Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: skillet83 on April 03, 2020, 09:07:31 PM
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Just curious, what are you folks using? Had a Logitech 3D pro, flew for years with, then it crapped. Replaced with the same new one, not even close. Have fiddled with for countless hours. Money is not a concern, just want to fly again. Need some advice or recommendations please. Skillet
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I've worn out a few X52s over the the last 18 years or so.
Logitech, now.. used to be Saitek.
Probably need to order another one soon. Thottle sensitivity gone on upper end.
:salute
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I have the Virpil T50 base for my old Thrustmaster sticks. It's expensive but I'm very happy with it. I have it center mounted with a stick extension.
https://virpil.com/en/
I also use a throttle and rudder pedals.
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I still use my old CH Products throttle, but I bought this for my stick.
https://www.amazon.com/ThrustMaster-2960720-Thrustmaster-Hotas-Warthog/dp/B00371R8P4
Very happy with it. Hall sensors so no more dirty pots, very smooth.
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The upgraded magnetoresistive CH sensors I picked up were pretty cheap, great option for worn out CH pots, makes it a whole new stick/etc.
I still think for the $ CH is a great option for this game, requiring a lot of movement and aiming due to the nature of a WW2 MMO sim.
I've been collecting hotas for 20+ years now, and have all the new VKB/Virpil stuff, several sets of each. The T50 and T50CM2 aren't bad option but you can't really use them on a desktop and need a mounting solution. The Virpil Warbrd is desktop capable and is excellent, and there are a variety of sticks available + the TM Warthog and Cougar sticks both work (the best option IMO, making an all metal stick).
IMO OP I'd go with any of the above, the VKB GF2/3 is a great option too, but is more $$ than the Warbrd option.
The TM Warthog is "ok", but I have 4 of the WH sticks and 3 throttles, and 3 of the 4 sticks have exhibited the common "sticktion" failure, and required disassembly, replacement of the "ring", and regreasing with a superior product than what they use at the TM factory. While a PITA, it isn't costly, the ring "guy" is still sending out the replacement large o-rings (more of a teflon ring), and the grease is cheap. After that, the TM gimbal is "decent", but still no Virpil or VKB gimbal. Again, the TM "stick" part of the stick is IMO the best option out there still as it's all metal, and the buttons and hats are very tough.
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I've got a slightly used t16000 (like 1 month) I'll send it to you if you want to cover shipping. (I upgraded to a VKB Gf3)
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I flew with the Logitech extreme 3D Pro for years with no issues, maybe you got a bad stick? I roll with the X56 and Logitech Rudder Peddles right now. With that being said the 3D pro is right here in case I need it. No complaints except the X56 stick is a wee bit big for me. (Ok you can bring the jokes on now)
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Back in the day I had a couple of Logitechs and liked the handle. I then moved to Thrustmaster. The ergonomics is similar so there's not much to learn about how to position your hand. The T16000m is also very accurate so I'd recommend you to take Atlau's offer!
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The CH series were good circa 2010, my last lot (2015ish) came with a "made in Mexico" sticker on and they are just not the same quality.
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I've been using CH Products my entire flight sim career. For example my Ch Pedals are 15 years old and have no problems. I'm on my second throttle in over twenty years and on my third USB Combat Stick. I've always been tempted to try something else but the experience I've had with Ch Products for over 30 years of game play has been positive. I see no reason to change.
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I've been using CH Products my entire flight sim career. For example my Ch Pedals are 15 years old and have no problems. I'm on my second throttle in over twenty years and on my third USB Combat Stick. I've always been tempted to try something else but the experience I've had with Ch Products for over 30 years of game play has been positive. I see no reason to change.
Heh.....same here
My old CH rudder pedals broke a spring awhile back and Drano sent me a nice set of pedals (Saitek I think), in which I canabalized the springs from them to fix my 1992 model year CH pedals....my CH pro throttle is from 1997 same as my CH fighterstick.....
I've tried to switch to the TM Cougar and Saitek x52pro series, but none of them work good enough, I'm just to set in my ways after almost 30 years playing these games
TC
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I have Virpil joystick and throttle with MFG rudder pedals. I had used Thrustmaster HOTAS for over 20 years prior, but now would never go back to them. The Virpil and MFG products not only feel better, but are more accurate and better made.
TShark
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Have a Virple stick also, very nice. Well made.
Seam to be a small company or they are lazy and just do not make enough product, they sell out quick
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I flew with the Logitech extreme 3D Pro for years with no issues, maybe you got a bad stick?
Same here. It's affordable, fits my hand well, and does everything I need. And it's affordable. Good bang for the buck.
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Same here. It's affordable, fits my hand well, and does everything I need. And it's affordable. Good bang for the buck.
The rudder will eventually crap out. T16000 is more precise and will last longer before the twist fails. (Maybe 6 months vs 12 in my experience)
I preferred the ergonomics of the logitech 3d.
It's a shame the warthog has the same baseas the t16000.for 250$ they really ought to have something sturdier.
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All my years flying with the same CH gear, Fighterstick, Throttle, Pedals.
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If you have the money, VKB Gunfighter 3 Stick base is fantastic, especially with an extension (a 20 cm curved extension comes with "Pro" or "Premium" options). You can swap cams and springs to get the feel you want. I have every compatible grip, which includes the Thrustmaster Warthog and Hornet grips with VKB adapters installed in place of their normal base connector.
https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product_cat=vkb-joysticks-and-rudders (https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product_cat=vkb-joysticks-and-rudders)
The most capable grip in terms of buttons, triggers, and analog axes is the Modern Combat Grip (MCG) Pro. It is styled and arranged similar to Russian fighter jets, which is great for flying the MiG-21bis, MiG-29, Su-27, and Su-33 in DCS. But I find the control arrangement a little awkward/uncomfortable. The grip itself is also a little smaller than what feels comfortable to me, but is does have a "checkered diamond" texture on the side. The vast number of hats, buttons, switches, and analog axes make this grip the best choice if you want to map as much as possible to your grip.
If you prefer the shape, feel, and arrangement of US style grips, the Space Combat Grip (SCG) Pro is a better option. It is somewhere between the Warthog and Hornet grips in control arrangement. Compared to the MCG Pro, it swaps the brake lever for a twist rudder axis, loses a couple of fire buttons, and loses the right side hat for a single button (the analog joystick hat can be swapped out with a regular hat switch or programmed to act like a hat switch), which is still able to fully support US fighter grips button maps like the Warthog and Hornet grips. The grip itself is larger and shaped more like a pistol grip with finger grooves and some texturing, which is very comfortable. I miss having the side hat available for extra button mapping, but otherwise like this grip a lot better for me than the MCG Pro when I am not flying Russian jet fighters.
For WW2 Luftwaffe fans, there is the KG-12 grip which is a reasonable facsimile for the standard shape/size grip for German fighters. But if you want a useful number of buttons and hats, this I is not the grip for you. The hat switch that looks like a fire button doesn't even have a center press function unlike all of the hats on the MCG and SCG grips. It also lacks any kind of texture unlike the real KG series grips. The flip down trigger/safety is nifty, though it doesn't have a switch to sense when it is flipped up or down (unlike the MCG Pro). I like using it when flying the Bf109 and Fw190s in VR. There is nothing better than seeing and feeling the same shape/control arrangement, especially if the stick controls are animated so you see them move when you press them.
The grips below are (from left to right): VKB SCG Premium, VKB MCG Pro, VKB F-14, TM Warthog, TM Hornet, VKB KG-12
(https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=396437.0;attach=32253)
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Long time CH user have converted to a VKB Gunfighter/MCG-Pro a year or so back. Expensive? Yeah. Not only is it the best stick I've ever had from a buttons, hats and configuration standpoint, the construction of the thing tells me it'll be the last stick I'll ever have to buy!
Still using the CH throttle. It's spiking a bit this week so it's due for another teardown. If only VKB would come out with their throttle that'd stop too. Think it'll be out in about two weeks! That was like two years ago!
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
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If you are looking for a stick make sure its' sensors are 16 bit+ and not 8 bit. The precision of the higher quality sensors makes a world of difference especially for tiny corrections/movements.
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If you are looking for a stick make sure its' sensors are 16 bit+ and not 8 bit. The precision of the higher quality sensors makes a world of difference especially for tiny corrections/movements.
TM claims the Warthog is 16 bit, but as implemented, it is really 14-bit. 14-bit is plenty of precision. If you don't use an extension, you would probably never detect the difference between 14-bit vs 16-bit. But their advertising spec is still dishonest.
The VKB Gunfighter Pro has configurable resolution that defaults to 12-bit but may be increased up to 15-bit, which allows the end user to decide on the trade-offs between precision and stability. The configuration software for the VKB is insanely capable.
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TM claims the Warthog is 16 bit, but as implemented, it is really 14-bit. 14-bit is plenty of precision. If you don't use an extension, you would probably never detect the difference between 14-bit vs 16-bit. But their advertising spec is still dishonest.
The VKB Gunfighter Pro has configurable resolution that defaults to 12-bit but may be increased up to 15-bit, which allows the end user to decide on the trade-offs between precision and stability. The configuration software for the VKB is insanely capable.
What do you run yours as? I havent changed it
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What do you run yours as? I havent changed it
When I originally got the stick, I tested it and discovered it had lower resolution than the Warthog. I then discovered from forums that it was configurable. I played with it just to see what 15-bit resolution would be like. Despite others' claims to the contrary, if I have a joy tester open, I can move the stick 1 single increment at 15-bit. To do that, you have to barely breath, but it can be done. So I left it that way.
But over time, I have constantly upgraded firmware/software, which means recalibrating the stick and creating new profiles. I am lazy. It was been working more than well enough at defaults, so I haven't spent any more time overwriting them.
In reality, you don't want "just enough" resolution, you want 2 to 4 times what you can perceive. For instance, you want the pixels in a display to be so small that you can't see them or any aliasing artifacts rather than at the smallest size you can see. So, if I wasn't lazy, I would always run 15 bit on the pitch and roll axes.
While I can see the difference on a joy tester while focusing 100% on moving the stick in the smallest possible increments, I don't know if I can perceive any difference in actual practice. When you watch videos of real fighter pilots making corrections while flying and landing, they can make rather visibly large, obvious movements which are well beyond the default 12-bit resolution. So maybe it doesn't matter all that much unless you are doing precision formation flying like the Virtual Thunderbirds. It would really depend on the sensitivity of the aircraft to small control movements and your ability to make small, but quick changes with almost no visible movement.
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CH Fighterstick with Pro Thottle & Pro Pedals.
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CH Flightstick and CH pedals. I love them and have been using CH sticks and pedals for, I think, about two decades.
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I've got all of the various Virpil grips, including the Alpha right now, and you can do the same grip swap with Virpil as you can with VKB. I don't have the WW2 VKB grip, but I've got the Kosmina pro and the MCG pro with my GF2/3s that I have. The connector VKB uses is vastly superior IMO as Virpil uses the same one TM does. That said, getting an adapter for the TM stick for VKB bases is very difficult, I have one, and I've been trying to buy more for 1.5 years now, and it's always, always out of stock. I do think that the VKB F14 stick is a bit higher quality than the Virpil one too.
Big bonus with VKB is their shipping time. For the 20 or so various Virpil pieces I've ordered, it's always been nearly a month from the time I hit "ok" to the time it arrives. I ordered my last Gunfighters from VKB on a Thursday at 10pm, and they arrived on Tuesday after the weekend. Huge difference in wait times.
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Omg a F14 stick :x :x :x
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I've got all of the various Virpil grips, including the Alpha right now, and you can do the same grip swap with Virpil as you can with VKB. I don't have the WW2 VKB grip, but I've got the Kosmina pro and the MCG pro with my GF2/3s that I have. The connector VKB uses is vastly superior IMO as Virpil uses the same one TM does. That said, getting an adapter for the TM stick for VKB bases is very difficult, I have one, and I've been trying to buy more for 1.5 years now, and it's always, always out of stock. I do think that the VKB F14 stick is a bit higher quality than the Virpil one too.
Big bonus with VKB is their shipping time. For the 20 or so various Virpil pieces I've ordered, it's always been nearly a month from the time I hit "ok" to the time it arrives. I ordered my last Gunfighters from VKB on a Thursday at 10pm, and they arrived on Tuesday after the weekend. Huge difference in wait times.
Keeping inventory available for order has been a long-time problem with VKB. It has improved dramatically since I got my first Gunfighter 2/MCG Pro combo. I use the notification system to get out of stock items. They send you an email the day that it is available online. That is how I got my TM to VKB adapters. I waited a long time. The email came. I dropped whatever I was doing and ordered two not even knowing whether or not I would be able to used the 2nd one with the Hornet grip. I had to do a little filing down of a sharp 90 degree edge into something like a 1/4-inch rounded edge, but it fit :)
It looks like right now, they have nearly everything in stock except the TM adapter. The only grip out of stock was the KG12 which is a total reversal from when it was the only grip in stock. All of the Gunfighter/grip combos appear to available with options for table top, pro short extension (10cm), and pro long extension (20cm curved). It wasn't that way too long ago.
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VKB's stock has improved massively, while Virpil's has just sort of remained the same. Always a crapshoot with Virpil with 100s of others spamming the servers when stock comes available. VKB - you're right, while the adapter has always been hard to get, recently getting a stick/base has never been faster (I check a dozen various used and new Hotas sites every day a couple times looking to snipe deals). I haven't actually tried the TM Hornet stick on the VKB bases yet, as I generally just use the VKB sticks on the VKB bases, as I have 6 different Virpil bases to fill up with my spare Warthog and Hornet TM sticks already.
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Glad to hear VKB is getting it together. They dropped the ball for a bit with their customer service and inventory. While I still like my gunfighter, I have pretty much been sticking with my virpil stuff for a while now and loving it, with the exception of the VKB rudder pedals.
Omg a F14 stick :x :x :x
No matter how hard you try puller, youll never be as cool as Maverick
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I've got a slightly used t16000 (like 1 month) I'll send it to you if you want to cover shipping. (I upgraded to a VKB Gf3)
the last new T16000 joy stick i got lasted 3 days
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the last new T16000 joy stick i got lasted 3 days
Too much thrusting?
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I wanted to post an update. First of all, thank you to all that replied. I tried to purchase a VKB Gladiator Mk.II, but they were sold out. I entered my email, they said would let me know when available. I did order a T16000, suppose to be here on Thursday. After that, I received an email this morning from VKB stating the Mk.II was now available, so, I ordered that as well. I figured both would be an upgrade from the logitech. After spending on two now, wishing I had originally just ordered the Mk.III.
Either way, I will try them both out and update this thread with my opinion. I have high hopes for the Mk.II. Thanks again to all who jumped in.
Skillet
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The gladiator mk2 isn't bad... but is lacking in buttons.
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if you can find one, Microsoft Sidewinders. gold dust. and they last 10+ years....
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<snip>
The TM Warthog is "ok", but I have 4 of the WH sticks and 3 throttles, and 3 of the 4 sticks have exhibited the common "sticktion" failure, and required disassembly, replacement of the "ring", and regreasing with a superior product than what they use at the TM factory. While a PITA, it isn't costly, the ring "guy" is still sending out the replacement large o-rings (more of a teflon ring), and the grease is cheap.
Could you please post website or mail for the "ring guy", I have that problem with one of my Warthog's.
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If you have the money, VKB Gunfighter 3 Stick base is fantastic, especially with an extension (a 20 cm curved extension comes with "Pro" or "Premium" options).
How do you have that mounted, you use the VKB mount?
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I have the Virpil T50 base for my old Thrustmaster sticks. It's expensive but I'm very happy with it. I have it center mounted with a stick extension.
https://virpil.com/en/
I also use a throttle and rudder pedals.
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Could you please post website or mail for the "ring guy", I have that problem with one of my Warthog's.
PM incoming.
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I have the Virpil T50 base for my old Thrustmaster sticks. It's expensive but I'm very happy with it. I have it center mounted with a stick extension.
https://virpil.com/en/
I also use a throttle and rudder pedals.
Second try. Was it hard to integrate the warthog stick?
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Second try. Was it hard to integrate the warthog stick?
I use the WH stick on both the Warbrd and both the T50/T50CM2 Virpil bases. Sometimes you have to remove the two little screws that hold the plug in place on the Virpil bases, in order to get the WH stick to fit fully flush with it. Virpil recommends you remove these screws to use WH sticks, but I haven't had to on my bases so far yet.
So far as software/compatibility, it works fine. The software can be a bit daunting at first, but it's come a LONG way since their first base/sticks came out, and there are tons of help videos available.
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Second try. Was it hard to integrate the warthog stick?
It's plug and play, no issues. It's the base Thrustmaster should have made for the Cougar and Warthog but never did and likely never will.
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I wanted to post an update. First of all, thank you to all that replied. I tried to purchase a VKB Gladiator Mk.II, but they were sold out. I entered my email, they said would let me know when available. I did order a T16000, suppose to be here on Thursday. After that, I received an email this morning from VKB stating the Mk.II was now available, so, I ordered that as well. I figured both would be an upgrade from the logitech. After spending on two now, wishing I had originally just ordered the Mk.III.
Either way, I will try them both out and update this thread with my opinion. I have high hopes for the Mk.II. Thanks again to all who jumped in.
Skillet
What was the lead time on delivery of the VKB stick?
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I've been able to get them sent to me on the east coast US from China in about 5 days. Usually 1-2 of those are in customs too. The trick is-- if it's in stock. It seems it's a lot easier for them to ship here than anywhere in Europe. That seems to be a cluster on the smallest of orders.
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
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I've been able to get them sent to me on the east coast US from China in about 5 days. Usually 1-2 of those are in customs too. The trick is-- if it's in stock. It seems it's a lot easier for them to ship here than anywhere in Europe. That seems to be a cluster on the smallest of orders.
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
Thanks Drano It doesn't say it's not in stock but it is letting me put it in the cart and gonna let me pay so I am assuming it is in stock.
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Been using the same Saitek x52 and pedals since day one. The stick squeaks and the pedals sometimes come off track but other than that its perfect.
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The Mk.II is now available. Last week when looking at them, said out of stock. Gave me an option to add my email, would let me know when available. I ordered the T16000, then 2 days later VKB emailed saying now available. Takes just under a week to receive, should have mine in on Tuesday.
The T16000 solved my problems with in game play anyway. I sincerely think I got a defective stick with logitech. Never had a problem in almost 20 years here with any stick. The T16000, does not feel great in my hand, takes a lot of movement to get reaction from plane. Deadband set to zero, scales are high. My old logitech was precise, not much stick movement needed for plane to react. Still looking forward to the VKB.
Skillet
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Have been using the VKB a few days now. I love the feel and the motion. Takes very little movement, very precise and fluid, does not jump around. Only problem is the actual stick itself. You guys that fly with vkb, do they have a more conventional stick? Hat switch on the top and not offset to the left side? Top rear at a 45? Are the easy to swap?
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Not sure I follow you. Which stick are you using? The only "basic" grip they have is the KG12 Luftwaffe grip. It only has a single hat on it.
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
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I am using the Gladiator Mk.II, comes with the KG12 WWII grip. Hat switch is on the left side of stick. The placement of hat switch is odd for me. I could use my thumb to work hat switch for look forward up, then bounce over to a button directly to the right for the look up feature when in a tight turn fight. With this grip, have to use a button on the base for the look up. Now my left hand is working that button and throttle. Sucks. There is a button on the very top of stick, just does not work for me.
A dang shame, this stick feels so good, flys so well.
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I have the MCG-Pro grip on the gunfighter base. So many buttons and hats you won't know what to do with em.
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
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So I had never even heard of all these different joystick/peripherals manufacturers...now you've got me oogling every product under the sun (sigh) :headscratch:
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The gladiator mkII is in my future paired with the Tomcat grip :rock :rock :rock
Thanks fed for sending me free money :aok
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The TM Warthog is "ok", but I have 4 of the WH sticks and 3 throttles, and 3 of the 4 sticks have exhibited the common "sticktion" failure, and required disassembly, replacement of the "ring", and regreasing with a superior product than what they use at the TM factory. While a PITA, it isn't costly, the ring "guy" is still sending out the replacement large o-rings (more of a teflon ring), and the grease is cheap. After that, the TM gimbal is "decent", but still no Virpil or VKB gimbal. Again, the TM "stick" part of the stick is IMO the best option out there still as it's all metal, and the buttons and hats are very tough.
Can you clarify the 'sticktion failure'? I have a warthog stick and from the factory it exhibits "Sticktion" and high string efforts. Sticktion being defined by me as require more force to get the stick moving then required to keep it moving. This makes it difficult to move smoothly during small movements. I have experimented with make shift 5" extension and have now ordered one online, but the extension is expensive. Feel it's something TM should offer at mass production prices. Everything else about the stick is fantastic, but this is a significant drawback and requires more money and time with non-production aftermarket vendors to get the feel right.
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Can you clarify the 'sticktion failure'? I have a warthog stick and from the factory it exhibits "Sticktion" and high string efforts. Sticktion being defined by me as require more force to get the stick moving then required to keep it moving. This makes it difficult to move smoothly during small movements. I have experimented with make shift 5" extension and have now ordered one online, but the extension is expensive. Feel it's something TM should offer at mass production prices. Everything else about the stick is fantastic, but this is a significant drawback and requires more money and time with non-production aftermarket vendors to get the feel right.
That definetly qualifies as sticktion IMO, your stick needing a lot of push to get out of center. "Sticktion" can be several things in the WH, from the stick not returning to center, or at least returning VERY slowly, to a general "crunchy" sort of feel and inaccuracy around the center - the poorly made gimbal from Thrustmaster can fail in several ways, and cause several issues.
Taking it apart, removing the factory grease, sanding down (gently) the molding lines especially (give everything a very, very light sanding IMO), then re grease with Nyogel 767a grease, or something similar (Nyogel 767a does work the best though). If the Oring is wonky, damaged, etc, order a replacement one from the various simmers who sell them online (I can PM you those I know if you want). Yours being newish the O ring should probably be okay, so take care of it if you disassemble and re grease and sand a bit.
Doing this can get you a couple/few years of really good Warthog movement and performance. It's so ridiculous to me that they haven't replaced their oring with the one that everyone replaces the factory one with, plus use better grease at the factory. It is what it is.
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The VKB Gunfighter base has adjustable clutches on each axis so you can adjust it to be as sticky as you might like to the point where it's actually hard to move at all. I've read helo guys like it tightened up so the stick stays in a certain position. This way you can do that if you want. I actually removed my clutches when I upgraded to the gunfighter 3 control board. I don't want any resistance at all other than the springs and cams which are super smooth.
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
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StreakEagle, I like your style. All of my VKB stuff save one Mk2/Rev B Gunfighter is at our other place, and once the Covid thing is over I'm going to assemble my entire hotas collection together for some pics. I'll take some of what I have here maybe later tonight, a bunch of our TM/CH/Virpil/VKB stuff, about 25 different pieces or so I think, not counting all the pedals - I only have one set of my VKB peds with me at our home in Sask in Central Canada.
Anyhow, I have all of the Virpil sticks with me save the Alphas, which are incoming to me shortly (I hope, some pre order guys have gotten theirs very recently). I too fly a lot of micro to mid size helos, I'm going to buy some of the new gen Blade stuff that's out now, they have 3 or 4 I went to pick up, the new 150, mCPX, the 270, and maybe the 330. The quadcopter in this pic was one of if not THE first quad that was avaialbe as a retail unit for sale. It's completely hands on flying, no assists/gyros, nothing. Still a good little unit, and now 8+ years after it came out, it's still running 100% on all original parts.
The Virpil sticks I've had great luck with too, no issues at all, and they all have their positive and negative points. So far I've been really happy with their performance. Also, all the Virpil bases have worked very well with both my Cougar and my Warthog sticks. As stated, I still feel that a Virpil Warbrd base with either a Cougar or Warthog metal stick, is the best bang for the buck, for someone wanting a very solid custom stick solution. I'll take some pics later of its base unit set up with both of these stick options, and compare its height to the VKB Gunfighter, CH Fighter/Combat sticks, TM Warthog and Cougar, and maybe some Saitek stuff.
Virpil F14/VFX, TM Hornet, TM Cougar, Virpil Delta, Virpil WarBRD/PewPewPew, TM Warthog, Virpil T50CM (first gen, I have a T50CM2 stick as well).
(https://www.mediafire.com/convkey/8031/rjtbe86izldke906g.jpg)
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That definetly qualifies as sticktion IMO, your stick needing a lot of push to get out of center. "Sticktion" can be several things in the WH, from the stick not returning to center, or at least returning VERY slowly, to a general "crunchy" sort of feel and inaccuracy around the center - the poorly made gimbal from Thrustmaster can fail in several ways, and cause several issues.
Taking it apart, removing the factory grease, sanding down (gently) the molding lines especially (give everything a very, very light sanding IMO), then re grease with Nyogel 767a grease, or something similar (Nyogel 767a does work the best though). If the Oring is wonky, damaged, etc, order a replacement one from the various simmers who sell them online (I can PM you those I know if you want). Yours being newish the O ring should probably be okay, so take care of it if you disassemble and re grease and sand a bit.
Doing this can get you a couple/few years of really good Warthog movement and performance. It's so ridiculous to me that they haven't replaced their oring with the one that everyone replaces the factory one with, plus use better grease at the factory. It is what it is.
I purchased a 10cm extension from Sahaj and that's done the trick. Lowered the effort through doubling mechanical advantage and with twice the Travel, precision and control are greatly improved. I am impressed with the quality of the Sahaj extension. It's nicely machined, and black anodized. The internal wire pumper is also nicely made. Took 30 sec to install it. Love it. It's not cheap unfortunately at 60 eros plus shipping. It comes from Poland but ships quickly. Mine arrived in 4 days. :salute
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I just received the TM warthog stick and going from an old worn out CH combat stick was quite a change. There is considerably more effort to move the TM but it is very fluid and accurate. Nice Metal stick with plenty of buttons, again big difference over the plastic feel.
I may try some dustless silicone to prevent "sticktion" though I have noticed none with a new stick
Question, having not flown a real plane, what effort was needed to move the stick in a WW2 fighter? I have heard the 109 was tiring flying in dogfights.
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If you have the money, VKB Gunfighter 3 Stick base is fantastic, especially with an extension (a 20 cm curved extension comes with "Pro" or "Premium" options). You can swap cams and springs to get the feel you want. I have every compatible grip, which includes the Thrustmaster Warthog and Hornet grips with VKB adapters installed in place of their normal base connector.
https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product_cat=vkb-joysticks-and-rudders (https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product_cat=vkb-joysticks-and-rudders)
The most capable grip in terms of buttons, triggers, and analog axes is the Modern Combat Grip (MCG) Pro. It is styled and arranged similar to Russian fighter jets, which is great for flying the MiG-21bis, MiG-29, Su-27, and Su-33 in DCS. But I find the control arrangement a little awkward/uncomfortable. The grip itself is also a little smaller than what feels comfortable to me, but is does have a "checkered diamond" texture on the side. The vast number of hats, buttons, switches, and analog axes make this grip the best choice if you want to map as much as possible to your grip.
If you prefer the shape, feel, and arrangement of US style grips, the Space Combat Grip (SCG) Pro is a better option. It is somewhere between the Warthog and Hornet grips in control arrangement. Compared to the MCG Pro, it swaps the brake lever for a twist rudder axis, loses a couple of fire buttons, and loses the right side hat for a single button (the analog joystick hat can be swapped out with a regular hat switch or programmed to act like a hat switch), which is still able to fully support US fighter grips button maps like the Warthog and Hornet grips. The grip itself is larger and shaped more like a pistol grip with finger grooves and some texturing, which is very comfortable. I miss having the side hat available for extra button mapping, but otherwise like this grip a lot better for me than the MCG Pro when I am not flying Russian jet fighters.
For WW2 Luftwaffe fans, there is the KG-12 grip which is a reasonable facsimile for the standard shape/size grip for German fighters. But if you want a useful number of buttons and hats, this I is not the grip for you. The hat switch that looks like a fire button doesn't even have a center press function unlike all of the hats on the MCG and SCG grips. It also lacks any kind of texture unlike the real KG series grips. The flip down trigger/safety is nifty, though it doesn't have a switch to sense when it is flipped up or down (unlike the MCG Pro). I like using it when flying the Bf109 and Fw190s in VR. There is nothing better than seeing and feeling the same shape/control arrangement, especially if the stick controls are animated so you see them move when you press them.
The grips below are (from left to right): VKB SCG Premium, VKB MCG Pro, VKB F-14, TM Warthog, TM Hornet, VKB KG-12
(https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=396437.0;attach=32253)
Wow, I wish I could afford those!
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I only have the one grip but that VKB is the best stick ever.
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