inflight radar needs removal

[Kweassa]

 hmm..

 How about comprimising things a bit?
 
 1) Get rid of individual radar contact dots for both friendly and hostile forces 2)make radar bar indicate size of enemy forces for not 1 sector, but 4(2x2) sectors

 That way, there still is radar information enough to find action, but it is four sectors and you don't know both the location of enemy and friendly. This would necessiate people of same countries to contact each other working in the 2x2 square more often than we do currently(since, flying alone for four sectors would reduce your chances for both surviving AND finding the enemy).

 More chance of survival for buff pilots would encourage them to fly more often/aggresively, and more buffs to be searched within four sectors would also mean more need for organized caps and less meaningless gang-bang furballs.

 And, the sector radio channel could be changed to the 'tactical sector communication', (1 tactical sector = 4 normal sectors) to add more convienience.

 Anyway, the point is to change something so that people still have enough guidance for flight/finding fights, but stop them from engaging and gangbanging in to just 1 airfield with instant access to information.

 I think my idea can solve some of those problems, plus, it would be relatively easy for HTC to change programming.

 What do you people think about it?

[sax]

In flight dar lessens the learning curve for newbies, game is tough enough for them already.

If it goes, we will be bombarded with chat on channel 1 and 2.

Sax

[AG Sachsenberg]

 

Originally posted by lazs:
yeah... let's just ratchet up the boredom factor another notch so that those who spend a goodly portion of their time online have one more advantage that they have "earned".  We certainly want to keep the game evolving and the learning curve rising.... Keeps out the riff raff...  Hey... if you haven't got a couple 4 hours to spend online then maybe you don't deserve a good fite?  Heck the "real" pilots didn't see a fite for a whole tour someimes.
lazs

Do you ever stop whining?  Truly the most pathetic person on this BBS board.  

[JimBear]

ya gotta admit, laz knows what he wants and sticks by it. I suggest another compromise, No dot dar, bar dar for sectors except for A/C under 500' and GVs. Laz and everyone who wants it, checks off and has a pulsating purple dot on the map so everyone can find Them  

[Pepe]

LOL JimBear!  

That was a really nice reverse of the worn point "If you don't want Dot Radar, don't use the clipboard!"  

S!

Cheers,

Pepe

[AKDejaVu]

 

Keep the sector bars but only if they don't show ground targets

Sorry, but this is a very bad idea in regards to the ground targets.

The one thing that should always show as a deflection on bar-dar is ground targets.  If not, there really is no way to prevent a panzer from "sneaking" into a base and taking it down.  The only way to prevent it would be for people to sit in panzers waiting for them to show up, or people sitting in the tower trying to spot them.

Think guys.

This isn't about making base captures easier.  Its strange that it seems this is the primary motive for losing the dar.  Of course, Cit just wants anything that makes hanging out over someone's base a little bit easier.  No flak and no dar... just 20k vulching.

AKDejaVu

[Hooligan]

Make the sector bars modal:

i.e. hit a key the sector bars represent only aircraft, hit that key again they represent vehicles only, then watercraft only and then it toggles back to everything.

Hooligan

[paintmaw]

Ok , no dar , and no icons .. that would mean each country would need to fly their own AC . Biscuits = LW ,, Knights = US ,, Rooks = Nipon .  

[Pepe]

Deja,

I agree GV's should show on counter bar. I would suggest to use another colour to distinguish between air and ground cons.

I do not know what Cit wants, but for sure this request is not in favour of just 20k vulching. It is well in the opposite field. It is allowing NOE flights, it is allowing sneak attacks, It is allowing more utility to the clouds as hiding factor, It is having a better feel of what were the actual conditions in WWII, It is stimulating teamwork and cooperative work, It is adding a new "vehicle" and a new weapon....no, definitely not just 20k vulching.

Cheers,

Pepe.

[Zippatuh]

You don’t want dar…  Do what Mav said; don’t use your clipboard.

This sounds strikingly familiar to the “hey we shouldn’t have icons in the training arena”  

Zippatuh

[Pepe]

You want to use dar, do what JimBear said. Ask that you alone has visible dot radar, so anyone can find you  

This sound strikingly familiar to the "hey, let us ease this thingy. It's too hard to find a fight"

Pepe

[Wlfgng]

I think more people want to remove, at the very least, inflight dot-dar.

If the game caters only to newbies then it'll get stale quickly.  Newbies just need to team up and improve their skills.  It's all part of learning to play.

I don't hear WB guys complaining about lack of inflight dar and they have the largest palyer base of all online sims.  

The argument about newbies leaving or not coming at all just because of dar are weak.

[Nifty]

The "if you don't like the inflight dar, don't open your clipboard" isn't a solution to the problems perceived by the people asking for removal of the dar.  For example, KnightJoe is attempting to hide in the clouds, so he doesn't want in flight dot dar, it gives away his position.  How is Joe not opening Joe's clipboard going to stop RookMax from from opening Max's clipboard and getting a pretty good idea of where Joe is?

Deja makes a good point about ground vehicles.  They'd have a really easy time sneaking up on things if they didn't show up in the Bar Dar, especially on this map.  "keep your planes out of x,y sector.  We'll take some GVs through there, no bars, they won't know we're coming until we're there!"

My stance?  Bar dar should be inflight, that's no different than getting an update from a tower.  "Enemy cons are active in sector x,y"  Dot dar shouldn't be active inflight continuously.  There isn't a verbal equivalent for that.  There's no way a person in a tower can tell you continuously (and instantaneously) where ONE contact is, let alone multiple cons.  Also, take out the swiveling icon showing your heading in the map, that's what the compass in your plane is for.  

Tower dar stays like it is now.

Gameplay concessions...  ALL Inflight dots stay, but are updated every X seconds.  (X because I don't know what a good number would be.  15, 30, 60???)  A step more towards the sim aspect, but still keeping gameplay concessions would be no enemy dots inflight, but friendly dots stay (continuous or interval updated).  A step more would be only your squaddies/wingmen/missionmates would show up on the inflight.

And then the weirdest compromise I just came up with...  This is to satisfy both the "I want my dots to find fights" and "dots help SA, and we don't want that" groups.  Dots stay inflight, BUT disappear when the con gets in Icon range.  Meaning you could find the fight, but once engaged, you couldn't pop up the inflight dot dar to see where that bogey went if you lose visual.

I guess that's all for now.  If you agree with the ideas, great!  If you don't agree, that's great too, just be nice about it!  

[Soda]

Not intended as a flame, just to promote discussion or get to issues.

I just don't understand the opposition to dar.  I can understand the icon discussions/issues, but what's wrong with dar.  I always considered it to be the AI equivalent of WW2 radar, combined with spies, ground observations, and GCI officers all rolled into one.  It didn't rely on having someone sit in the tower yelling out commands that nobody would follow anyway.  You fly over the front of battle and some grunt on the ground reports it.  When you get close to a field then your other observation assests help fix the enemy position.

What's the problem?  I'm honestly asking the question.  It seems to draw reactions from both side but I just don't understand.  Is it a realistic capability from the cockpit, nope, not really, but does everyone want to spend spend there first 30 minutes in the tower feeding info to the pilots?  I know I don't, I just want to fly.

-Soda

[Zippatuh]

The only thing I see here is a vocal minority trying to change the situation for all players.  Not everyone that plays AH reads the BBS.

To say newbies should just team up with someone new, give me a break.

What it looks like to me is that some of you are board with the game and want it changed to suit personal needs.  Adjustment to the DAR system I can understand in some way, of course depending on what they are.  To just out right say its bad and it should be removed is ludicrous.  Just about as much as saying, “don’t use your clip board”.  I believe that was the point I was trying to make.

It looks like we need another arena.  One that has no DAR, no map, no icons, and most likely no players.

Zippatuh