Ever wonder why only the bad guys nicknamed Allied aircraft with those cool "Death" names,Because they didn't. It was made up by the Allied media. Sounds cool, but doesn't check out when actually followed up on.
Whistling Death, Whispering Death, etc? :uhoh
I like the Beau fighter because we share the same name. My last name starts with Beau. It means handsome, pretty, or beautiful in Frech (has many meanings along that line)
I'd give up my 38G for a Beau
Because they didn't. It was made up by the Allied media. Sounds cool, but doesn't check out when actually followed up on.
410 should come first. Becuase it is sexier than the beuafighter
Both are sexy, put the mossi in it too.
Get the beau and it would be another great addition to BoB, Philippines and Burma events.
The Beau would be better added to help the balance - the Bf110 is a cracking ground attack as it is, as is the Il-2, so a Brit version would be useful.Erm, Mossie?
Erm, Mossie?
Not that I am against the Beaufighter being added, but from a grand attack viewpoint it won't really be much different in hitting capability than the Mossie.
My dad had an old paperback, I think it was called "Torpedo Bomber", that was all about the Beau in the Med and along the channel. They really did a lot of work that you rarely hear about, and some of the stories that come out of their service is just incredible.
I thought it was the Beaufighter, since it shows photos of them doing rocket strikes off the dutch coast and the frisians and talks about them strafing Italian shipping in the Med. Maybe its both?
410 should still come before the Beaufighter. It makes a 110G look like a french soldier.Brave?
410 should still come before the Beaufighter. It makes a 110G look like a french soldier.
Greebo I saw that Beaufighter being restored when I was at Duxford back in 1999, they must have hit some snags as it was up on it's gear then.Yes you can get in to take pictures of any of there planes how ever it is a long process & it is just not open to the general public you must have a reason wanting access as well as be affiliated with an organization if I recall correctly. A link to an Australian aircraft. http://www.aarg.com.au/Beaufighter.htm
The National Museum of the USAF already has a Beaufighter on display.
http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=492
I'll bet a few phone calls to the right people might result in access to the cockpit for photos..
[edit] Or you could look at the photos they provided which includes a cockpit shot.
This was a successful and versatile airframe. Unfortunately it was most successful in roles that really aren't associated with the game, but I'm all for the Beau being included. Enjoy the sight. http://www.burmabeaufighters.com/pages/beaufighters.php
The only roll the Beaufighter had that really isn't associated with the game was as a night fighter. The other rolls it was tasked with (anti-maritime, fighter/bomber) are all found in the MA.
Question is, which of the Beaufighters we'll get. Would it be a regular Mark series or the Australian DAP version or maybe both? In either case, the Beaufighter is a welcome addition to the EW and MW plane set and will see some life in the LW arenas as well.
ack-ack
The VIC would be representative of the Beau in all theatres, it would be the most likely model, but the mk21 (Aust version) would be good, with slightly heavier fire power and a good 2k bomb load.
I would think the Mark 21 would have a better survival chance and use in the LW arenas than earlier versions. Speaking of which, wasn't the Mark VIC the torpedo carrying version? I would have thought the Mark III (w/Hercules engines) or the Mark IV (with Merlin engines) would have been a more representative model in all theaters. Though, with the VIC variant the Beaufighter could be an effective anti-maritime platform.
You might even see some of those weird SAPPers flying the VIC around and leveling a town with the torpedos.
ack-ack
I would think the Mark 21 would have a better survival chance and use in the LW arenas than earlier versions. Speaking of which, wasn't the Mark VIC the torpedo carrying version? I would have thought the Mark III (w/Hercules engines) or the Mark IV (with Merlin engines) would have been a more representative model in all theaters. Though, with the VIC variant the Beaufighter could be an effective anti-maritime platform.
ack-ack
The only roll the Beaufighter had that really isn't associated with the game was as a night fighter. The other rolls it was tasked with (anti-maritime, fighter/bomber) are all found in the MA.
Question is, which of the Beaufighters we'll get. Would it be a regular Mark series or the Australian DAP version or maybe both? In either case, the Beaufighter is a welcome addition to the EW and MW plane set and will see some life in the LW arenas as well.
ack-ack
Maritime strike? In Aces High?I agree with what you have wrote here. In actuality with the fire power of US fleets & the game modeling such fire power it is virtually impossible to get any effective torpedo run with out it being a suicide run. Just remember this plane was an effective fighter with many Ace's it will have many other uses within the game.
Maritime strike in Aces high is some dweeb upping Lancs to 2,000', surviving the ack long enough to fling a bunch of 1,000 lb bombs at a CV, and then upping another 10 times to get the job done. Even if your talking torpedoes, a job the Beau would do well with, 99% of the people will look at the single torp in the single Beau, then look at the 2 x 3 in the useonceandthrowaway JUs, and which one do you think they will take up? These are the same characters who will upp, fire 4 and tower, PT boats 30 times in a row until they finally get to ruin everyone elses fight and sink the CV.
Even the legitimate attacks on game CVs are done with heavy bombers dropping big eggs from a safe height. Or versatile Jabos dropping much more TnT then the Beau can/did/will. There are no submarines in the game or large, unescorted Japanese convoys. Two things the Beau sparkled at.
Yes there are the little supply barges but how many times have you heard someone ask, "can we sink those"? And whos going to up a Beau to sink them anyways? Lets face it. There really is no maritime strike mission in the game. Certainly one not handled already by far more able airplanes, usually associated with uncouth dweebery.
Oh I'll find a use for the Beau. Its to good an airplane to be useless and to good an airplane to leave out of the game. I say :aok And while they are at it we need a Brit CV launched attack plane like the Firefly. Britain was a monster of a sea power at the time, a monster of a Carrier power, and we just plain dont have enough Brit on our CVs.
The Mk-X and Mk-21 are close enough they could be the same AH model with different three different armament options in the loadout screen; just 20mms, 20mms and 303s, 20mms and 0.5ins.Could you use the template of both in light of the Mk-21 having the bulges under the cockpit for the auto pilot the nose has a completely differant look to the MK-10. Also they had differant engines if I am not mistaken.
Could you use the template of both in light of the Mk-21 having the bulges under the cockpit for the auto pilot the nose has a completely differant look to the MK-10. Also they had differant engines if I am not mistaken.
I think the engines are the only possible problem to sharing the Mk X and Mk 21 onto one shape. Were the Mk 21 engines significantly different to the Mk X engines, i.e. different power or supercharger settings? Or was it more of a paperwork thing, i.e. built in a different factory or different propeller fitting?Not much on engine specs but this might answer it.
I think the best way to look at it is the 21 would be icing on the cake. The RAAF flew British built versions from 42 until the end. The 21 was essentially their license built version of the Mk X. The bulge was for the autopilot that wasn't fitted operationally.Would it be that capable a dogfighter? Would be a shame to come back after going cold turkey, only to burn right back out.
If HTC modeled the Beau and was only going to do two versions like they did with the 25, then I'd suggest the VI and TFX. And as Greebo said the 21 is close enough to the X that an armament option would work if they wanted to go that way like they did with the 25C and 25C Strafer versions. Allow for leaving out the wing guns as was done, or skipping rockets or extra fuel and going with the 6 303s of the VI or X or 4 50s of the 21.
I'd be back for the Beau. I'd move into it in fact.
Would it be that capable a dogfighter? Would be a shame to come back after going cold turkey, only to burn right back out.
It wasn't a dogfighter, but it could defend itself. Reading about the Aussies flying it alongside the 5th AF folks in the PTO has been interesting. They had their own version of the Thach weave with the Beau's. They were always down low and relied on their speed to get in and out. That being said they did mix it up if they had to.
Dan, what book is that in ?
Just give us the beaufighter HTC. I don't care if it's the MkIFC, MkXXI, or MkX.
Dan I found that I could get Nevilles book. Apparently he has a website that sells them. Only 300 I believe were printed.
Price ~60 Australian.
BTW HTC does have the info to model the MkXXI. Not the flight model yet...just the exterior. Think only difference between X and XXI was autopilot bubble on nose.
OH!...one other difference the MkXXI could/did carry 4 X 50 cals instead of the 6X303s.
Hajo
nice :aokI think it will be a plane with a f3 option for sure.
visibilty doesnt look great though :uhoh
Anybody have an links to material on the Beaus service with night fighter squadrons during the blitz?
Specifically Im looking for kill tallys on specific German aircraft during night time hours. Thanx. Even better would be a inclusive record of Beau night time squadron Ops during the entire war in Europe.
Thanks Dan. So Fig.1 looks like it's pointing down and is shot from pretty low, relative to what you would see sitting in the cockpit. The view out of the cockpit shouldn't be as bad as Fig.1 seems to show.
Holmes I don't think the Beaufighter will have a worse view then the 109s or the 38s from the cockpit.
410 should come first. Becuase it is sexier than the beuafighter
M00T I doubt he'll add the 410. It was horrible, just an update on the 210, which almost got Messerschmitt Shot.
The 210 and 410 were so bad they had to continue makeing 110s, which they canceled at one point.
Now....if you talk the He219 I might listen! :D
Anybody have an links to material on the Beaus service with night fighter squadrons during the blitz?Close as I can get you. Click on them a few times to blow them up larger.
Specifically Im looking for kill tallys on specific German aircraft during night time hours. Thanx. Even better would be a inclusive record of Beau night time squadron Ops during the entire war in Europe.
Close as I can get you. Click on them a few times to blow them up larger.
(http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/4941/scan111ut9.th.jpg) (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan111ut9.jpg)
(http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/3264/scan112hm3.th.jpg) (http://img105.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan112hm3.jpg)
(http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/884/scan113sk1.th.jpg) (http://img105.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan113sk1.jpg)
(http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/8017/scan114ml1.th.jpg) (http://img299.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan114ml1.jpg)
dang it guys all these pictures and videos are really getting my hopes up for this plane, CUT IT OUT! :cry
two engines followed closely by an airplane... :D
:aok +1
Ah, the Beaufighter... two engines followed closely by an airplane... :D
hmm the Beau and He111 would be a nice matched set to add :)
edit: in that last pic of "Fluff", the rh engine appears to be called Andy :huh
Watched that latest "MUMMY" movie the other day..If they ever give us Ord perk selection your A20/Boston would have rockets & torpedo's they did carry both. Plus in this game a lot of the vehicles tend to get used in many other rolls that they never did in real life. So the Beau will have its place.
Had a BeauFighter in it.. Thought that was interesting...
Except for torp carrying, I don't think it would be much
better than an A20G.. Just won't carry an equal payload..
In the MA's it would be easy meat for the 5in gunners
when trying to drop torps.. And ya only get 1 plane...
A20G's greatest feature is the 8x500lber bombload..
Makes it a heavy hitter.. Rockets just ain't the same...
But, the cannons would make it far superior to the
EW Boston.. It would also be great for scenarios..
Don't get me wrong, I love the plane... VERY COOL!!
But I'd never swap an A20 for it... NO WAY!!!
Hope we get it anyway, always liked'em...
RC
Comparing the "Bo" to the A20 is like comparing a Corvette to a Chevelle, they are two very different beast.
The Beaufighter should be compared to the Mossie, Bf110, or even a hvy Jug. But NOT the A20.
The A20 could be compared to the Boston, Ju-88, B25H, etc.
Well.......when the Beau arrives I will be parking the Jug for awhile.
I have an idea. We in Aces High form a Beaufighter Squadron. Players from all sides welcomed.
We get together on specified nights and search and destroy. Don't drop from your regular squadron
just get the Beaus together. To repeat a cliche.....it would be AWESOME.
Well.......when the Beau arrives I will be parking the Jug for awhile.
I have an idea. We in Aces High form a Beaufighter Squadron. Players from all sides welcomed.
We get together on specified nights and search and destroy. Don't drop from your regular squadron
just get the Beaus together. To repeat a cliche.....it would be AWESOME.
Great minds think alike. :)
Already have the name. B.O.S.S. "Beaufighter Operators Support Services"
Well.......when the Beau arrives I will be parking the Jug for awhile.
I have an idea. We in Aces High form a Beaufighter Squadron. Players from all sides welcomed.
We get together on specified nights and search and destroy. Don't drop from your regular squadron
just get the Beaus together. To repeat a cliche.....it would be AWESOME.
Beaufort would be a great plane to have, gave sterling service throughout the war,Beaufreighters after that? :lol
Not another LW Hanger queen. :rolleyes: I'll park her up next to the B-25. But I'm sure the 11 people flying in EW will have a blast. :aok
for some reason I cant get the patch to load on my sig line?....obviously I'm technically challenged here...
Not another LW Hanger queen. :rolleyes: I'll park her up next to the B-25. But I'm sure the 11 people flying in EW will have a blast. :aokI doubt it will be a hanger queen. Although with AHII in its current format it couldn't be used to it's full potential with the 5" inch guns on cv's they would just get cut down. I would see it becoming a new town killer certainly a new vulch & HO monster & like a number of other vehicles in the game it most likely will be used for things in the game that it never would have done it's day. Also this plane would cover all arenas if we were to get a few variants, in the early war arena it would almost be a perked plane with 10 guns mounted on the front of it.
Dan,
When you scan in photos from books, there is a nifty piece of freeware that will clean them up. It'll remove the lines and graininess from scans. It's called Noiseware Standalone Edition. Get it here: http://www.imagenomic.com/download_nwsa.aspx (http://www.imagenomic.com/download_nwsa.aspx)
My regards,
Widewing
Gents
It's basically wishful thinking on the Beau. HTC has the info. Adding it to our inventory is at their discretion.
But as Always.....I'm opti.....opta......hopeful :lol
Kinda dramatic don't ya think? :)
Not to hijack this thread, but if that picture was taken today in Afghanistan it would be blown out of proportion and considered a war crime.
youre comparing apples to oranges my friend...that picture was taken during a world warHe said it was an apples to oranges comparison.
and we do bomb buildings in urban environments, are aim is alot better these days with lazers and what have you
now back on topic, that picture is AMAZING, very cool! :aok
If you go to
www.awm.gov.au
andl click on search the collections, input Beaufighter, you'll get 1300-odd hits, 1200 or so of which are photographs related to the Beau.
In action shots, posed shots, from the cockpit shots, crews, noseart, aircraft markings, the works.
Barney was killed flying a Spit 8 with 79 squadron RAAF in August 45.
Check this out... someone quoted a well known Spit8 historian.
http://brew.clients.ch/MB829-863.htm
I wonder when that well known historian will write his book, or at least visit the rest of us bozos in AH. :devil
The Italian liner turned block ship "Rex" under attack by 8 Beaufighters of 252 squadron at Treiste. 59 rockets and 4000 cannon rounds later it rolled over.You know I thought it was always BS when 110's strafed down a carrier in the game I might have to reconsider it based off those pictures.
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/Rex.jpg)
The 8 crews of 252 Squadron that did the deed.
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/RexKillers.jpg)
Encrypted?Yeah pass word to activate it each time you want to view it. Limited number of pages that can printed as well as no ability to forward cut paste & so on. One thing I did not know that it carried a drop tank.
Yeah pass word to activate it each time you want to view it. Limited number of pages that can printed as well as no ability to forward cut paste & so on. One thing I did not know that it carried a drop tank.
In my mind, substituting a B25 or A20 for a Beaufighter is more acceptable than subbing an A6M5 in place of a Ki43 or JU88 for a HE 111.Ju88 has never been subbed in for an He111. They served side by side. Yes, the He111 would be nice, but it is just another early war German bomber, like the Ju88.
Ju88 has never been subbed in for an He111.
The He111 will not be significantly easier to catch than the Ju88 as it is only slightly slower.
That problem is caused by bombers flying at full throttle whereas in reality they had to use cruise settings.
Can't take screenies?No to screenies.
There might be a manual in the www.naa.gov.au files.
DAP MK 21 was essentially a License built Mk X. A nice image of an X with rockets and a DTFirst picture I have seen of a Beau drop tank Thank you for that. Also per the manual no torpedo listed for the MK-21 yet I know I have read that it did carry torps in other articles? Also the they could use a third internal fuel tank if they took the 50 Cal's out of the wings. For the observer the rear bottom part of the plane just behind the bubble canopy was an escape hatch. I always wondered how they got out.
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/BeauDT.jpg)
First picture I have seen of a Beau drop tank Thank you for that. Also per the manual no torpedo listed for the MK-21 yet I know I have read that it did carry torps in other articles? Also the they could use a third internal fuel tank if they took the 50 Cal's out of the wings. For the observer the rear bottom part of the plane just behind the bubble canopy was an escape hatch. I always wondered how they got out.
I don't see the reason for adding it before other planes. I think other planes would be used more... both in scenarios and in the MA. Did it serve in every theater? Ya, it did, but so did the PBY Catalina (and there have got to be others). Being able to fill a void is, at least in my opinion, more important than serving in all theaters.
What would it really be used for? Low level attacks on shipping seems to be the most common response after reading this thread. This leads to the question of who is going to attack ships at low level?
In the MA's it's suicide unless the CV is undefended or you're fighting the barges. If someone wants to hunt down and attack derelict CV groups or AI controlled barges, I guess that's fine, I just see the population of players wanting to do that as very small. I guess it would be useful to take down towns in the EW arena.
In scenarios (granted, I haven't flown in a lot of scenarios), I don't see it getting much use either. Will it get 6 pilots per frame? 8? What convoys is it going to attack? Will it be used to attack CV groups? Will it attack ground targets? It's not going to be used as a nightfighter. Is it expected to survive when doing just over 300 mph on the deck?
I'm not saying not to add it, it definitely should be added. I just don't see why we need another twin-engined (early war) allied attack aircraft more than other planes. I still think German bombers, and Japanese and Russian planes of all types should be given priority until we have a more well-rounded selection of planes in the hangar.
Just my $0.02.
Lyric,No wonder I was wrong. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaufighter Beaufighter Mk 21
my info shows that the torpedo capability was deleted from the 21, i've never seen any reference to it, but I'll keep looking.
No wonder I was wrong. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaufighter Beaufighter Mk 21
The Australian-made DAP Beaufighter. Changes included Hercules CVII engines, a dihedral tailplane, four 20 mm in the nose, four Browning .50 in the wings and the capacity to carry eight five-inch High-Velocity Aircraft Rockets (HVAR), two 250 lb bombs, two 500 lb bombs and one Mk13 torpedo.
Dan....the picture you posted a few pages back got me laughing. The one with about 30 Beaus hitting a convoy.
Almost in the middle of the picture there is a lone Bomb LOLOLOLOL. The damned thing looks like it has a mind of its' own!
It appears higher then a lot of Beaus below it....looks like it is trying to figure which way it should go!
I think going in low and attacking flak ships was probably not a job that lead to a long life.Very true.
Whats the diff between Beaufighter & Bolingbroke?Playing only half the frame because you spent to much on beer??? Oh sorry I thought you said bowling broke. Sorry.
Whats the diff between Beaufighter & Bolingbroke?
The skinners would have good fun too with all the different paint schemes worn by the Beau in the ETO, MTO, PTO and CBINo shortage of colour that's for sure.
Well.......when the Beau arrives I will be parking the Jug for awhile.Count me in Hajo :aok
I have an idea. We in Aces High form a Beaufighter Squadron. Players from all sides welcomed.
We get together on specified nights and search and destroy. Don't drop from your regular squadron
just get the Beaus together. To repeat a cliche.....it would be AWESOME.
I think that the beaufighter should be added.
It was a very important aircraft in the war in Europe, and was also used much in the pacific campaign in the Royal Australian Air Force where it was nick named by the Japanese " Whispering Death"
here is some basic information on it :
First Flight: July 17, 1939
It was powered by 2 x bristol 1770 Horsepower Hercules XVII 14-cylinder air-cooled radials.
Armament: 4 x 20mm cannons and 6 x .303 MG's, Had 1 .303 dorsal gunner position. 1 x 1600lbs or 1 x 2127 lbs torpedo + 2 x 500lbs bombs and 8 x 3" rockets.
Max speed: 318 mph
Ceiling: 15,000 ft
range: 1470mph
climb rate: 5,000ft in 3 minutes 30 seconds
btw i didn't copy and paste any of this ;)
-KCTHUNDR ( Happy new year only 24 minutes :D)
Any time you start going backwards because of too many guns I say it cant be a bad thing. :rock
(http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/3b004c885d.jpg) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/)
You can use either a gif or png for transparency. Send me the file and I can do it for you.
M00t you called my bluff lol
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n268/Luke_831/Nuke80x80.png)
LOL wanting the "Washington' in the game are you? B29 on an RAF Roundel, For shame! :)
:mad:
flame him.
Make the pic in photoshop, in RGB mode. Flatten and unlock the layer (not named "background" with a padlock on it). Delete what you want transparent, so it's showing you the checkered "transparent" pattern. Save as .png.
No bruv, your beaufighter wouldn't get out of the hanger.
Kaz you need to crop the pic or something it looks half ass :aok :lol
I seriously can't be arse to crop my gif... :D
I'm a little upset that no one wants my said gif. :(
not better than a He-111 :noid
he-111 is merely 303 fodder for spit and hurri mk'1s. I look forward to when it does get added and the Allies might have half a chance of winning a BofB scenario. :tNo they won't. As long as bombers fly at full throttle and .303s are as weak as they are, then the Brits will always lose.
No they won't. As long as bombers fly at full throttle and .303s are as weak as they are, then the Brits will always lose.
Fighters spent almost all of their combat time at full throttle in reality. Bombers did not. That is a very asymmetrical comparison.
Right, in other words, they didn't climb to altitude and vector to intercept at full throttle. ;) That we do this in AH is a huge difference.
Anyone have any books or websites on the Beaufighter's service in the CBI?
The forgotten war seems more and more forgotten and every time I look something up about the CBI, there's always something new that I've never even heard of.
Dan do you have fire protection for your library? :)
Anyway looks like we missed this update. :(
Anyone have any books or websites on the Beaufighter's service in the CBI?Just a picture amongst many others.
The forgotten war seems more and more forgotten and every time I look something up about the CBI, there's always something new that I've never even heard of.
Did the Beaufighter have counter-rotating props???
No, neither did the Mossie
Would rather have the B-29, A26, Spit21...
I hope this thing can turn like a zero, because it's other stats just plain suck. Looks great though.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c2/Bristol_Type_156_Beaufighter_ExCC.jpg)
Had 1 .303 dorsal gunner position.
RAAF 93 SQUADRON.FTJR sent me a link of this very plane it still survives. The very first picture has the same tail art work & I believe it was the Co's aircraft so cool.
(http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/8c0e1a175d.jpg) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/)
(http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/bfdd280504.jpg) (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/)
Whats the story behind that one Lyric?No idea just a pic I found.
IIRC Early Beaufighters had lateral stability issues and the twin fin layout was one solution Bristol tried in order to to remedy it. In the end though they went with adding dihedral to the horizontal tail.Got to love the BBS always learn something new. I wonder what inspired this design then & it is not photo shopped either. Please excuse the minor hijack of the Beaufighter thread.
.where is it?
next update lads, I heard... :bolt:
What with the WWI? :rolleyes:
Correct me if i'm wrong but i read somewhere that they intended to release a game update before they added the WW1 arena.I must have missed that one. :headscratch:
I must have missed that one. :headscratch:
I must've missed it as well, sadly I think they're up to their armpits getting the WW1 stuff ready.
Bruv.........get that BOSS insignia back in your signature! :D
What other titles do you have regarding the Beau Dan?
If it's true, and the Beaufighter is put into AH before or with the WW1 add-on/update, it would be the FIRST plane I take to the air upon my reactivation. I think a little CV hunting would be in order. Granted, I'll be nothing but a black poof cloud over it, but the satisfaction of making an attack run on a destroyer would make it all the more worth it! :x The question is, would it be perked? If so, I'm stuck till I have the perks for it. :lol It would be an interesting sight to see, an A-20 in a dogfight with a Beaufighter.
It was a bit of a stupid question on my part. :o Meh. I'll ask them now and again. :lol
Beaufighter vs Mosquito, another line up to see. :x I'm kinda curious what the default skin on it would be. Would it have the torpedo option, or will it be denied it?
I don't see why they would not allow it to carry the torpedo. Yes, chances are people will still up a formation of 88's instead, but not EVERYONE would. There are times I will up a Kate just for the ell of it, plus it's fun. :aok
If you get a chance read through the thread here. There are different Beau variants. Only one carried the torp, and that was the Mk X better known as the Torbeau. The earlier VI was the first of the Beau's used for daylight fighter bomber work and could carry bombs. The Mk X could carry bombs, torps or rockets. Not all at one time obviously. The Aussies produced the Mk 21 which carried rockets and had 4 50 cals in the wings instead of the 6 303s carried on English built Beaus.Don't forget these little bundles of joy as well. :aok
If we ever get the Beau, and I got my wish, it would be the VI with no gun for the Nav, 4 20s and 6 303s, the Mk X with options for rockets, bombs, torps and gun for the Nav. 4 20s too. Most Mk Xs didn't carry the 6 303s as the space was used for fuel tanks instead. No formations though as it's not a bomber, but fighter bomber. You want to torp some ship, you gotta have friends to fly along :)
And if really lucky, the Mk 21 with 4 20s and 4 50s along with rockets for the Aussies.
I'd spend my time in a Beau Mk VI
Beaufighter Mk VIC "Torbeau"
Beaufighter Mk VI (ITF)
Beaufighter TF Mk X
Beaufighter Mk 21
These 4 are listed in wiki as a Torpedo Fighter. So I'm not so sure about the Mk X being the only one able to carry a torpedo. But I must digress as there are many a person here who has a few books on this plane, and I will likely get cut to shreds on this one. :noid :lol
I would have to agree though, you would do well to take friends along to torpedo a ship. :aok But sometimes, it's just you vs the world. :airplane:
And sometimes, I do that in a Kate. :D
I was told that only one, the Mk X, carried the torp; which is why I posted the 4 variants. At that time, i was a bit tired and likely just misread what he meant. I know little of it but would still like to see it in AH because I know enough about it, that it was used in anti-shipping and anti-U-Boat roles a lot.It will have it's place & most likely will find a roll that it never did in real life just like a number of other things in the game.
My question now is, how is it going to be flown in the MA's? Just another base/town killer? Will people actually up in numbers to take down a CV if one is spotted? I very rarely see missions aimed at taking down a CV, but it would be nice to see that as the first mission for the Beaufighter. Even without the torpedo, it will still put out a bit of damage plus it might be a bit more survivable vs doing a torpedo run. Somehow, I doubt that will be the first mission that the Beaufighter will be used in. More than likely, when it's added, the first thing people will do is mission horde a base with it. Still, will be a sight to see so many Beau's in the air.
<--- tapping foot and waiting almost patiently.twiddling thumbs
Are those 4 bombs centreline? Or is it 2 centre, 1 on each wing? Any colour photo's Dan?
You did note the Aussie flag on that first T Mk X with the bombs didn't you? :)
Now if we could just get our cartoon Beau and go pretend for a little bit :aok
Dan,
Im doing a search for the "Beaufighters in the Pacific" but this keeps turning up
Parnell, Neville
Whispering Death: History of the RAAF's Beaufighter Squadrons
Sydney: Reed, 1988
Is this the same book?
Yes Please.
It's the first edition. Beaufighters in the Pacific was his later effort. I haven't seen that version. I got my copy direct from Neville. I've got his e-mail around here somewhere if you want it. Nice guy to work with.
+1
I ordered a copy from him a few weeks later, it's a great book.
heres a site with a 21 and some other interesting Australian restorationsWell some personal pics I took of that Beau while back home in Melbourne at Moorabbin. This is only the Beau pics the others I might post some other place.
http://www.ausairpower.net/aarg.html
(http://www.ausairpower.net/Beaufighter-Mk.21-A8-328-1.jpg)
Thanks mate, I just love ww2 colour shots, just brings me a little bit closer to the time.Here are a few then.
I'm hoping for two models the Mk X and the XXI...well let's make it three the Mk VI also.I would like to see four models. I,V,X,XXI That would cover all the arenas quite well I think.
Do you think I'm being to picky?
I would like to see four models. I,V,X,XXI That would cover all the arenas quite well I think.
Would you agree that the VI and X would be the priorities as I do? The I didn't do much daylight work and the 21 is much the same as the X but Aussie produced and with the 4 50s instead of 303s. I'd like the 21 but the I is last on my list. Personally the VI is first as it was the fastest and more of a fighter then a bomber. The X did most of the hauling of ord. Just give me 4 20s and 6 303s and I'll be fine :)Will have to read up some more on the other MK'S VI for the V yeah if it is more of a fighter version I would trade the V for it.
Great pics btw. I figured you'd come through on the 21s :aok
Will have to read up some more on the other MK'S VI for the V yeah if it is more of a fighter version I would trade the V for it.
THink you got your numbers mixed up. the Beaufighter V was the prototype built with the turret. Only 2 built and the project abandoned. The VI was the main production version prior to the X. They were the two main day flying Beaus.Maybe I was thinking of the VIC then as I said I need to read up on the other Mks a bit more :)
It is truly amazing what an auto manufacturer can do. As I said before...Bristol was a carriage, then an automobile manufacturing company.
Great minds rule! I believe they have been absorbed by a British Aerospace Company. Could it be BAC? ;)
Didn't the pilots manual indicate aerobatic maneuvers were not allowed.
"Intentional" aerobatics and spinning. That doesn't mean they didn't do it
They're still making cars - all handbuilt. I want a Blenheim Speedster! I used to drive to work past their showroom in my Skoda. Dream on!!
http://www.bristolcars.co.uk/index2.htm
Sadly, a great aircraft which will never be modeled well because of the statistical data thats available. The ones I've flown on line had great climb and the guns were beyond belief.
Wow Phatzo, where does he live?this is the site I got the picture from. If your into that stuff its worth a look
Something that's brought up a few times in Parnell's book is that the 20mm didn't have any tracer ammo, anyone know why that was?
Per the book Queen of the midnight skies that is exactly the reason most night fighters had no tracers.
Soul,
I know alot of the nightfighters left out the tracers as it affected their nightvision!
Not saying thats why the Beaus didnt use tracers so dont quote me,but it seems like a logical reason.
:salute
Yes Lyric1 I know,the problem is Soulyss never stated the Beaus were NF or not.
I know reading about the Mossie NF's that the 303 muzzle flash caused the same problem,yet the location of the hispano's didnt.From the looks of the Beaus their 20mm's were locate undeneath much like the Mossie.
So I guess the question is,Soulyss were they nightfighters or daytime Beaus?
:salute
Sorry should have been more clear on that, these were not nightfighters. I'll have to go grab the book during a break today but I believe it was talking about 30 Squadron RAAF which was flying low level daytime raids in New Guinea. Another interesting things was on earlier models it seemed that the cannon were drum, not belt fed.
Sorry should have been more clear on that, these were not nightfighters. I'll have to go grab the book during a break today but I believe it was talking about 30 Squadron RAAF which was flying low level daytime raids in New Guinea. Another interesting things was on earlier models it seemed that the cannon were drum, not belt fed.
The Beaus had a speed advantage of at least 15 knots, but neither side scored any clear victories. Several of the Oscars appeared to suffer some damage, trailing smoke. One of the Beaufighters was a newer model, A19-73, and had a technical difference which the pilot was not familiar with. There were separate buttons for the cannons and machine guns and by failing to press the machine gun button, he had no tracer to see if his aim was true. Despite this he claimed several good cannon burts at an Oscar. With no hits on the Beaufighters, the enemy's marksmanship was considered worse.
What a KI-57 looks like from the back of a Beau.Interesting picture you have eight guys standing & running but none seem to have hit the dirt? I wonder what the Japanese were instructed to do in that circumstance of being strafed?
(http://i547.photobucket.com/albums/hh473/cactuskooler/JapTopsyMC-20onSelaroeStrip22July19.jpg)
I found a passage here in Parnell's book (Pg. 21).
Interesting picture you have eight guys standing & running but none seem to have hit the dirt? I wonder what the Japanese were instructed to do in that circumstance of being strafed?
Correct me if I am wrong...(usually) but if I recall correctly the Torbeau
was the MkX.
I happen to have an original Pilots manual for the MkX.
Pilot crossed out manuals airspeeds for certain maneuvers....he crossed
them out and replaced them in pencil. Kinda Cool. :D
Brothers and Sisters! It is not too late to stop the lemming rush to the cliff which is the wish for this useless aircraft!OK we need an emblem for the Fencer needs to take a step back club. :lol
Don't let the light bomber pilots who wish nothing more than 3 more cannon for their twin engined fetish while finally getting their Torpedos and sheep storage space! Nor those "Jug" pilots who wish to trade their great MGs for this gun package while adding yet another poorly designed radial engine in their continued lust for the heaviest and ugliest aircraft.
Step back from the edge, and join the STOP THE BEAUFIGHTER Insurgency before they take over a valuable plane slot with this terrible choice!
Thank You for your support.
Ken is just mad cause we aren't asking for the Merlin Mk II Beau, since it was such a disappointment :)
And if we get the 21s, Lyric will lead those carrying bombs.Ready.
Even two Diamonds cannot make a turd sparkle enough. ;)it can shine though
Image of the guys with the rockets..
Just ordered Beaufighters in the Night 417 Squadron.
Dan thank you for the EMail address....I've received a reply
from Australia.
Hajo, how long ago did you get his reply? I got one as well, but my latest emails have gone unanswered
Whew I bet the armourer on that Beau had HUGE arms....40 20mm Guppy? :D
All right, no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle. Even... and I want to make this absolutely clear... even if they do say, "Jehovah".
Phatzo, yes I got it, Im through 30 squadron's chapter, well into 31's chapter now. Very interesting stuff.
Dan, you always mention 30 squadron, I dont think I've ever seen you mention 31, could be wrong about that though, but from my reading 31 had a lot more action, your thoughts?
Everyone.. Fencer wears the sign of the devil in his signature.. Stone him ! :)
All right, no one is to stone anyone until I blow this whistle. Even... and I want to make this absolutely clear... even if they do say, "Jehovah".
30 got into the game first in New Guiniea, and had Joe Newman as one of it's pilots. He was the brother of Spit XII driver Barney Newman.
So I want 30 Squadron, Beaufighter VIF A19-132 for mine in AH should the day come. That's the one Joe Newman was lost in. Haven't nailed down the individual aircraft letter yet but working on it
stone him, stone him.
Ooh He said "Jehovah" !
Ooh He said "Jehovah" !
Well you guys are truly scrooged now. Raptor has eliminated this worthless piece of aluminum from the "aircraft poll". We know that what he is doing will be the final say in all things aircraft. :neener: :cheers:
Time to start another lost cause. :old: Maybe you can start asking for it on a new "aircraft pole" which would make it about as useful as it ever was back in the day.
Even if Raptor was HTC incarnate, and we end up with something else, it doesn't mean we have Lost. ! It will be just one of many battles, we will overcome !
I must be losing my mind.
I shot down a triad of low twins this w/e as they were making a low torpedo (never saw any fish or bombs released) run on my CV. I should say, "the ack and I shot down", but whatevah.
Back to the point, I only got two quick passes in but they looked to me like a set of Boofs. I figured there was a beta out there. They were probably just Bostons or A20's in some sort of invasion stripe with tan camo livery...
The strangest part: I recall no icon. It was lw MA Blue.
Just cause it's pretty and I can't find any enthusiasm for WWI Aussie Beau Mk 21
quote]
No argument here - on either point. I think WWI is destined to be the tired toy discarded in the corner - once everyone's gone there and had a few minutes mindless dalliance.
OTOH, the tire rumble and squeak is truly enjoyable. Thanks, HT, for that.
As for the Beau, I can't help but feel the dude sitting under the dorsal blister probably spends a lot of time thumbwrestling with cyclops.
Just cause it's pretty and I can't find any enthusiasm for WWI Aussie Beau Mk 21
quote]
As for the Beau, I can't help but feel the dude sitting under the dorsal blister probably spends a lot of time thumbwrestling with cyclops.
Took me a nano second to decipher that, lol. I guess its a fairly boring task away from the front line, considering the amount of accidents they had, it would be a pretty dangerous task as well.
Sorry, existing plane remodel. :noid I'm all for a Beaufighter though.
:banana::rock
I've read a lot of accounts of Mossie squadrons doing that too. Of course, in many cases they are the same crews we're talking about, and even when that isn't true, the missions were often the same.
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/Czech20052.jpg)
thats in suspiciously good condition, is it being restored to airworthy?
thats in suspiciously good condition, is it being restored to airworthy?
(http://www.gosfordhobbies.com.au/shop/images/P/LGE%20LGE-05.jpg)they are more powerful than that
thats in suspiciously good condition, is it being restored to airworthy?Static I think.
Mission Impossible IV - "Raid On Dayton"Ahh another former RAAF bird at the museum repainted for the American consumer. :)
(http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/061019-f-1234b-001.jpg)
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/umpCA4LLC8B-3.jpg):rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
You are getting old, I sent you a link to that pic months ago. Told you that you needed to road trip down and see it. Such a completely worthless aircraft in amongst the finest in American Aviation is worth at least 30 secs as you walk past to the B-24. :D Besides the P-47D and P-38 are right on around to the left. As well as a Fw-190D and Bf-109G... Oh and god's (and North American Aviation's) gift to combat aircraft the P-51D. They even got a really cool A6M2 there which is right across from that twin engined thingee in the pic.. http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/090303-F-1234S-004.jpg
Because your eyesight is going, here is the link to it so you can get it full sized.
http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/061019-f-1234b-001.jpg
Oh and here is the gallery before they ruined it with substandard aircraft.
http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/050209-F-1234P-055.jpg
(http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/050209-F-1234P-055.jpg)
Oughta have a "find the plane" contest with this picture.. anyone see the Fw-190?
When was that last picture taken? I seem to remember a Niki beside the tail of the B-29 when we went last yearIt is an old view from over head floor plan has been changed quite a bit.
Static I think.
It is an old view from over head floor plan has been changed quite a bit.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3442/3988369944_b9d77608cd.jpg)
ok thats the Duxford beau, as Guppy said it will be airworthy at some point :rock but its a long resto, details here:
http://fighter-collection.com/pages/aircraft/beaufighter/index.php (http://fighter-collection.com/pages/aircraft/beaufighter/index.php)
Anyone find the Fw-190 yet?Yes it is right here when I took it's picture a few weeks back.
How resilient do you think the radials would be against the field ack in AH? In the mossie, it just has to go within visual range of the field and the radiator will be hit.
How resilient do you think the radials would be against the field ack in AH? In the mossie, it just has to go within visual range of the field and the radiator will be hit.
Dunno about the accuracy of their assessments there, Dan. I've a photo of a Mossie 6 that had the cannons ripped from the aircraft when it collided with the mast of a U-Boat. It did bring the German naval ensign back though. It not all that unusual for Mossies to bring back souvenirs from sorties over the continent, most often vegetation, but sometimes man made things too.
As for the engines, well, like all radials they lack the radiators that the Mosquito's Merlins require, so pretty much think of a Spitfire compared to an F4U when comparing the Mossie to the Beaufighter, as far as the engines are concerned.
Ahh no fair actually going there and looking. :P
You really are a junkie :)
There's one called "No Hero, Just A Survivor" by a gent who was on Beaus in the Eastern Med, followed by Mossies in India and Burma. Might be worth a look, especially as it has a Mosquito on the cover!
Good 404 Sqn stuff here: http://www.404squadron.com/index.html
Excellent 211 Sqn stuff here: http://users.cyberone.com.au/clardo/
Both units ended up on the Mossie in the last throes of their war, hence my interest.
Apparently this is Beaufighter guncam film:
http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=52540
I believe the big jobbie coming under fire is a Cant Z.506, though it looks to have German markings.
Yeah, sometimes I find myself watching the trees more than the target. "Dude, pull up! Uh, dude ... Dude! Pull UP!"
There's quite a lot of guncam stuff there. I've even seen one which sadly depicts a fatal friendly-fire attack on a Mossie.
Apparently this is Beaufighter guncam film:
http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=52540
I believe the big jobbie coming under fire is a Cant Z.506, though it looks to have German markings.
Where the hell is the Beaufighter? :bolt:
would love to see the beaufighter but ONLY after the update the mossi :rock
There's some more old films here:
http://resources.ushmm.org/film/search/index.php
There's some pretty grim stuff there (Holocaust Museum) however there are also a lot of colour films from the USAAF, VE day in the UK, etc.
There's also one extraordinary clip, apparently shot by Anthony Fokker himself, of Jasta 1 pilots and aircraft in WWI (naturally, Goering is the interest for the museum). DVIIs, a DVIII, Voss and his triplane, even what looks like a captured Spad.
Search on Richthofen.
+1 :aok Beaufighter.......please
Where the hell is the Beaufighter? :bolt:
would love to see the beaufighter but ONLY after the update the mossi :rockwell
No more pilot wounds from a shot to the cockpit. 20mm hit dead center. Dust and glass splinters inside but no one hurt.
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/BeauFlakhit.jpg)
Bring on the Beau! And bring on supply convoys with freighters and flak ships, not just barges.
i bet that pilot needed a change of pants after that flight :OI don't think so actually. By the time you can process what just happened, it is also clear that you're just fine, so the danger is past.
-Crashed after attempted take off by two unqualified airmen who had escaped from the guardroom.
Ive said this before in another thread but Ill say it again in cased you missed it,Ive met pilots who flew the beaufighter and the mossie and most of em preferd the beaufighter the main reasons being far easier to take off and land,generally very docile to fly but responsive when you needed it,all said they felt very secure and "safe" in it.
A very definite YES to the beaufighter from me.
I wonder what the rudder authority is like on this pig? I couldn't help but wonder, looking at that photo.
Otherwise, +1 on the scow. It should make a fun target, though shooting it down, much like shagging a WHALE, will only count like half a notch.
I think that the beaufighter should be added.
It was a very important aircraft in the war in Europe, and was also used much in the pacific campaign in the Royal Australian Air Force where it was nick named by the Japanese " Whispering Death"
here is some basic information on it :
First Flight: July 17, 1939
It was powered by 2 x bristol 1770 Horsepower Hercules XVII 14-cylinder air-cooled radials.
Armament: 4 x 20mm cannons and 6 x .303 MG's, Had 1 .303 dorsal gunner position. 1 x 1600lbs or 1 x 2127 lbs torpedo + 2 x 500lbs bombs and 8 x 3" rockets.
Max speed: 318 mph
Ceiling: 15,000 ft
range: 1470mph
climb rate: 5,000ft in 3 minutes 30 seconds
btw i didn't copy and paste any of this ;)
-KCTHUNDR ( Happy new year only 24 minutes :D)
-Swung on take off, overcorrected, ran off runway into sand, still attempted take off and hit windsockthe Beau definately has a place in AHII
Hit hill while circling the airfield. Pilot was probably watching another aircraft burning on the ground
Crashed due to pilot being blinded by search light beams
my favorite :furious
Beau is schweet but 410 is still schweeter!
http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=180322
:D
-C+
ChukW posts on the Hyperscale forums as well. His model building skills are second to none. I've been following his 410 build. He did a Helldiver prior to that. I wish I had that kind of patience :)
As for the 410, I do believe it would outperform the Beau as it was a later entry into the airwar. The 410 would be more of the Mossie's competition. That being said, the Beau has more roles and did more things during WW2 then the 410 could ever have imagined and for a much longer time :)
The Beau and the Ju88 probably followed a more similar path and seemed to run into each other most often in similar roles.
Allow me to hijack then - what about those late-war 88's, in that case?
For example, what about the Ju88G-1? It's got great armament and doesn't give up all that much top end with its 1700 hp Jumos. I'll take the Schragemusik option, por favor, and sidle up under those pesky 17s and 24s...
General characteristics
Crew: 3
Length: 15.50 m (without radar) (50.85 ft)
Wingspan: 20.08 m (65.88 ft)
Height: 5.07 m (16.63 ft)
Wing area: 54.7 m²[citation needed] (587 ft²)
Empty weight: 9,081 kg[47] (20,020 lb)
Loaded weight: 13,100 kg (28,880 lb)
Max takeoff weight: 14,690 kg[47] (32,385 lb) (overload)
Powerplant: 2× BMW 801G-2 double-row radials, 1,250 kW (1,700 PS, 1,677 hp) each
Performance
Maximum speed: 550 km/h (342 mph) at 8,500 m (27,890 ft)
Range: 2,500 km (1,553 mi)
Service ceiling: 9,900 m (32,480 ft)
Wing loading: 240 kg/m² (49.2 lb/ft²)
Power/mass: 0.18 kW/kg (0.12 hp/lb)
Endurance: 4 hours[47]
Armament
Guns:
4 × 20 mm MG 151/20 cannons, firing forwards.
1 or 2 × 13 mm (.51 in) MG 131 machine guns in the rear cockpit, firing rearwards.
1 or 2 × 20 mm MG 151/20s as Schräge Musik, firing forwards and upwards at an 30-45 degree angle, Optional.
Come on, you know you want it! :)
Apparently the torp for the Torbeau was modified to be dropped between 250 and 300 knots. That might make a run in on a task group a bit more interesting.
So out of curiosity, how would the Beau hold up against some 109s or Spits? I know its rugged, but is it maneuverable?Not sure but I would guess not well.
So out of curiosity, how would the Beau hold up against some 109s or Spits? I know its rugged, but is it maneuverable?
Based on performance parameters, I'd be willing to bet the AH Mossi and both 110's would fair better in fighter mode than the Beaufighter.
A new NOE monster is LURKING & awaiting all unsuspecting towns. Furballers beware. Cue JAWS them.
great pic lyric, where did you pull that from?I purchased two DVD's from back home.
Dan,you mention the verticle fillet afew posts back and I started looking closer at the different marks.
Could you give me the short version of when the changes were made,oh and when the dihedral was added to the tail?
:salute
the X could be skinned as a Mk 21 if needed.Frankly if they don't get the DAP 21 with its butt ugly nose. I don't want any 21 skins on any other frame.
Frankly if they don't get the DAP 21 with its butt ugly nose. I don't want any 21 skins on any other frame.
Yeah, sometimes I find myself watching the trees more than the target. "Dude, pull up! Uh, dude ... Dude! Pull UP!"I was hoping he'd dip into that little clearing.
No more pilot wounds from a shot to the cockpit. 20mm hit dead center. Dust and glass splinters inside but no one hurt.That's impressive..
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/BeauFlakhit.jpg)
bring on the Beau! :cheers:
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/BeaufighterGreece.jpg)
more beau pics please! :aokI'll be replacing mine at the end of BoG
forgot to replace my BOSS icon after the world cup last summer. fixed :)
this model should be the pickNo torpedoes on the DAP MK-21.
Beaufighter Mk 21
The Australian-made DAP Beaufighter. Changes included Hercules CVII engines, four 20 mm cannon in the nose, four Browning .50 in (12.7 mm) in the wings and the capacity to carry eight 5 in (130 mm) High-Velocity Aircraft Rockets (HVAR), two 250 lb (110 kg) bombs, two 500 lb (230 kg) bombs and one Mk 13 torpedo
Good pick! For this new Road to Rangoon scenario,they should add the Beaufighter with a RAF and RAAF paint scheme. I hope The Hitech crew reads it!
I like turtles
S.........A.............F.......E....T......Y......DANCE!:bhead
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7movKfyTBII
S.........A.............F.......E....T......Y......DANCE!
R
As in how matuRe of you :rolleyes:
:cool:
G
It's about time. They let that one in Canada sit outside rotting for a long time. Hope they do up in 404 Squadron markings since those RCAF boys did some serious Beau flying.
Hmm, nevermind.
:lol
You fly through a wave Guppy ?
Ooops..guess I bumped this.
Forget it. I posted two flight manuals, sent drawings to HTC of the Beau....couple years ago I believe.
We get the B29 instead. Got the info from the NASM and found an original flight manual to two models the XX and the torbeau (X).
Dunno what happened. I rarely play now other things to do. But the plane that flew in ALL theaters of the War should be in game methinks.
Just my opinion.
HTC's always done the right thing in the past.
(bats eyes at HT, smiles sweetly)
Anyone willing to buy him some Craggenmore?Right , lets setup a site dedicated to the Beaufighter inclusion.
Right , lets setup a site dedicated to the Beaufighter inclusion.
Focus on fundraising for the purpose of supplying Craggenmore in a steady stream to the HTC office.
Man, looking at just those two images makes me really, really want such a document for the Mossie VI.
Cause who doesn't love cutaways?
(http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/leecoll/BrigandCutaway001.jpg)
Interestingly enough, I found this today when looking for something else:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_MXu96taKq-Y/S7i8_EE5bHI/AAAAAAAAJlk/oGv9vEVXMU0/s1600/16.jpg
Looks familiar, no?
because I derped.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/leecoll/BrigandCutaway001.jpg)
Also, this is the 667th post on this thread. :noid
+1 :aok :aok :aok
IMHO, the Beaufighter, Pe-2 and He111 are the three aircraft with the most historical impact absent from planeset.
+1 :aok :aok :aokWellington as well.
IMHO, the Beaufighter, Pe-2 and He111 are the three aircraft with the most historical impact absent from planeset.
Wellington as well.+1
There she stood, sturdy, powerful, fearsome
[....]
lovingly read and re-typed (so please excuse the typos) from 'Voices from the War in the Air' published by Vintage books.
absolutely possible that I missed one of your posts, appologies in advance if I did :)
Oh, charming. Glad to know you have a high regard for my character. :D
Just curious, what would be some good sources on reading up on the Beaufighter?
Collected over time, with a lot of it spent on www.abebooks.com trying not to spend too much :)
I have Bob Brahm's book "Nightfighter, and C.F. Rawnsley's book "Nightfighter" about his time flying Beaus with Cunningham, but I've tried to keep it to the daylight guys as they'd apply most to AH. If I was going to start someone down the Beaufighter path, I'd start them with "Beaufighters in the Pacific" by Parnell. It's my absolute favorite of all of them. "Strike and Strike again" is second as it covers the Norway runs.
Beaufighter Bibliography
General Beaufighter history:
“Beaufighters in the Pacific”-Neville Parnell.
(A complete history of all Aussie Beaufighter Squadrons, aircraft and ops in the Pacific)
“The Armed Rovers”-Roy Nesbit
(Beaufighter and Beaufort Operations over the Mediterranean)
“Beaufighter Aces of World War II”-Andy Thomas
(Osprey series book covering Beau Aces)
“Beaufighter Squadrons in Focus”-Simon Parry
(Photo album of the units that went to war in the Beau)
“The Bristol Beaufighter-A Comprehensive Guide for the Modeler”-Richard Franks
(Covers all the models available, good profiles, photos, surviving Beaus etc)
Squadron Histories:
“Beaufighters over Burma-Number 27 Squadron RAF 1942-45”-David Innes
(CBI flown Beaufighters)
Beaufighters over New Guinea-No 30 Squadron RAAF 1942-43” George Turnbull Dick
(Aussie Beaufighters)
“Silently into the Midst of Things-177 Squadron RAF in Burma 1943-45”-Atholl Brown
(CBI Beaufighters)
“Beaufighters in the Night-417 Night Fighter Squadron USAAF”-Braxton Eisel
(MTO USAAF Beaufighters)
“Strike and Strike Again-455 Squadron RAAF 1944-45”
(ETO Beaufighters flown by Aussies as part of the Dalachy Wing)
“Gentlemen in Blue-600 Squadron RAF”-Hans Onderwater
(RAF Beaufighters ETO/MTO 1940-45)
Pilot/Navigator Memoirs:
“Touched by War-Memories of a Beaufighter Pilot” Raynor Barber
(30 Squadron RAAF-1944-45 PTO)
“Search and Destroy”-Willam Mann
(31 Squadron RAAF 1943-44. Mann was Squadron Commander)
“Whispering Death-My Wartime Adventures”-Lee Heide
(Beauforts and Beaufighters in the MTO with 39 and 603 Squadrons)
Please don't spam it. Add something or stay put.
Yea you too. please add something or stay out.
Id like the Beaufighter, how many times do folks have to say it. go mess with someone elses wishes Mr. Grinch.
(http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt118/phatzo/torbaue.jpg)
Is the black nosecone there cause it's a night fighter? Forgive me if the answer is obvious, very tired right now.
The nose cone actually would have been painted the same as the fuselage but it does cover a different type rader used later in the war. Also seen on Mossies. Referred to as a "Thimble" nose.damn instructions told me to paint it gloss black.
+1 :aokYou got a +1 from Bruv119. Thats like getting a high-five from the Queen of England. :banana:
-1. It looks fat&ugly. Prob like half the people who'd be flying it. :neener:
-flame suit on- :angel:
If anyone could tell me what were the main variants used? That would be great.
Night Fighter Mk Ic - 397 total MkiC production by BristolDon't forget the big boy on the block.
Night Fighter Mk II - production 597
Mk VIF - Ground Attack/Night Fighter - 879 Bristol (second company can't read) 150
Mk VIc - Maritime Strike Fighter - 596 built? Fairey built 175
TF Mk X - Strike Fighter/Torpedo bomber - 2,265 (majority built by Bristol)
F Mk XIc - Maritime Strike Fighter - 163 built
Now this is just one source tells me, I know there were over 5,000 built so these numbers are off slightly, also I can barely read the manual on the production models (these numbers don't include prototypes, or varients) also some were used as Tow targets (actually quite a few)
410 vs. Beau MkX - with the Beau flown by Ditka and the 410 flown by Walter Payton. Payton's got Doug Plank gunning and Ditka's got mini-Ditka as the GIB. Who wins?
No...you cannot put Ditka in a matchup like dis cuz Walter, as sweet as he was, was not up to the challenge....remember, Ditka IS GOD, and therefore could fly a donkey cart and fly circles around even Bruv....Ditka wins hands down.:rofl :rofl :rofl :aok :ahand
Another question, would the Beaufort also be at all useful in this game?Nice scenario aircraft & early war. It would not bring a lot to the game though.
No to the Beau's. Why? Because I wanted to say no since everyone is saying yes. :D
In seriousness, a major +1 for the Beau's. The only problem I'm going to have with it is that there will be no merchant ships, oil tankers, troop transports, freighters, submarines and various other juicy targets to hit with it. :cry
So... Is it 'Bow'fighter or 'Be-yoo'fighter?bow fighter.
bow fighter.
how much use would it even see in AH?
Be a bit ironic if it got this big of a fanbase, only to become a hanger queen within a few months.
This is only a game to you.wow, i love how you assume that this is ONLY a game to me.
To others, this is history at their fingertips.
Use that pathetic little brain of yours, or even scroll through the wealth of knowledge this
50 page thread has.
how much use would it even see in AH?As it stands now with the game the Beaufighter won't have it's traditional targets. That aside with this game many things we do have are used for other things than what they were meant for.
Be a bit ironic if it got this big of a fanbase, only to become a hanger queen within a few months.
Tyrannis has been here for over 7 years...simply astonishing when you think about it :rofl
So did anyone count how many posts it took BAR321 to get his M-18?...... :D
The Beaufighter has its own unique little niche as far as the MA is concerned, it is a fighter bomber that can carry a torpedo. Torpedo bombing is suicidal in AH but I like to try it every now and again, the four Hispanos would give it that little extra appeal over 88s or a TBM.
You could even run "Banff Strike Wing" missions to attack CVs. Beaufighters escorted by Mustangs use their rockets to take out some of the fleet's AA before dropping down to the deck to launch torpedoes. It is never going to be the most efficient way to take out a CV while level bombers have such ridiculously high accuracy in AH, but it ought to be fun and would be a more historically accurate way of doing it.
So did anyone count how many posts it took BAR321 to get his M-18?...... :D
Beau. to round 2 needs to make it to round 3.......
:aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok :aok
Sheeple will vote for the latest greatest speed and guns...or maybe there are just more fans of the meteor than there are for the beau. :huh
Only a handfull of folks actually interested in the historical part of the game will vote for early birds.
The beau is off so I'll vote who cares for the leftovers.
I would rather have the meteor than the beau :)you would...squeek!!!
you would...squeek!!!Translation: :cry"Im not getting what i wanted!"
anything but that p.o.s. jet would be better everyone but, the zoomtards are probably going to get their wish. if you voted "don't care", may as well have gone ahead and voted for the metor.
I've had a lot of "MA" fun over the years flying the A6M3, P-39, P-40, B-25, and G4M. People who say they are just for scenarios have a pretty limited view of what can be done in the MA.Missed the point.
Missed the point.
They were put in with scenario's being their main focus.
(Except possably the p39/b25. which could of been put in to fill the EW planeset)
Missed the point.
They were put in with scenario's being their main focus.
(Except possably the p39/b25. which could of been put in to fill the EW planeset)
tyrannis, you're so clueless being clueless would be a step up.
I do believe that's giving him too much credit.
..or maybe there are just more fans of the meteor than there are for the beau. :huh
Fills no gaps at all. Nothing for the game at all. Was not used to shoot anything but buzzbombs. It was used even less than the 10 TA 152s that saw action.It destroyed 46 or 48 German aircraft on the ground. I'd say that was significantly more than the Ta152 was used.
Fills no gaps at all. Nothing for the game at all. Was not used to shoot anything but buzzbombs. It was used even less than the 10 TA 152s that saw action.
59 152s.
59 152s.
Produced or saw combat?
10 saw limited action
Produced and saw combat. 15-20 most to see combat at one time. People like to quote only ten because it fits their needs yet it is not the truth.
Their was many more in production than just 59 but the main assembly factory was captured.
Oh and tyrannis is correct once the new has worn off beaufighter will see limited use. The truth hurts sometimes which is why you attack him. You can say whatever about people not using it but it will be a novelty other than for events.
And your source is? I've got a lot of sources and they seem to indicate a little over 40 were delivered to JG-301. I think it's safe to say that no one really knows the exact numbers but they were small.
In terms of the 'truth' about the Beau in AH, we'll apparently not find out. How you can claim to know the truth without any evidence is amazing to say the least. I'm glad we have you around to point it out though :aok
How did this turn into a discussion on the 152?DAP MK-21 Target towing aircraft post WWII.
Let's put this back on tracks.
(http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/album/watermark.php?file=4905&size=1)
Any history on this skin?
it seems to be missing its rudder :headscratch:
it seems to be missing its rudder :headscratch:
it seems to be missing its rudder :headscratch:
yes it does :uhoh
I was going to post that too
If we get the DAP Mark 21 then I want this skin!Post war & a target towing aircraft.
(http://www.luchtoorlog.be/img/beau/ss153_26%20cam9.jpg)
It's there. You're seeing the noise on the photo and it's making the rudder blend in with the background etc.
Post war & a target towing aircraft.
Most DAP 21's were all dark green that flew combat. A few exceptions though & very rare all white aircraft & bare metal.
The same could easily be said about the He-111. While I don't like the idea TOO much, I am willing to bet we will see the Beau before we see the Heinkel. Wouldn't hurt me really. Always fun to have a new toy to litter the landscape with. :aok I just hope there are shipping type targets to hit with her by then. :x
Most likely not, Beaufighter was recently voted on and lost, It's going to be some time before it comes up again, I would guess the He-111 would be voted on sooner or later, however there's some other competition out there, russian bombers etc.
The same could easily be said about the He-111. While I don't like the idea TOO much, I am willing to bet we will see the Beau before we see the Heinkel. Wouldn't hurt me really. Always fun to have a new toy to litter the landscape with. :aok I just hope there are shipping type targets to hit with her by then. :x
I think that the beaufighter should be added.+1
It was a very important aircraft in the war in Europe, and was also used much in the pacific campaign in the Royal Australian Air Force where it was nick named by the Japanese " Whispering Death"
here is some basic information on it :
First Flight: July 17, 1939
It was powered by 2 x bristol 1770 Horsepower Hercules XVII 14-cylinder air-cooled radials.
Armament: 4 x 20mm cannons and 6 x .303 MG's, Had 1 .303 dorsal gunner position. 1 x 1600lbs or 1 x 2127 lbs torpedo + 2 x 500lbs bombs and 8 x 3" rockets.
Max speed: 318 mph
Ceiling: 15,000 ft
range: 1470mph
climb rate: 5,000ft in 3 minutes 30 seconds
btw i didn't copy and paste any of this ;)
-KCTHUNDR ( Happy new year only 24 minutes :D)
anyone got specs on the Beau's torps? I only found one source which gives alt/speed limits for releasing them, but I dont believe it.
...2000 feet, 180 knots was found to work, also 1000 feet 350 mph was proven to work.
You must be referring to the essentially dive bombing torpedo bird. It was set up for a fast dive from alt then drop, but wasn't used that way in practice. 2000 feet, 180 knots was found to work, also 1000 feet 350 mph was proven to work. There was a special breakaway fin on the torpedo that got it into the water at the right angle.
In practice with the strike wings Torbeaus dropped at about 175 feet and 210 mph.
I don't think any EW or MW birds have a chance to win a vote if there is a LW capable aircraft in the vote. Not sure where Beau qualifies but due to good armament it should do good, unless there is Meteor in the vote........or 2 birds per release, one of each, I could live with that.
Maybe HTC should have two branches of development:
Branch A, voted birds (B29s Me410 etc, mostly LW stuff)
Branch B, historically significant birds that do not hold that much glamour in terms of performance or armament but are essential to have in scenarios (He111, Lagg-3 Mig-3, Vickers Wellington etc) that will be added to game without vote but with some kind of relevance to scenario schedule.
Maybe they could be added in turns: voted bird, scenario bird, voted bird, scenario etc etc.
-C+
Me410 won and it is a mid-war aircraft.
Two words(ish), Henshel 129The Hs129 does not compare favorably with the Beaufighter, not in performance, significance, numbers or anything other than anti-GV work. The Hs129 should be compared to the Il-2, Il-10 and Ju87G-2.
The introduction of the Storch was linked to reduction of GV icon ranges from the air. All other aircraft have trouble spotting GVs now, unless they are close enough to receive return fire from flaks. The Storch can see GVs icons much further away than other aircraft and direct friendly aircraft and GVs to them. It can also up from all bases, not just airfields.
The niche role that the Beaufighter would fill in the MA is a heavy fighter that could carry a torpedo. However given that torpedo bombing is suicide against prox fused AA it probably would not see much use in that role. Otherwise its just a slower but tougher Mossie really. Scenario wise its definitely needed though.
I've been reading about Malta and the exploits of a certain Adrian Warburton.
He flew a reconnaissance Beau at points but did most of his work in a Maryland? Now this pilot just added to my respect for the Beau.
Warburton was best known for his Spit recce flights. he used to tangle with Spit fighters and could always twist them in circles. He was killed in the crash of a recce P38 later in the war. Seems like they just found the crash site a few years back and recovered his remains.
STOP PUNTING THE DAMN THREAD!
10- Do not punt topics. Punting would be making a non-substantive post for the express purpose of bring the thread to the top of the thread list.
While it hasn't flown in all theater's of the war, the same could be said about the He-111. :D
American Spitfires? If those count. And all those French/British planes in WWI too. :aok
Nose heavy can't really be bad in a dogfight..It can... I had troubles with P-51s and other American planed being nose-heavy and it causes decreased vertical performance e.g it will not take much of pull before the plane stalls and buffers.
Did I hear somebody ask for something to escort in my Mossie?We could have super-cool Coastal command raids. Who needs X-wings and Y-wings flying in the trench of the death-star, when you can have Mosquitoes and Beaufighters in a Fjord?
We could have super-cool Coastal command raids. Who needs X-wings and Y-wings flying in the trench of the death-star, when you can have Mosquitoes and Beaufighters in a Fjord?
Screw George Lucas and Give me the real thing!
We could have super-cool Coastal command raids. Who needs X-wings and Y-wings flying in the trench of the death-star, when you can have Mosquitoes and Beaufighters in a Fjord?:aok
Screw George Lucas and Give me the real thing!
633?! I am talking about the real deal!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj_Q280Gpz4
Jump to 02:10 if you can't wait.
633 is an unforgivable movie. The SOBs burned real mosquitoes for this movie, to death! oh the humanity! :cry
To be fair most of the Mossies used in the film were destined for the scrap heap anyway. The film probably saved a couple for posterity.It's like experiments on animals. It is for the greater good, but it does make the hairs on my back stand looking at the poor monkey in the cage, about to give his life for science.
Duxford museum has been working on getting a Beaufighter flying. A few years ago i heard they were having trouble sourcing suitable Hercules engines for it. Post war Hercules engines are relatively common but have cooling fans and exhausts that sweep back behind the engine like the BMW engine in the FW 190A. The Beaufighter had its exhausts meeting in a collector ring on the leading edge of the cowling. Not as good aerodynamically, but it did also act as a de icer. Not sure what progress has been made since then.
As a kid making plastic models I always wondered why the exhaust on british radials faced forward.You mean the airintake on the top of the radial right?
this is a goodun too, 3D model of the hercules :aok
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vrvep_YOio (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vrvep_YOio)
inebriation.lol, you made me look this word up.
In 1948 IAF agents in Britain purchased 6 Beaufighters from a company which had bought these from RAF stocks. The aircraft had not been taken care of for some time and were devoid of their essential avionics, navigation gear and guns, and an extensive overall was required. By the time the Beaufighters were ready to leave Britain for Israel, the British government had become aware of Israeli attempts to acquire weapons locally. As an arms embargo had been imposed on the opposing sides in the Israeli War of Independence, the Beaufighters were to be smuggled out of Britain. Under the pretext of participating in the shooting of a WWII film, 4 Beaufighters (one had crashed while another had been canibalized for spares) took off in front of the director, the cameras and the filming "crew" - and never returned. By the time the British authorities had come to, the aircraft were somewhere over the Mediterranean, on their way to Israel. From Britain the Beaufighters flew to Corsica and on to an airfield the Yugoslav government had allowed the IAF to operate from. On August 1st 1948 the aircraft arrived at Ramat David air base where they joined the 103rd bomber and transport squadron. The aircraft formed the squadron's 'B' flight, lead by Leonard Fitchett, a Canadian volunteer.
On the morning of October 19th, D.171 was sent to assist the Israeli Navy in battles against Egyptian naval vessels when it encountered an Egyptian Hawker Fury flown by Abd Al-Hamid Abu Zayd, commander of Egypt's 2nd squadron. Aware that the Beaufighter stood little chance in a dogfight, the pilot, Len Fitchett, jettisoned his bombload and put his bomber into a dive low over the water. Followed by the Egyptian, Fitchett abruptly pulled up, just in time to see the Fury crash into the sea.
lol, you made me look this word up.
I agree. What was the engineer that designed that smoking? I want some of that stuff!
Beaufighter would be a poor mans 410..Well, probably more agile and definitely tougher. Slower too.
I'd still vote for it, served its time and did quite well on all fronts.
Besides Australia needs a fighter :D
Beaufighter would be a poor mans 410..The Beau unlike the 410 will be enabled in all arenas. Very useful in many scenarios, much more than the 410.
I'd still vote for it, served its time and did quite well on all fronts.
Besides Australia needs a fighter :D
Hmmm..visibility out of the cockpit looks like poo. I wonder if they added F3 (to represent the observer), if that would make this thing even more used. Or just disable firing while in F3.Rear visibility sure, but forward visibility looks perhaps better than anything currently in AH.
My 2 cents.
Well, probably more agile and definitely tougher. Slower too.
Beaufighter would be a poor mans 410..
I'd still vote for it, served its time and did quite well on all fronts.
Besides Australia needs a fighter :D
The Beaufighter is more balanced plane than the POS 410 that this Community begged for. Definitely more agile than the anemic 410. It also would have filled a much needed gap sooner, than the 410.
Problem was look at the choices - Meteor? Yak? Me-410?
Personally was hoping the Beaufighter/410 were in the last rounds but it simply didn't get enough votes.
I actually figured the Meteor was going to win, after all ZOMG!! JET!!! Considering the B-29 was voted in over other aircrafts like the He-111, I assumed the meteor was going to win simply because it was a jet.
The fact the 410 won, speaks volumes for those who voted for it, without doing even the slightest bit of research. The Yak or Meteor would not be hangar queens like the 410.
No one asking for the Beau expects it to be an air to air bird. What it would be is a really nice multi-role attack bird that can defend itself. 4 20s in the fuselage to get the flak gunners down and a torp would make it a more viable anti-shipping bird then most we have now if not all. As a special events fan I see all kinds of uses in any number of scenarios from the ETO to the MTO to the PTO and CBI theaters. As it's service life spans 40-45 it covers a lot of historical ground.
I do believe folks thought the 410 would be more of an air to air bird then it is however.
"The fact the 410 won, speaks volumes for those who voted for it, without doing even the slightest bit of research. The Yak or Meteor would not be hangar queens like the 410."
Everybody is free to express their opinions and my opinion is that your opinion is BS. I do hope that one was just a momentary brainfart and not your actual thinking.
But good luck with Beau. I bet it will be very much what 410 was not "made" to be. :lol
-C+
I would take a Yak3 if it replaced the Yak9U.
It would have the best cockpit visibility in the game by far for one and if all else were the same, or similar, (to the Yak9U) the turn radii should be better.
There is a certain romance about the Beaufighter and it may have a role in events.......... but its effectiveness was really one borne of operations which avoided all other enemy air contact out side of the odd bomber.
The other attack ac in use in the med through out 44 was the Mossie MkIV FB yet there are not that many intruder AH events designed to make use of it in these roles (where it becomes the star)........... would we so so many more featuring the Beaufighter?
I would rather have a Pe2 or even a Tu2 given the choice..........
O'rly? :confused: Please, do elaborate...
Less obscured to the front, but I think it will be a little more obscured to the rear.
Not sure about that. Can't recall his name, but a famous French ace that flew the Yak-3 said it had excellent all around visibility.
ack-ack
It would be amusing if HTC added all yak3 variants except for the one with the 3x berezin B20s.
I'm not saying it'll be horrible like a F6F, just less of it. As you can see, it's a shorter canopy with the top of the rear fuselage also meeting a good few inches higher. I'm not sure about the space inside available to move your head around either, both seem adequate and near identicle, although the Yak-3's might be a hair more confined if you look at it from a forward, rear or top profile in some images.
For AH, it's probabley too little a difference to matter, really.
Not sure about that. Can't recall his name, but a famous French ace that flew the Yak-3 said it had excellent all around visibility.
ack ack
.......The aircraft is stable at take off and landing and can be easily flown by any pilot - something that cannot be said about the La5FN fighter.
The pilots of the 18th GIAP and Normandie Niemen mastered the Yak-3 after logging 3-5 hours. The Yak-3 gains altitude very quickly and has a wide range of speeds (200 to 600 km/h). All aerobatic manoeuvres, both in the horizontal and vertical plane, are performed excellently. the fighter offers excellent visibility and has a comfortable, well lit cockpit.
We'll get the Beau Fighter eventually i'm sure :aok
The rear canopy of the Yak3 and Yak 9T are the same..........
I dont see such a degradation in view even if the apex of the rear fuselage was an inch or so higher. All use the same armoured glass so there is no "head stock" in the way of a rear view.
I can't think of an ac in AH that would have a better alround view than would/should have a Yak3.
I'm wondering if it's safe to assume no big updates until after the New Year?
they still have time to sneak my Beau in before x-mas. :pray
I will probably get flamed for it, and thats ok I got thick skin.....
but that Beau is one ugly plane.
The Beaufort is beat it to death with a stick ugly as well... imho...
Now... for a downright SEXAY maritime patrol craft...
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/af/Bundesarchiv_Bild_146-1978-043-02,_Focke-Wulf_Fw_200_C_Condor.jpg/300px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_146-1978-043-02,_Focke-Wulf_Fw_200_C_Condor.jpg)
Of course, she's slower than Helen Keller baiting a mouse trap....
But hey, it might give Kate a self-esteem boost as she wouldn't be the slowest plane in the arena anymore... (The storch isn't a plane.)
honestly I think the Spits are about the best looking WW2 birds, while I think the P40 flying tigers are the toughest looking WW2 bird.
Hmmm... join me in the O'Club for a sexiest planes of WW2 thread my good sir...
Let's see how long until it degenerates into a flame war over how the 190 in AH isn't modeled with the proper carbon fiber durasteel it was REALLY made out of according to wikipedia...
Again I reiterate how can a WWII flight SIM/Game not include one of the most important
and widely used aircraft in WWII? The amount of fun that could be had with the Beau in the
MA is great. Getting a group to fly low (which they did) to destroy fleets, cities, and the other
targets that are present in game would be a blast!
I am still willing to escort Beaus in the Mossie. That did happen on occasion.
Yes it did! That is what we can recreate. I believe at times they were escorted by Mustangs and Spitfires (short range) also.
It would make for a fun event.
In terms of comparing it to the Mossi, it is slower, carries less ammo (but does have a variant with quad 20mm and quad .50's???), and can carry a torpedo, it really isn't all that different as an attack platform. The main issue seems to be the extreme need to have an escort fighter while the Mossi can on occasion out run many of the fighters to safety if the conditions are right (sun, moon, and stars all align).It would probably be sturdier than the mossie, somewhere between the mossie and the A20. I think later beau models carried as much 20mm ammo as the mossie, but I am not sure about that. Beaus can dogfight and like the A20 will probably be able to surprise many late war fighters that will try to slow down and turn with them. Not as good a fighters as the mossie, but then again, many fighters are not as good a fighters as the mossie. The mossie is as fast as an F4U-D on the deck as long as it has its WEP. The Beau will have a much harder time to get out of the fray.
carries less ammo (but does have a variant with quad 20mm and quad .50's???), and can carry a torpedo, it really isn't all that different as an attack platform.
I have seen numbers listed between 240 and 283 RPG for the 20mm in the Beau (belt feed models). Thats a lot more then the mossie can lug around.
I'm sure the Beau will be along in the future, after a Soviet level bomber, the Wellington, the D520, and maybe even after the Ki-100. Hard telling for sure. ;)
I know it would be nice to have for PTO scenarios, no doubt. Seeing these buzzin' around in the MA with Aussie markings would be nice too.
In terms of comparing it to the Mossi, it is slower, carries less ammo (but does have a variant with quad 20mm and quad .50's???), and can carry a torpedo, it really isn't all that different as an attack platform. The main issue seems to be the extreme need to have an escort fighter while the Mossi can on occasion out run many of the fighters to safety if the conditions are right (sun, moon, and stars all align).
Thing is though is HTC going to model the 20mm's with the drums or the belts? If they model the belts then the Beau will be nearly equal to the Mossi, or maybe even step higher in terms of ammo capacity.
What is your source for the capacity over 240 rds a gun? The only time I've seen 240 rds a gun on the Beau is when the drums were mentioned and the navigator/radioman/reloader/steward is in play.
4 * 250 = 1000 not 2000. :p
Still, a lot of Hispano ammo.
http://www.wlu.ca/lcmsds/cmh/back%20issues/CMH/volume%204/Issue%202/Brown%20-%20Indian%20days%20and%20Burmese%20Nights%20-%20Flying%20Beaufighters%20in%20Southeast%20Asia%20with%20177%20RAF%20Squadron.pdf
On page 19 he talks about using all 250 RPG.
I have seen numbers all around this in other sources. Also 1000rpg for the 303s have been mentioned too. so if these numbers are right... thats 1000 20mm rounds and 6000 303 rounds. But I need to find the old documents that show that (I am at work so not able to search easy).
Thing is though is HTC going to model the 20mm's with the drums or the belts? If they model the belts then the Beau will be nearly equal to the Mossi, or maybe even step higher in terms of ammo capacity.Mosquitoes F.II loaded 220-240 RPG when going on intruder missions. I don't know if that was used in FB.VI or if it was even possible.
Mosquitoes F.II loaded 220-240 RPG when going on intruder missions. I don't know if that was used in FB.VI or if it was even possible.Per the RAF Museum's reply to me when I asked, per the maintenance manual for the FB.Mk VI could do 150 rounds per gun or an overload of 175 rounds per gun. I forwarded that email to HTC when they added the Mossie.
(http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z460/queenslander2/Beaufighter%20Profile%20137/Profile137_Beaufighter_page_14.jpg)
We would need a Mustang I with two 50 cals and 4 30 cals.
Mosquitoes F.II loaded 220-240 RPG when going on intruder missions. I don't know if that was used in FB.VI or if it was even possible.
What is the consensus as to which version of the Beaufighter should be added? The versions I see mentioned most often are the Mk VI, Mk X and Mk.21. Mk I doesn't seem to come up often.
I'd reckon we'd need a variety - an early night-fighter Desert jobbie, a Torbeau, and a rocket-equipped strafer spring to mind.Thing is, I'd be willing to bet that when we get the Beaufighter we only get one version of it. We only had a single mark of the Mossie for nearly a decade and are still missing core versions of the Mossie. I really don't see use getting more than one Beaufighter, so the question is which makes the most sense and can any of them bye hybrided the way the I-16 is to effectively give us two or three versions all in one package?
Thing is, I'd be willing to bet that when we get the Beaufighter we only get one version of it. We only had a single mark of the Mossie for nearly a decade and are still missing core versions of the Mossie. I really don't see use getting more than one Beaufighter, so the question is which makes the most sense and can any of them bye hybrided the way the I-16 is to effectively give us two or three versions all in one package?
Pleas add the BFB so we never have to see this thread again ;)
Do we really have to get to page 67?
Until the Beau is flying in game, this thread is not long enough!He's right. Let's light this candle.
-1 not neededYou opened page 67 with that!
You opened page 67 with that!He's just being a negative ninny, probably based on the cold reception his Italian bomber/transport wish got.
If we get to page 68 and still no Beaufighter, I'll blame you and there will be hell to pay!
As long as we're wishing upon stars.. Think I could have the He219 too?Sure, but I doubt you'd be happy with it. It was a dog.
Sure, but I doubt you'd be happy with it. It was a dog.
It is also massively less significant than the Beaufighter, or numerous other aircraft missing from AH.
Wasn't the beaufighter voted out in favor of the Yak3 that is being called unfairly uber by the very people who voted it in over the beaufighter?No, Beaufighter lost the the semi-final round to the Yak-3 and the Me410. The Me410 won the final round. The Yak-3 was added without a poll.
OMG, look at the first post date on this thread:
« on: December 31, 2008, 10:35:55 PM »
5+ years later and we are still wishing.
This is about as long as it took to fix the Mossie VI, so I feel we are getting there! :)
You opened page 67 with that!*knock* *knock* *knock* :devil
If we get to page 68 and still no Beaufighter, I'll blame you and there will be hell to pay!
Ehhhh....-1For what reason would you say no to the Beaufighter? It served everywhere and will carry everything.
Holey Smoke Nrshida,
Im watching the video and looking for this thread to post it. Did you surf from the Typhoon>Blenheim youtube pages??
Thanks for finding the thread
I've read after action reports from beau pilots that gave me the impression the beau was Britain's twin engine version of our jug for damage resistance. Is the beau sans ordinance more maneuverable than the 110?
She's got about 20% larger wing area, being derived from a bomber. Need to know more than wing-loading though such as the elevator movement and control authority etcetera. Usually larger planes have more docile handling.The Beau gave a "relatively good" account of itself when dogfighting with 109s. Relatively good that means it depends on your expectations. Of course it was not a pure fighter and unlike the mossie, it could not simply leave the bandits in its wake. It was Britain's premier night fighter before the mossies took over, but that did not involve much elaborate ACMs. Light and slow it can probably keep up with many fighters in a turn, but will be easily out-climed and out run by most. An Israeli Beau got a maneuver kill on a Sea Furry during the independence war. Pretty funny that an obsolete twin engine fighter got a kill on perhaps the best prop fighter ever. The Beau pilot was a very experienced WWII veteran though.
I think especially if you watch that documentary (and assuming it's modeled realistically) it would be one of the toughest aircraft in the game. On a par or surpassing an A-20, which sort of makes sense.
I dont think that many players will make it their main ride, but it will not be a total hangar queen either. Very very useful in scenarios, serving in all theaters throughout the war, in many roles. In the MA, if it rolls out of the BH it will become the desperation fighter much like the A20 is used now when the FHs are down. For this reason, and to disable F3 view it should roll out of the FH. Decent attack plane and heavy fighter for the advanced players.
She's got about 20% larger wing area, being derived from a bomber. Need to know more than wing-loading though such as the elevator movement and control authority etcetera. Usually larger planes have more docile handling.Fair enough... You'd also need to know the structural limits. Mr. Spitty being a prime example of what can happen with low wingloading, lots of control authority, and suboptimal structural limits... Still, this all looks promising, so far. My own take: this thing will be a real threat low and slow, on the deck and in the ack.
I think especially if you watch that documentary (and assuming it's modeled realistically) it would be one of the toughest aircraft in the game. On a par or surpassing an A-20, which sort of makes sense.
Would be nice to have something Bristol-engined in the game. In the documentary you can see them refitting one of the heads with the engine still mounted. :banana:
410 should come first. Becuase it is sexier than the beuafighter
Now in all seriousness, how would it be used? Jabo? It's got 4 hispanos but carries less ammo & ords than a mossie, and is quite slower too.IIRC, it carried 1200 rounds of Hispano ammo.
IIRC, it carried 1200 rounds of Hispano ammo.
Where have you seen that figure? I've always heard they carried 60rpg (one drum), but I could be mistaken.The early versions had Hispano Mk I's that had 60 round drums, but even then it carried many drums with the navigator being expected to replace them as needed. Later versions had the belt fed Hispano Mk IIs.
If they weren't drum-fed anymore yes, more than 60rpg is to be expected. But what version would we get? A late war variant?Even the drum fed version would have more than 60rpg. The tail gun on the G4M1 was drum fed, but in AH drums aren't modeled so all the ammo is available as though on a belt. The early Beaufighter would be the same.
But what version would we get? A late war variant?If we get only one version it will probably be one of the later to make it more main arena viable. But even "late" Beau is not a 1945 plane... it pretty much reached its peak in mid war. iirc the last models were mostly about various weapon carrying capabilities and only minor improvements in performance. Earlier models will be available in the BoB.
I found these just now.
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n258/jbsaccount/beau_zps1a43f9e1.jpg)
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n258/jbsaccount/beaufi_zpsa891ad67.jpg)
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n258/jbsaccount/b1_zps190e4a81.jpg)
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n258/jbsaccount/bea2_zps9022f4d4.jpg)
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n258/jbsaccount/bismarksea_zps0a8b381c.jpg)
Now in all seriousness, how would it be used? Jabo? It's got 4 hispanos but carries less ammo & ords than a mossie, and is quite slower too.
The early versions had Hispano Mk I's that had 60 round drums, but even then it carried many drums with the navigator being expected to replace them as needed. Later versions had the belt fed Hispano Mk IIs.
Now in all seriousness, how would it be used? Jabo? It's got 4 hispanos but carries less ammo & ords than a mossie, and is quite slower too.The beau was inferior to the mossie no doubt. This is why the mossie replaced it in many roles. Consider it as the predecessor to the mossie. It will not transform the arenas, but will be a fun plane and not a total pos. I prefer having a Beau over an earlier mossie model - will be more useful in events and more diverse.
Keep in mind for Events the Beau would be heaven sent. They were all over the MTO. They were all over the PTO and CBI. They certainly were there in the ETO. You aren't going to sub the Mossie for that ride as the Mossie is a better performer. But it wasn't there until the end if at all in some cases.
Of the birds we DON'T have, the Beau is by far the one that was involved in combat the longest in the war and in the most places.
Keep in mind for Events the Beau would be heaven sent. They were all over the MTO. They were all over the PTO and CBI. They certainly were there in the ETO. You aren't going to sub the Mossie for that ride as the Mossie is a better performer. But it wasn't there until the end if at all in some cases.indeed.
Of the birds we DON'T have, the Beau is by far the one that was involved in combat the longest in the war and in the most places.
B25J comes close...
I'm still all for it, however the Tu2 seems a less fragile alternative than the Mossie...and has defensive armament.And a vastly higher loss rate than the Mossie...
I'm still all for it, however the Tu2 seems a less fragile alternative than the Mossie...and has defensive armament.
From a fighter point of view, I actually find the TuTu's to be delightfully fragile...
Extremely fragile. A snot nosed kid with a spit wad can shoot down a Tu-2.Not to mention a Beau lobbing Hispano rounds from 4 nose-mounted cannons, and a bunch of 303s or 0.5s.
does it matter? no planes have been added to this game since jan 2014
You do realize that the reason there hasn't been any major additions to the game is because HTC is working on a new version of the game.
I know of more than 4 people that would love to fly at a26. so the a26 should be added first than somewhere down the line after every other airplane has been added, the beau should be added to make you 4 guys happy :neener:.Beaufighter will likely see more use than the A-26 due to the free and high ENY nature of the Beaufighter and perked and low ENY nature of the A-26. Assuming the Beaufighter's ENY is as high or higher than the Mosquito Mk VI's.
semp
Beaufighter will likely see more use than the A-26 due to the free and high ENY nature of the Beaufighter and perked and low ENY nature of the A-26. Assuming the Beaufighter's ENY is as high or higher than the Mosquito Mk VI's.
according to reports only 4 guys will be using it.Which reports? Challenge said he knew four guys that would be using it, not that only four guys would be using it. Being intentionally obtuse is unbecoming of you.
semp
Greebo,It is not even a contest. The Whirlwind is a pure fighter while the Beau is a Frankenstein made out of previous bomber parts. The Whirlwind may be a surprisingly good fighter for its period and may even be a viable MA ride.
Which do you think will be the better furballer? The Beaufighter or the Whirlwind? Or, will they be more on the flying brick side with the Me410?
The role for the beaufighter would probably be something similar to the 110, it is too slow to survive as a pure fighter so the option left is a s a suicide JABO or in the NOE strike missions.Then someone isn't flying enough. This is a plane where you can really test your self as a pilot.
It's not a reason to not add it though, more planes is always better.
:rockWhat kind of foul magic is that ?! :uhoh
(http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd148/tjlaven/Beaufighter-promo2.jpg) (http://s225.photobucket.com/user/tjlaven/media/Beaufighter-promo2.jpg.html)
I would fly this as a pure fighter if they had he 50 cal raf version. Sexy plane tho0.5, 303... the MGs are just gravy on top of the quad nose Hispanos.
0.5, 303... the MGs are just gravy on top of the quad nose Hispanos.Well I have a slightly heavy trigger finger. In the Missin I always have mg's left over after the canons. .50's you could still lay some hate and be a force to be somewhat reckoned with
Sexy, I dont know. It belongs to the category of "so ugly that it is beautiful"...
or in this case, "beautifghter".
Perhaps its not because the Mosquito is?
Apples to oranges.
You see them often in War Thunder, so there is a market.
Why must you jump straight to reductio ad absurdum Arlo? Any chance you can articulate a better argument?
Why must you jump straight to reductio ad absurdum Arlo? Any chance you can articulate a better argument?
:rolleyes:
You are trolling, what's the point?
Feelings hurt... What planet are you on?
Your counter argument to my pulling the player usage statistics angle was just Ad Hominem about their micro transactions and "random" models.
There are enough good reasons in the entire thread. Quit trolling the bbs all day, get on facetube or twittler.. hell go out and get some fresh air Arlo.
Lashing now am I? :rolleyes:
You cant stop trolling can you.
:banana:
In any case.... the time for the Beaufighter has come.
It has? Well, if so then we'll see. :D
Watch it now or I will tie your shoes together and slap you with a dead trout. :rofl
Arlo our community votes in the latest, with more cannon and speed such as the 410. I rarely if ever see a 410 being used in game. Plainly it is a cement truck. When I do I just shoot it down. The one using it tries to HO because it can't maneuver for a six shot and plainly was a target for fighters during WWII
The Beaufighter on the other hand was used in all theaters of the war for the duration. It was used from being a night fighter even by the USAAF during the war in the Med. The US 417 Night Fighter Squadron used them. Get the book. Beaufighters in the night by Lt. Col. Braxton "Brick" Eisel - USAF.
It was more versatile then the Mossie and flew usually low level even on the deck missions and at times were escorted.
It would behoove you to get factual information before making remarks. The Mossies were great for what they did and they Beaufighters were great for what they did. The Beaufighters were tough birds that used radial instead of inline engines and when they were hit by enemy fire they were much more sturdy. Along with the four hispanos they had six .303s' or 4 .50 cals depending on model along with torpedoes and/or rockets and bombs the durability of the radial these two facts plus the fact that they were fast on the deck were a plus. Again comparing apples to oranges. The Beaus was much more versatile. And to restate....the Beau flew everywhere and was a war winning aircraft.
As Jack Webb used to say "Just the facts M'am just the facts." I'll bet you voted for the Ta 152 also LOL. The latest greatest most deadliest fastest there is. (considering 40 of them were in service and the lower then that number that actually flew in combat).
Slaps Arlo with a dead trout. :D
I'm so looking forward to flying the Beaufighter at night in Aces High. :D
I've been told, as a student of military history, I don't read enough. :old:
All kinds of daytime flying Arlo. Anti Shipping, ground attack, etc. Used all over the globe. The Mossie had issues in the CBI for example where the laminated wood suffered in the heat. Not so with the Beau :)
Forgive me. I knew all of that. But I didn't read 'Beaufighters in the night' by Lt. Col. Braxton "Brick" Eisel (not to be confused with 'Three in Thirteen : A Mosquito Night Fighter Pilot in WWII' by Roger Dunsfordand) and therefore was/am too uninformed to have ever been the dissenting vote when I was one of the dissenting votes. I have since reformed and indicated my interest in joining BOSS. :cool:
Impressive collection, none of which are in my possession nor have I checked out and read in the library. Might I ask if any of the pilots in those books later fly the Mossie and comment on how they felt about the transition?
Strains back slapping Arlo with a Beluga whale. OUCH
Leave my Beluga alone. *ouch*
Arlo I do apologize for being gruff about the subject. Now that you know the differences between the Mossie and the Beau I'm sure you will agree as I said in a previous post comparing the two was like comparing apples to oranges.
Again it is not like me to get "snooty" I do apologize. That's what happens when you get 70 years of age and become a babysitter for your grandchildren. One is in College the other three are 13 years of age and younger. I love to see them when they come, and just as glad when they leave ;)
OK.............we started this crusade what.........12 years ago?
I guess the chance of adding the Beau no longer is an option.
Pity.
Never say die. This is now tradition. :cool: :cheers:
(Also ..... Sparviero!)