and try to put the German tank out of commission and I could photograph it. He had one of the new M-26 Pershings with a ninety-mm gun. Sgt. Early said he would turn into the square under me, stop and fire at the German tank. When his tank came in the square under me the German tank began to traverse the gun. Cpl. Clarence Smoyer the gunner, did not wait for his tank to stop but fired before the gun was aimed at him. His first shot hit the German tank in the bottom and cut off the commander's legs. After the next shot, three of the crew bailed out but the shrapnel had got them. My pictures show the tank commander burned up with the tank, which was still smoldering next morning. The driver got to the back of the building where he fell. The bow gunner fell over a bicycle and lay there. The gunner went down nearby. All had been killed."

Offline OntosMk1

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possible titile
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2003, 02:27:01 PM »
Dangerous Missions: Tank Crews?
TIGER, tiger, burning bright  
In the forests of the night,  
What immortal hand or eye  
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?