Kazaa - is it legal?

[Maniac]

it's time record companies realized that they already are hosed- not that they will be hosed unless... - but that they already are.

Amen!

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by ra
Assuming they gave away the first episode free, do you think they would have made any more episodes if there was no money, or very little money, to be made for their efforts?  The fact that cable can charge advertisers to see Southpark shows that there is still some control over its distribution.  If every episode was widely available for free download as soon as it was created, the cable audience would dwindle as would the ad revenue.  

ra

I disagree entirely. The 'free' audience got those boys started. There has always been and always be plenty of sites for the people to download southpark episodes, they're relatively easy to find.

Yet the series still persists and makes money.

So here we have an example of the file sharing network promoting something from start to finish.

Southpark hasn't died due to piracy, it has flourished. Explain that?

[BB Gun]

You can record stuff that is broadcast into your home, but cannot distribute it.

Going out and actually grabbing bootleg copies is a copyright violation (I'm pretty sure - think of it as shoplifting) and SHARING them is definitely a copyright violation.

File sharers that see themselves as "stickin' it to the MAN" are just as lame as "hero hackers", IMO.

Non matter how you try to disguise yourself as some kind of robin hood, the reality is you're violating copyright laws to get free music and are lamely justifying it after the fact.

And the more you do to undermine intellectual property laws, the less incentive there is to actually work to produce anything.

Yeah, the record companies are greedy bastards - who isn't?  But if its too expensive, DON'T BUY IT.  Not buying it, then downloading it so you can have your cake and eat it too and then pretending to be some kind of anti-establishment hero is extremely weak.

BB  <-- dons firesuit

[ra]

Originally posted by Vulcan
I disagree entirely. The 'free' audience got those boys started. There has always been and always be plenty of sites for the people to download southpark episodes, they're relatively easy to find.

Yet the series still persists and makes money.

So here we have an example of the file sharing network promoting something from start to finish.

Southpark hasn't died due to piracy, it has flourished. Explain that?

Southpark flourishes BECAUSE of piracy?  Southpark makes money because so far there are still a lot of people watching it through cable rather than stealing it.  You seem to advocate stealing intellectual property as a way to lower the price, which is a redikqulis concept.  It is the cable viewers who keep Southpark on the air, the downloaders are leeches.

The Beatles didn't give away their music, they were paid the market rate, which at first was almost nothing.  But as they became successful the money flowed in and they started writing their own songs.  

With the current technology the distribution of books, music, software, and films cannot be controlled by the owners.  If new protections are not established, creative endeavors will dry up.  It seems like a lot of people think that greed should not be a motivation for entertainers, but be real.  Almost every successful entertainer is filthy rich, and they have earned it.  Even CarrotTop.  And most of the anti-commercial types like Zappa and Neil Young suck azz.  They exist to give poseurs a sense of superiority over the common masses.

A copyright is like a patent, it allows the owner to make a boatload of money if his creation is in demand.  This isn't greed, it's simply rewarding those who have unique abilities, like CarrotTop.

ra

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by ra
Southpark flourishes BECAUSE of piracy?  Southpark makes money because so far there are still a lot of people watching it through cable rather than stealing it.  You seem to advocate stealing intellectual property as a way to lower the price, which is a redikqulis concept.  It is the cable viewers who keep Southpark on the air, the downloaders are leeches.

I didn't advocate anything. I just gave you a valid example that blow your theory : " The fact remains that without the ability to protect intellectual property rights the producers of these things, whether they go through Suits or not, will not be able to sell their products at market prices." completely out of the water.

1. Southpark would never had succeded had it not been for the 'illegal' distribution of the first episode. Its those 'leeches' that gave Southpark its life - this is undeniable.

2. South continues to flourish, even though it is one of the most 'pirated' series of video files (possibly due to the low video quality required for it).

This is in direct contradiction to your statement. And there are other examples out there.

[vorticon]

THERE IS NO TECHNOLOGICAL SOLUTION AND, BY DEFINITION, THERE CANNOT BE ONE.

there is one to stop it in future...

go back to putting all music on records and 8-tracks (sp)


even then i give it a week before someone figures out how to hack those

[ra]

Originally posted by Vulcan
I didn't advocate anything. I just gave you a valid example that blow your theory : " The fact remains that without the ability to protect intellectual property rights the producers of these things, whether they go through Suits or not, will not be able to sell their products at market prices." completely out of the water.

1. Southpark would never had succeded had it not been for the 'illegal' distribution of the first episode. Its those 'leeches' that gave Southpark its life - this is undeniable.

2. South continues to flourish, even though it is one of the most 'pirated' series of video files (possibly due to the low video quality required for it).

This is in direct contradiction to your statement. And there are other examples out there.

You don't blow anything out of the water, my theory is not a theory, it is a fact.   Intellectual property rights must be protected just as other property rights are.   Creators create, customers pay, leeches leech.  

How was the first episode of Southpark released?  Was it stolen by hackers and put on the Web?   Or released by its rightful owners deliberately?   I'd be interested in some of these other examples.  I'd like to know how piracy can help the victim.

With digital technology and telecommunications what they are, any property which can be digitized is now at risk of instant worldwide distribution.  No amount of policing can stop this, so those in the business will have to come up with new technologies to protect their property, or new ways of selling their products.

ra

[beet1e]

Thanks for the feedback, guys.

I have stopped sharing files, what with all the legal implications. I might still download an old song, but only because I can't buy it anywhere, and not doing this for commercial gain. I did recently download a movie that was recent, and since then felt bad about "stealing" it. Usually when I want a movie, I'll search for it on Amazon and buy a copy second hand. Often a movie can be bought for £5 - P&P might take that up to £8.

Yes, the record companies have been ripping us off on CD prices - especially in Britain. But we need to be paying something to ensure that good quality audio/video entertainment does not dry up. Maybe Kazaa has come head to head with those overpriced recordings, and will force the prices downwards. I'd be happy to pay those new sensible prices.

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by ra
You don't blow anything out of the water, my theory is not a theory, it is a fact.   Intellectual property rights must be protected just as other property rights are.   Creators create, customers pay, leeches leech.  

Then explain the very existance of southpark today. According to your 'fact', it shouldn't exist. But the 'fact' is it does exist.

IIRC the first episode was 'leaked' and subsequently hit the FTP, newsgroups, and filesharing community big time.

You're in denial, just as the recording industry is. I remember many years ago, I met a guy from Sony NZ (the recording side of it) who told me MP3 was no threat because the quality was crap and who would be bothered downloaded files that size.

File sharing and internet distribution is here to stay - you just can't stop it by standing on a soapbox and screaming thieves at the top of your voice. There are those who will continue to fight it - they are pissing into the wind - and there are those who will ride it and use it to their advantage - they'll be the winners.

[ra]

IIRC the first episode was 'leaked' and subsequently hit the FTP, newsgroups, and filesharing community big time.

Leaked by who, that is the question.  

You're in denial, just as the recording industry is. I remember many years ago, I met a guy from Sony NZ (the recording side of it) who told me MP3 was no threat because the quality was crap and who would be bothered downloaded files that size.

Denial about what?  I know technology threatens property rights, unlike your genius aquaintance from Sony.  
Your whole diatribe is 'if you can't stop me from stealing it, it's mine'.  That is completely true.  But don't think this situation won't eventually affect the behavior of those who create that which you download.  They will either come up with another distribution method, or they won't bother creating masterpieces like Dumb and Dumberer.

ra

[trolla]

It is the easyest way to get viruses/backdor trojans lol, I cant belive people still using that program for dw music and stuff.

Buy you own music/programs or take the risk of getting infected.

Some of the trojans there are so new that the best antivirus/firewalls still dont have a clue about them.
Personally I hate thos programs that steals both bandwith and does crappy things with my computer.

Another thing is even if you shut it down its still crapping your connection for hours and that also inflict your ping in a Internet game.

[Maniac]

It is the easyest way to get viruses/backdor trojans lol, I cant belive people still using that program for dw music and stuff.

Buy you own music/programs or take the risk of getting infected.

Some of the trojans there are so new that the best antivirus/firewalls still dont have a clue about them.
Personally I hate thos programs that steals both bandwith and does crappy things with my computer.
 

Hello there sir.... You are way out of line...

You cant get infected by an MP3 files or movies (avi, mpeg etc) only executables, .pif .scr .com .bat .exe

If you stopped downloading music and movies due to virus infection risk, then you can start downloading again, whitout fear for infection....

Have an nice day

[beet1e]

This Kazaa business is starting to turn ugly. The fine for illegal download could be £95,000 per song.

I have now expunged Kazaa from my system and have no files downloaded from it. It's turning ugly.

Newspaper story about girl facing prosecution

[Furball]

Originally posted by OIO

Which is stupid really, those morons can only prosecute file-sharers in the USA.

In a year, if they are very successfull, no one in the US will be sharing files... but will be downloading them from servers in hong cong, russia, etc etc.

So please confirm - is it just americans that can be sued for filesharing?