think we traumatized him...

[Creamo]

And yappin that it is unbalanced 2000 posts in a row, is Crackers? lol, too much.

[Mini D]

Originally posted by Toad
Yes, Laz.. don't point out that strat is unbalanced. That's not the way to get the message out.

Ummm... point out where he said strat is unbalanced when starting this thread toad.  I mean.. you aren't just blindly defending him here are ya big guy?

All he really said was some guy wanted to attack the base, but they didn't, so they laughed at him.

MiniD

[Toad]

Funny thing, Mini. Threads start with an idea or comment or two and the next thing you know the discussion expands to other new areas or even areas that have been covered in other threads before.

Laz isn't being inconsistent; I think most agree he pretty well sticks to his theme, albeit with some variation of expression.

The current "unhappiness in the MA" threads are nothing new, really. If anything is new, it's that folks that pretty much never worried about what was going on in the MA are now voicing displeasure. There's a lot of folks saying the same thing as Laz and it's a reasonably broad spectrum. Jeez, I think I even saw Muckmaw saying strat is unbalanced in some thread the other day.

Then some guy posted a laundry list of 3-4 things that had changed in the game with commentary to the effect that these changes were not good for gameplay and needed to be fixed. Same guy then posts in another thread that it's not the game that changed, it's the players that changed. Go figure.

Laz needing defending? That'd be the day. You ever met him in person?

[Grizzly]

We must all like AH or we wouldn't be here. But nothing's perfect, and many might have ideas on how AH can be improved. So we post our ideas on a BB provided for that purpose and a discussion develops.

Then along come the spoilers complaining that these people are whining (in affect, whining about whining), and occasionally an egg of ludicrousness is laid (ie: "These posts are not the way to get your message heard").

If a person doesn't have anything worth while to add to a discussion, they should just listen.

[snocone]

come to the ct

good fights most the time

come to the ct

very little pork and auger

come to the ct

evenly matched plane sets

COME TO THE CT!!!

also, read anything you can by b17skull12, daily prizes awarded for those who can decipher his posts

[muckmaw]

Toad-

I agree the strat is unbalanced. What one man tears asunder, 1 man should be able to rebuild. (Or at least 3-4 goons trips as you said.) I could not agree more.

However, on the second point, about the rift. I've said it before, there is no question there are 2 firmly entrenched camps when it comes to gameplay. There will be debates, and people look out for their own interests. This is natural. What only greatens the rifts are the semi-constant salvo's of insults being fired off.

Example: From the thread entitled "WB a furball paradise"

Maybe when all the timid toolshed killers leave the MA for the missun arena nirvanna things will pick up in the MA? --Lazs

guess i shouldn't have pointed out that somebodies squaddie made the worst map in AH huh? -------Lazs


I don't hate you lazs. I just think you've become pathetic.---Mini D

well isn't it mindless turns and stalls....just to get picked off--SLO

I guess "mindless" means .... ability to win. "complex strat" means.... losing as slwly as possible.----LAZS

Im thinking with AH2 all those AW strat***** will go to the missun uh-rena and leave the classic MA to be ruled by the real deals.--------Yeager

 Furballin seems pretty mindless to me.. you're either cherrypicking or getting cherrypicked. -------RUT

From the thread: Where Fur and Strat Collide...

the strat guys need the attention... taking two bases that nobody sees you take isn't near as good as being in the limelight.... even if it is bad limelight... if we had no killshooter I would shoot down our own bombers that were killing cv's. ----LAZS

we were tasked to take out the CV by 40Dog, leader of the MAW. Did I enjoy carrying out the order? You bet your arnold.---Muckmaw

When I saw you in my bombsight, I felt conflicted about sinking the CV. I could not decide if I should sink it right away, or wait until you were close enough to watch it go under. ---Muckmaw

your 30 minute anal "missun" made me click on another cv--- Lazs

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooh! My HEROES!

You guys are just so awesomely heroic and military and all!
Tell me, do you use a webcam for the crew shoe shine inspection on squad nites? Do you fly in your dress uniforms---TOAD

However, like most things in life, with experience you discard the fluffy stuff eventually and get down to the basic things of real value and true enjoyment.

Hey, tell me......... when a mighty air armada "wins the war" for the glory of their country by bombing and gooning and gv'ing their way to fame and ticker tape parades.....---TOAD

 those who would oppose us are the enemy of choice... look at their gameplay style... these are the guys you don't invite to parties. The coin and stamp collectors of flight sims.... the sky accountants. --------Lazs


Look, I did not post this to dredge this up. I just wanted everyone, myself included to read the crap we're spewing. All of the above could have been said without the cheap shots.

There will always be strats and furs. There does not have to be "Sky Accountants and Mindless Quakers".

[muckmaw]

Then of course, we have the grand daddy of all slams courtesy of Toad:


The Toolshed Pests -- Sgt. Rudely Auger
---------------------------------------
Pork-ing fuel tanks from the sky,____
That’s the way____ that I now fly.____
Drop my bombs____ and run away,
It’s about____ limiting your play.

Sliver rakes____ up-on my chest,____
I’ve now become____ a Tool-shed Pest.____
One hun-dred times____ I’ll crash to-day,____
But you can-not____ fly all planes this way____.

I used to fight____ just plane vee plane,____
The others said, “got no brain.____”
Now I pork____ by night and day,____
Most-ly die____ from the ack gun-play.____

Sliver rakes____ up-on my chest,____
I’ve now become____ a Tool-shed Pest.____
One hun-dred times____ I’ll crash to-day,____
But you can-not____ fly all planes this way.


Want to fly____ and have some fun,____
Just don’t care if____ the war is won.____
Take silver rakes____ off of my chest,____
Just can’t be____ a Tool-shed Pest.____

Oh great H-T____ you had the best,____
Things to hold____ each pilot’s in-ter-est.____
You are the man____ the one they say ____
Can fix strat____ resupply to-day!____


I'm still trying to figure out which key this is played in.

[Toad]

Sing Along!

Here's the melody... sing all you like.  

Now as to the rest...

It bears repeating that no one I've seen arguing the "furball" point of view wants game changes to prevent another player from doing anything else that's in the game. IE: Rude doesn't want game changes to prevent a bomber guy from bombing HQ and killing the dar.

To the contrary, it's been emphasized over and over that basically the fighter fighting crowd just wants to be able to find a place on each map to have their kind of fun.. that's it... that's all. Just want to have some fun flying, climbing, diving, turning and shooting.

It's been pointed out that Tank Town on Trinity provides the sort of thing for treadheads that's asked for fighters.

Nobody wants to "take away" anything from the rest of the game; they just want something left in for those who don't care who wins the war, don't care to play the "strat" game, don't care to go on huge missions, etc., etc.

As you say, it's currently unbalanced and it's unbalanced in favor of strat options. It didn't used to be this way; it slowly evolved as some folks requested changes to the game favoring "strat" play.

Now, the guys that were content to just fly and fight to no real purpose are feeling pushed out of the MA. That's the bottom line. So, they're speaking up.

And some don't think that's fair that they should get to speak their piece as the folks that have been asking for and receiving more strat features.

[Grizzly]

Originally posted by Toad

To the contrary, it's been emphasized over and over that basically the fighter fighting crowd just wants to be able to find a place on each map to have their kind of fun.. that's it... that's all. Just want to have some fun flying, climbing, diving, turning and shooting.
 

Heck, most of the time the fighter jocks can find a place to fight. The biggest problem is when most of the bases get captured and a country only has a few bases to fly from when they log on prime time evenings after a hard day of work. Then they have to put up with getting ganged and vulched while the other two countries duke it out to see who should win. Sometimes the Bish don't take the last few bases just to drag out the torture. This is what a large number of HiTech's customers have to put up with. I wonder how many he lost.

How many times can a country capture the arena before it gets boring? How about a new "Land Grab" arena with only one country (the Bishrooks), so there's no need to worry about opposition?

[SKurj]

Hell no, the community doing a good job of splitting itself up already.

Time for 3 arenas, can't see any other way to make em happy.

A strat arena, a furball arena, and a treadheads arena

Furballers won't be happy until no chance of a bomb landing on their field exists.
Strat guys won't be happy until the 'team' at least looks like it shares the same goal.
The treadheads... well, they like not to be bothered by the pesky fighters/bombers after they've driven for 20 minutes to the target.

Its the only way...

Making a nice little out of the way section of the map for furballers is just a waste of bandwidth and resources for players that do not wish to play the whole game.  

The same can really be said about the center of trinity when ya think about it.  And the whines when someone flies a plane in there....

3 servers, not sharing the same box, or pipe.  Then each one can play the game the way he/she likes and not affect anyone else detrimentally (sp?) at all.


For now....

Furballers... if there is soo many of you surely it can't be too hard to announce where you are all going to congregate?

Stratguys... make a note of all the furballers so you know not to expect help for the 'team'

treadheads...  this is abit tough... think you guys are SOL unless its trinity for now.


SKurj

[NoBaddy]

Originally posted by SKurj

treadheads...  this is abit tough... think you guys are SOL unless its trinity for now.


SKurj

Skurj...

I offered to try to set something similar to Tank Town up for the Whirlygig Guys. Was told not to bother....so I didn't .

[lazs2]

skurj.. you have a point..  when you said that strat guys won't be happy till everyone at least appears to be part of the team.   They thrive on that... the  hive thing and the teamwork... I agree... I have said that to make strat and fur co-exist you have to make it LOOK like they have the same goal.  

But...Furballers don't care (much) if fields are taken if there are other places to up that are action... I don't think furballers want uncapturable or undamageable fields...  They don't mind if it LOOKS like they are part of the strat... in some ways, we are.... If I kill 4 fighters while you are on your way to take a field then you will think I helped the "effort"   it will look like the guys who are good in fighters did their part and everyone will be happy.... If you simply pork the fuel or hangers and let the field sit along with 6 others for an hour or so... the furballers get pissed.   No movement and no action... if there is any "strat" to this is wasted on anyone not playing the 20 hour AH marathon.

put the fields closer together and make em fall easier... once all the resources are gone... it's dead... 50% fuel minimum... all hangers the same fluff/fighter.   maye revetments instead.

and muck... as you see... both sides use descriptive terms.   It is a shame that the toolshed killers are so sensitive but then... I expected no less.  tough.    Names stick because they have a grain of truth or... are outraggeous, like calling a bald guy "curly".   I am merely looking for descriptive terms.   As for the walter mitty military thing... ya gotta admit.... for a grown man.... a little over the top?

and deja... well... when has deja ever posted that wasn't bitter and or condencending?  Creamo?  creamo doesn't even play.

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

[Creamo]

I play Lazs, and maintain a better kill per hour than your little parrot buddy. Hell, Im even ranked above Toad in Fighter Stats. Points, AND kills/hour. Now how is that possible? These stats things are fun.

I was 600 something an hour ago, must be some great furbals going on in the MA because I dropped to 800.

Toad should challenge me for best fighter rank and do another silly bbs bet. I can hear your channel voice chat now…

SKIPPER!

lol

[lazs2]

hmm... creamo, for the last three tours it looks like toad has a higher kills per hour and k/d than you and that he plays at least twice as much as you too.   since you brought it up....
lazs

[Mini D]

Originally posted by Toad
Funny thing, Mini. Threads start with an idea or comment or two and the next thing you know the discussion expands to other new areas or even areas that have been covered in other threads before.

I'm sorry, so you're saying that this is the best way to start a thread and get a rational discussion?  Are you saying that this is the way the community avoids rifts?  Are you saying that we should all go back in the MA, laugh at someone then come here and say how cool we are for doing it in hopes of finding others that think they are as cool as us?

Well toad?

Or maybe we could go in the MA and hang out in CV ack for 2 hours insulting anyone that comes near the CV with the intent to bomb it on ch. 1.  And we can call it fun doing it even though anyone coming even to just furball has to fly 20 miles to get to the fight cause the "fun CV furballers" still don't want to leave their CV?  There's a great one.  Those are fun fights.  Those are the fights I think of whenever I see you post toad.

Laz isn't being inconsistent; I think most agree he pretty well sticks to his theme, albeit with some variation of expression.

Find where I've said he was inconsistant.  I mean, other than saying "there is a rift" in the community and pretending that he (and you) don't perpetuate it.

The current "unhappiness in the MA" threads are nothing new, really. If anything is new, it's that folks that pretty much never worried about what was going on in the MA are now voicing displeasure. There's a lot of folks saying the same thing as Laz and it's a reasonably broad spectrum. Jeez, I think I even saw Muckmaw saying strat is unbalanced in some thread the other day.

The current unhappiness in the MA threads are nothing new... you are quite correct.  Its just that now, when its you doing it, you think its right.  And when its you doing it, you think it means something else.

The fights are there.  The people are there.  Right now a few people are spending more and more time trying not to find good fights just so they'll have something to complain about later.  I mean, for Christ's sake... Lazs just complained that he had his squad hovering over an enemy base and nobody up'd.  You may want to ask him if his squad would have simply vulched anyone that tried to up... or if lazs has done that recently.  I'm pretty positive he has.  Seems things were close enough for a fun fight, but others just didn't really want that to happen when they could have a complete advantage and dominate planes on the ground.  Not that there's anything wrong with that, until they start to spend every waking hour claiming that they just want to furball.

Then some guy posted a laundry list of 3-4 things that had changed in the game with commentary to the effect that these changes were not good for gameplay and needed to be fixed. Same guy then posts in another thread that it's not the game that changed, it's the players that changed. Go figure.

Ah... the ends justify the means.  Yeppers.  This is the way all discussions should be done.  Notice how you had to point to someone else's post to find a real reason for this thread?

Laz needing defending? That'd be the day. You ever met him in person?

It must have been a very emotional thing for you.  You seem to have been in love with him ever since.

MiniD