Author Topic: discovery channel show on b17 sounds wrong (Read 350 times)

anonymous · « **on:** May 27, 2003, 11:19:35 AM »

its not like before when they were talking about the walther p38 being the best pistol of wwii. i knew they werent right on that one. this one im betting i can get some verification from you guys as wwii warplanes appear to be you thing. some guy dressed in a suit seemed pretty smart was saying that germans had guns on fighters with range superior to browning .50s by 1943. he said germans had 20 and 30 mm guns with better range so bombers couldnt defend themselves. now i know about modern .50 machineguns but not much about german guns that the warplanes were packin. common sense is telling me that with no radar to aim the gun theres no way you are shooting at max effective range with guns mounted on a warplane in wwii so this guy was talking nonsense. also id be damn impressed if any similar gun had greater effective range than a browning .50. give me the scoop.

Mini D · « **Reply #1 on:** May 27, 2003, 11:27:07 AM »

They were right about the walther P38. It's still arguably regarded as one of the best all around handguns of the 20th century. In the 9mm regime, it wins hands down. It wasn't until the 1990's that companies finally started topping it. I'd rate the browning high power (though still second to the p38) and colt 1911 in there too.

As for the 20mm and 30mm of the German fighters... Don't confuse muzzle velocity with range. Can't say I know what the range of the 20mm and 30mm was, but they were lesser muzzle velocities which means they'd have to be lobbing them in. Of course, if the Germans were to shoot from a high AoA, that wouldn't matter much. I would agree that the 20mm and the 30mm's main advantage layed in increase snapshot damage.

MiniD

anonymous · « **Reply #2 on:** May 27, 2003, 11:38:16 AM »

ive never shot a walther p38 but ive launched many bullets from the 1911 and the browning hp. the show was saying that the p38 was superior because of action type. thats not what would make a combat sidearm superior in my book.

LLv34_Snefens · « **Reply #3 on:** May 27, 2003, 12:48:25 PM »

The "normal" german 20 and 30mm had a relatively slow muzzle velocity which would mean you really had to lob them in as Mini D says if you were shooting from long range.

If we are talking about the MK103 30mm, then the drop at 1500m would "only" be 26.3m

Hangtime · « **Reply #4 on:** May 27, 2003, 04:47:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by anonymous
ive never shot a walther p38 but ive launched many bullets from the 1911 and the browning hp. the show was saying that the p38 was superior because of action type. thats not what would make a combat sidearm superior in my book.

rgr that.

Whatever yah hit with a .45 gets knocked down instantly.

..and stays down.

davidpt40 · « **Reply #5 on:** May 27, 2003, 05:19:05 PM »

I saw that show. They said the P38 was superior to the 1911 because in a close combat situation, the soldier with the P38 simply had to pull the trigger, whereas the soldier with the 1911 had to pull the hammer back first.

"Don't shoot yet Nazis, I am cocking the hammer, give me a second."

anonymous · « **Reply #6 on:** May 27, 2003, 05:39:42 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by davidpt40
I saw that show. They said the P38 was superior to the 1911 because in a close combat situation, the soldier with the P38 simply had to pull the trigger, whereas the soldier with the 1911 had to pull the hammer back first.

"Don't shoot yet Nazis, I am cocking the hammer, give me a second."

thats what sounded weird to me. if its already out then theres a round chambered and im ready to go. if i have to pull it good transition drills can insure that i dont lose any time working the slide. like i said before with a browning hp or a 1911 i feel just as well equipped as if i was carrying a sig or hk.